When to castrate and what should I expect ?

[CAYLA]

Boris was castrated at bang on 6 months.

He is now 9yrs old, has always been lovely and lean and muscly with a beautiful coat.

In hindsight, perhaps I should have left him for a few more months as he isn't as big as a lot of other GSPs I've seen but he's still well within the breed standard.

I personally don't see why you would leave them uncastrated unless used for breeding.

Its probably the size he would have always been as the rule of thumb neutering earlier leaves the growth plates open longer (which means the dog grows taller) my pointer dog is dinky and he was done at 2 yrs as got him as a horrendously scrawny dog that had been kenneled with a tiny terrier (in season) so he was desperately trying to mate and he simply could not so he was like a hat rack and stressed to bits of constantly following and trying to hump the bitch (lovely owner)

 

[MurphysMinder]

I agree, from the dogs view point is must be incredibley frustrating, Ive noticed in this part of the country anyway its the shooting fraternity that dont seem to want to neuter their dogs even if they have no intention of breeding. But as its mostly men who shoot, that may help explain it

Men do seem to have an issue with castrating their dogs. I once did a home check for a GSD rescue, and when asked if they would be prepared to have the dog neutered, the chap said yes if it was a bitch but no way would he take a dog .

 

[CAYLA]

I agree, from the dogs view point is must be incredibley frustrating, Ive noticed in this part of the country anyway its the shooting fraternity that dont seem to want to neuter their dogs even if they have no intention of breeding. But as its mostly men who shoot, that may help explain it

Here to DG and maybe some as they are GOOD working stock and want to breed, but some are just pets having a "go" who really should not be bred from but the owner feels as the dog is now a "hunting dog" they to are the best of the best and leave them entire, or like caveys example risk being called names "no balls" etc, no doubt from immature fellas thinking themsleves clever.
I would imagine as an answer to the question re the working dogs in caveys situation they are majority men (who are squeamish at the best of times) in relation to ball removal and I doubt the hard core ones live a typical (pet life) they are driven and focused and working, no time to be humping all their friends dogs and humping dogs in the park or getting het up about next doors bitch in season and are probably well trained and disciplined, the pet situations (cause the owners worry, re humping and overly sexual behaviour or worrying about straying/leaping the fence or being stolen) and kennel and hunting dogs (well again) not a every day normal pet example (big difference) no doubt they get the frustration but are contained behind bars (where safe) again they don't generally live the bog standard pet life.
I have to say I can smell an entire dog from a mile of, esp hairy ones (and they are rank) and the nads unsightly, and for me it's about the health benefits.
Funny my OH never neutered his before we met but now says it was just him being a fella and he now understands why in his own opinion now it's best for the dog. I never forced it either, he kept his dogs when we first met.

 

[CAYLA]

Men do seem to have an issue with castrating their dogs. I once did a home check for a GSD rescue, and when asked if they would be prepared to have the dog neutered, the chap said yes if it was a bitch but no way would he take a dog .

Some numb fella said to me "Im not neutering my dog" I cannot imagine myself "not getting any so the dog might feel the same" I thought erm "you numbster", you do it get it (I assume) he was in a reationship and his OH never said otherwise and she was standing there. I tried to explain it's more like his missus (won't let him have it yet his throbbing bits are still hanging there and hormones raging" like the dogs are and the dogs gets none (and it was a mongrel) (lol) you gotta laugh

 

[Alec Swan]

I agree, from the dogs view point is must be incredibley frustrating, Ive noticed in this part of the country anyway its the shooting fraternity that dont seem to want to neuter their dogs even if they have no intention of breeding. But as its mostly men who shoot, that may help explain it

From the dog's viewpoint, and having had many over the years which have all been entire, I've never had a dog display any form of sexual frustration. Similarly, with horses, if you go to Paul Fielder's dressage yard, you will see an 18 yo stallion who lives beside mares in a barn-stabled environment, he's never covered a mare, and he never will. He's a perfect gentleman.

Your last sentence was speculative and silly, unless it was intended to be t-i-c.

Men do seem to have an issue with castrating their dogs. I once did a home check for a GSD rescue, and when asked if they would be prepared to have the dog neutered, the chap said yes if it was a bitch but no way would he take a dog .

It has nothing to do with being a male. I castrate my colts, my tup lambs and bull calves. It's to do with the animal.

.......

I would imagine as an answer to the question re the working dogs in caveys situation they are majority men (who are squeamish at the best of times) in relation to ball removal and I doubt the hard core ones live a typical (pet life) they are driven and focused and working, no time to be humping all their friends dogs and humping dogs in the park or getting het up about next doors bitch in season and are probably well trained and disciplined, the pet situations (cause the owners worry, re humping and overly sexual behaviour or worrying about straying/leaping the fence or being stolen) and kennel and hunting dogs (well again) not a every day normal pet example (big difference) no doubt they get the frustration but are contained behind bars (where safe) again they don't generally live the bog standard pet life.

.......

I'd suggest that you've met some strange dogs, and some equally strange owners!

