When should you move up a class?

[Sukistokes2]

Back in Febuary I become the proud, if slightly bemused owner of a Clydesdale horse. I was looking for a dressage mount but there you go. He didn't steer , he didn't do circles but I just felt safe and we clicked, so he came home. After the first couple of weeks I started the lessons and since then we have gone from strength to strength. I did my first intro test as soon as I could get him to trot a circle( well most of the time) Of course my scores were low but the experience was good. We have improved every time out. We have not yet established canter in the school, it's still at wall of death stage. We have worked hard and it is really starting to show, we have had one blip when he buggered off , at speed, with me , when I was mounting and I ended up landing on the bonnet of a car. Turned out saddle was not flocked right, sorted now. This Saturday just gone we had one of those days at dressage when it just goes right. We did two super intro tests and got two good scores and we won both classes. I was not even loaded before one of the mothers of the jr riders was telling me I now need to move up to prelim. (can I add at this point, most of the time the SO splits adults and Jrs , unless numbers are really low) She said that even if I had to trot the canters I should now move on. Her daughter has won the intro championship class and still rides intro, so I was a bit unsure why I should suddenly not be able to ride in the intros. The S O is happy for me to be in those classes, I do not think we are ready to ride prelim, my aim was for late spring, maybe Prelim 7. Unless I can crack the circle without becoming a red smear on the wall. I think this is just a mother wanting a better frilly for her little girl. I want to move to prelim.....better lay in and that but I don't think we are ready....?

 

[Theocat]

It is totally up to you. If you don't feel ready, stay put. Equally, if you decide you want to move up before others thing you're ready - that's your call. I'd stick with the original plan, but perhaps try a test riding session at Prelim soon? That would give you useful feedback and you might even surprise yourself!

 

[Fjord]

I'd stay at intro for a bit longer, it sounds like this woman was just jealous. If you can't canter him in the school yet then I wouldn't want to do Prelim as he isn't ready. Sounds like you are doing a fab job with him, don't rush it just because one person stuck her oar in.

 

[DressageCob]

When it comes to moving from intro to prelim, there is no need (and no benefit) to move up if you haven't established the canter. It's noone's business when you move up in any event...but you couldn't be accused of being a pot hunter if you linger in intro because you haven't established the canter.

 

[scats]

If you are doing Intros only at the moment, then I wouldn't worry what she says, although I would think that if you start regularly winning intros then you are probably ready to progress to prelim.

What frustrates me is the people who regularly win prelims, but still do an intro test as a 'warm up'.

 

[windand rain]

It is of course up to you when you move up but consistantly winning at intro would indicate that you should be schooling at prelim ready to make the move sooner than later

 

[Woolly Hat n Wellies]

It's no one else's business when you move up to Prelim. It's your horse and you know what level is right for him.

I'm still (frustratedly) doing intro, because canter is taking a long time coming on my project horse. I found we were consistently getting placed at intro at our usual venue, but our first attempt to move up was an unmitigated disaster - both of us tense and nervous, wall of death canter, no brakes, and horse left even more anxious than before, which knocked my confidence quite a bit as well. I moved on to doing one-off intros at different venues to practice working properly in new places, I sent my mum to the usual venue to do an intro test on him so he still got the experience but as part of a different pair, and I've joined one of the online dressage things, where the competition is a bit more stiff so that we can keep working towards canter at home without feeling like a pot hunter! Of course you can always go HC as well, but I wouldn't say winning at one event means you've got to change what you're doing straight away.

In your shoes I think I'd go and see if you can get similar scores or better a couple more times, and then perhaps tentatively try an intro followed by a prelim?

 

[Cowpony]

You don't ever "have" to move up a class, and you will probably find that you won't win next time, if common experience is anything to go by. I normally move up when I am consistently getting 65 - 68%. We've only ever had one 70%+, and even now we've moved up to novice we rarely win at Prelim (although we are usually (touch wood!) placed). I do get miffed with people competing at intro if they also do a novice test or higher, or if they score high 70% or even 80%+. Then it smacks of pot-hunting. But don't let anybody intimidate you into moving up if you feel you aren't ready.

 

[AandK]

It sounds to me like you are not quite ready to move up at the moment. If you cannot canter a consistant circle yet, then you're not ready for Prelim.
Enjoy the good days out competing, sometimes it all goes right but next time you may not win both classes. Work on your schooling and only move up when you both feel ready to. Ignore the "advice" of others who don't know you or your horse, especially those who are being hypocritcal!
Well done for your wins :smile3:

 

[Sukistokes2]

Thank you for your replies,

I had not thought about other venues as I had got a bit lazy going to the super venue that I enjoy, so i will do a few of those. The plan with my instructor is to think about prelim next spring, after I can contain the canter in a smaller school. Anyone who has ridden an unbalanced heavy horse knows how difficult it can be to corner at first.

I am sure our next time out will show where we are, if we maintain the scores I will be surprised.

 

[eggs]

Ignore the silly woman who was poking her nose where it wasn't needed.

Move up when you feel ready and it certainly does sound as though you need to get the canter sorted before doing a Prelim test. When you do move up I would suggest doing a long arena test as it gives you more space and time to set up.

I used to stay in my comfort zone thinking I wasn't good enough to move up but my trainer has changed my mind set and I've gone from riding Novice to Advanced Medium in three years and it isn't nearly as difficult as I thought it would be.

 

[kinnygirl1]

Sometimes venues impose a restriction on classes ie/ if you've won that level of test twice or more you are not eligible, - however, other than that its up to you when you feel ready to try the next step up. Don't let anyone force you when you're not ready. Sounds like that lady was a tad envious and wanted to give her daughter a better chance of winning tbh!

 

[Lizzie66]

She could have been trying to be encouraging in that she may have thought you looked ready to have a go at the next level up as well not instead of.

If however you feel she was definitely trying to push you to leave the way clear for her daughter and if there are no restrictions on entering both then I would suggest next time you see her you say in passing something along the lines of "I gave what you said some thought and it was very kind of you to encourage me and I think you're right I should give prelim a go as well as the intro as it will certainly give her more experience and should improve her intro even more whilst I try to establish a better canter for competing at prelim next year" say it with a huge smile . You can always compete prelim HC if you aren't allowed to do both for the experience especially if you explain that she is not really cantering yet.

 

[Orangehorse]

Sometimes venues impose a restriction on classes ie/ if you've won that level of test twice or more you are not eligible, - however, other than that its up to you when you feel ready to try the next step up. Don't let anyone force you when you're not ready. Sounds like that lady was a tad envious and wanted to give her daughter a better chance of winning tbh!

This. Since the requirement in a Prelim test is a canter, just wait until you can do a 20 metre canter, otherwise you are wasting your entry fee. Obviously if there is a reason why you want to enter and trot in the canter sessions, that is up to you, but if anyone says anything point out that your horse is large and will take time to be able to canter a 20 metre circle. One thing, don't hurry him just to get to a competition. Make haste slowly.

 

[Cortez]

You can always go Hors Concours......

 

[Sukistokes2]

Thank you,

The Show Manager happy is for me to ride the intro, up until that weekend I was only in the placing's, yes the score was getting better each time, which was what I was watching as the classes do vary. The canter is also improving every lesson, we can now nearly canter a full circuit on his good rein. I know I will get there but it will take work and in fact its the challenge that is the exciting part. I don't he has done more then cart novice riders around in a school or done trail work. He is my first really big horse, no doubt too big but that is the price for his flawless hacking. Thank you for the advice I will take it all on board and keep going, Keeping HC in mind if I think we are in danger of pot hunting.

 

[MileAMinute]

If your canter is still at 'wall of death' stage, I don't think I'd be taking him into any ridden competitions until he was more established.

 

[Sukistokes2]

If your canter is still at 'wall of death' stage, I don't think I'd be taking him into any ridden competitions until he was more established.

That's what walk and trot is for.

What's the point of training at home and not introduce ring craft.

 

[Moomin1]

That's what walk and trot is for.

What's the point of training at home and not introduce ring craft.

But you say you are still at wall of death stage in canter and at risk of being a red splat on the wall. That suggests to me that not nearly enough training has been done for you to safely do a prelim out competing. With regards Preliminary 7, I have a big horse (not a heavy horse, but heavy enough lol) and I have done preliminary 7 after having lots of training over a couple of years. The circles are the easier part..it's actually cantering in a balanced and controlled manner down the long side which can be more difficult IME.

 

[Sukistokes2]

But you say you are still at wall of death stage in canter and at risk of being a red splat on the wall. That suggests to me that not nearly enough training has been done for you to safely do a prelim out competing. With regards Preliminary 7, I have a big horse (not a heavy horse, but heavy enough lol) and I have done preliminary 7 after having lots of training over a couple of years. The circles are the easier part..it's actually cantering in a balanced and controlled manner down the long side which can be more difficult IME.

I getting the straight sides, not pretty but it's happing , I'm turning at the end, again not pretty but it's coming. Slowly!!! As we build the muscle. The transition isn't even that bad. He just lacks the strength and confidence to mantain it. He was massively under condition when I bought him and very neglected . A large hook on his tooth, just where the bit sits, has led to him going in a crooked way and means he is undeveloped on one side. Which , of course means lots of saddle issues (my favourite)

I am aiming prelim late spring, prob won't be competitive for a good while. However I am a great believer in giving it a go but I think I remain in the intros for a bit.

I am pretty sure everyone else is much better then me but we only really go for something to do and the chips

Just to say you are very right, at this point me doing canter in a small school verges on dangerous. I only canter in the school under the watchful eye of my instructor, who is an expert in this big horses.
However, canter out hacking is coming along very nicely

 

[muckypony]

Totally up to you! Dressage can be very subjective, it really depends in the judge. The next one might not like a heavy horse and therefore score you lower. If you don't feel ready, then you're not. I did my first novice test with my boy this year and by some fluke we win with a cracking score... But I'm pretty sure if I did another this weekend it wouldn't go quite so well, and I'm definitely not ready for elementary!

 

[LadySam]

She said that even if I had to trot the canters I should now move on.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!! No.

I think you're right. Mummy was trying to move the competition on. Your plan is working out nicely and you know what you're doing. Mummy can take a long walk off a short pier.

 

[blitznbobs]

Not when some nutter person tells you to, that's for sure , I like my horses working at home a level (or 2) above where they compete. So when you'd be confident to do a novice compete at prelim xx

 

[cheekywelshie]

Interesting. I've been doing prelim for years and never had a truly wonderful canter...but because he does a totally fab FWOLR and we often get 8's for that and his trot is fairly consistent , his canter not brilliant but off the leg, we've somehow ended up being half way through and came 4th out of 25 in Prelim 12 one year. I wasn't sure whether to go back to intro but after years of doing prelim i'm not sure!

 

[MileAMinute]

That's what walk and trot is for.

What's the point of training at home and not introduce ring craft.

Because, personally, I wouldn't take a horse out that I couldn't control in all paces. There is unbalanced etc, but the way you've described the canter sounds dangerous and I certainly wouldn't want to be riding in a warm up with a horse like that!

 

[nikkimariet]

What frustrates me is the people who regularly win prelims, but still do an intro test as a 'warm up'.

If it's within the rules... So be it? If you (general) don't think it is, lodge a complaint?

Life is too short OP. Do what you want and care less what others think.

 

[Sukistokes2]

Because, personally, I wouldn't take a horse out that I couldn't control in all paces. There is unbalanced etc, but the way you've described the canter sounds dangerous and I certainly wouldn't want to be riding in a warm up with a horse like that!

I have worked hard to balance the walk and trot, he is hardly dangerous, just a bit unbalanced at canter. We mainly warm up in walk, doing upwards and downward trans and then with a short trot on each rein. I am in total control in the warm up. It's an intro test, no one really canters in the warm up. In fact before my test I spent most of the time talking to my very nervous friend while we walked around. Maybe you have been out of walk and trots too long and forget how little warm up you need. Oh yeah I will add , my warm up is on the advice of my instructor, who is experience with heavy horses.
Plus intro is right at the start of the day, very few horses around and riders who are riding to improve their horses so the warm up has yet to reach the cut throat, trample the competition standards that happen later.

I have no idea what you think I'm doing in the warm up.
I've just scored 70%+ in a test and you think my horse is dangerous

 

[Sukistokes2]

Life is too short OP. Do what you want and care less what others think.

You are right, I try not to but sometime comments slip under the skin.
Over it now, just booked on to have another go.

 

[cheekywelshie]

I had this conversation with my trainer the other day and said I was nervous and she said just go to get used to the atmosphere. Anyway here is our less than perfect canter 😆https://youtu.be/ROiGou4AdAU

 

[Moomin1]

I have worked hard to balance the walk and trot, he is hardly dangerous, just a bit unbalanced at canter. We mainly warm up in walk, doing upwards and downward trans and then with a short trot on each rein. I am in total control in the warm up. It's an intro test, no one really canters in the warm up. In fact before my test I spent most of the time talking to my very nervous friend while we walked around. Maybe you have been out of walk and trots too long and forget how little warm up you need. Oh yeah I will add , my warm up is on the advice of my instructor, who is experience with heavy horses.
Plus intro is right at the start of the day, very few horses around and riders who are riding to improve their horses so the warm up has yet to reach the cut throat, trample the competition standards that happen later.

I have no idea what you think I'm doing in the warm up.
I've just scored 70%+ in a test and you think my horse is dangerous

In fairness you did say you are still at risk of being splatted against the wall in canter, and that you had been hurled onto the bonnet of a car not so long ago so I can see where some may be concerned. Sounds like you've made your mind up anyway so good luck