Some numb fella said to me "Im not neutering my dog" I cannot imagine myself "not getting any so the dog might feel the same" I thought erm "you numbster", you do it get it (I assume) he was in a reationship and his OH never said otherwise and she was standing there. I tried to explain it's more like his missus (won't let him have it yet his throbbing bits are still hanging there and hormones raging" like the dogs are and the dogs gets none (and it was a mongrel) (lol) you gotta laugh

Another strange post. I can assure you that not every man is as your "numbster", and that even when I was younger and my testosterone levels were at full tilt, I and many like me would never have attached any form of argument to a correlation between human sexual activity, and that of animals. There is no connection, perceived or otherwise.

My argument has been, and will always be, that castrated dogs are de-masculinated, and that isn't what I want from my dog. As you can smell an entire dog from a distance, so I can see the castrated version. He's neither male nor female, he's a eunuch, and by appearance, he stands out a mile.

Alec.

 

[CAYLA]

Im crap with multi quote, indeed I have met some very strange people and as a result there dogs can be strange too
Alec I assume you have never heard the amount of men that cringe, whinge and wince when castration is mentioned.
He (this numbster) and was the 1st to aliken the dog or his feelings of sexual urge to his (i meerely said heighten your fence or castrate) when he asked my opinion about him escaping, I mearly gave him another (view point) as his dog keeps escaping in search of bitches and he now has built a 8ft run to contain him, I can say they dog is def on the hunt for some (fruity time) when he smells bitches.

I don't think my dogs are de masculinated (otherwise I would not get folk asking to use them (but I don't disregard your opinion) I personally see alot of scrawny hormone stressy dogs (as I describe them), some folk actually neuter to put weight and condition on a dog lol. I have (even knocking at my door) to ask to use my dogs maybe it also makes bitches butcher as mine are always mistaken for dogs, maybe as they are big bitches and well muslced)
I see many entire dogs (as a rescue they mainly come in entire) and im affraid there is nothing more butch about them than mine lol.

I don't have an issue with dogs being kept entire HONESTLY (just wish the owners would control them)...I was at the beach on saturday and a little ugly mongerl was pestering mine (it was entire) and trying to hump them whilst they merrily ignored it and retrived their ball from the sea (it was me who belted the dog over the head with the ball thrower) but we need to understand why some owners are more inclined to do so, esp given the dogs living environment, a dog thats cocks its leg up a kennel is not going to be the same issue as one that cocks all over the house (one example). No doubt for some its aids helping handle the dog, again some people will never step off their own land with their dog where as others are faced with the daily park walk (again another exmaple) or many examples here (people taking dogs to stables) to mix with other and fights, humping and dogs bogging off worried them and sure enough training will help but so will castration. I personally do it for the health benefits.

Ps, of course not all men are numbsters....but he was, dont you agree?
Ps, I have alot met lots of well behaved entire dogs inc ones I have owned myself, i still prefer them chopped.

 

[Dexter]

Mine doesnt display signs of sexual frustration either. If he did, I WOULD have him neutered. The only "sexual" signs he ever showed was humping things occasionally in times of stress (moving house etc) between 6 and 14 months.

He certainly doesnt pester other peoples dogs either. He does like other dogs, because hes a very playful happy little soul, and if I didnt keep a check on him he would bother other peoples dogs, by doing "fly bys" and trying to get them to chase him

 

[CAYLA]

Mine doesnt display signs of sexual frustration either. If he did, I WOULD have him neutered. The only "sexual" signs he ever showed was humping things occasionally in times of stress (moving house etc) between 6 and 14 months.

He certainly doesnt pester other peoples dogs either. He does like other dogs, because hes a very playful happy little soul, and if I didnt keep a check on him he would bother other peoples dogs, by doing "fly bys" and trying to get them to chase him

Mine never either, if they had it would have been curbed as does any dog I take in to board that entire (they learn quick) as the one who will arrive today and I have already seen him in action so I know what to expect, but we do see all to often the (serial bonkers) no doubt owners being ignorant and thinking it's funny and acceptible, but it's frustrating for these bonkers to be allowed to bonk and also get savaged by dogs not willing to put up with it, like th bedlington i mentioned who died as a result, the staffy he tried to bonk (im loving the work bonk) was huge (minding his own business) then getting gripped and bonked. Now indeed she should have curbed this behaviour/kept in on a lead or castrated the dog.
The behaviourist for example who lets her big massive dog bonk dogs to teach them a lesson, the dogs being bonked are putting up with this and not liking it judging by their response and the dog it' self had become an aggressive over sexed beast (indeed her/owners fault).
Nothing against entire dogs but certainly for neuter and its beneifts and will always advise this when asked.

People neuter for varied reasons
People keep entire for varied reasons

 

[CAYLA]

Mine doesnt display signs of sexual frustration either. If he did, I WOULD have him neutered. The only "sexual" signs he ever showed was humping things occasionally in times of stress (moving house etc) between 6 and 14 months.

He certainly doesnt pester other peoples dogs either. He does like other dogs, because hes a very playful happy little soul, and if I didnt keep a check on him he would bother other peoples dogs, by doing "fly bys" and trying to get them to chase him

And right there a point is proven and a very sensible one "if he did he would be neutered", the arguments from some would be (you are wrong, dreadful, cruel and it's not neccessary) but clearly you would deem it to be for him and as a responsible owner

 

[Dobiegirl]

From the dog's viewpoint, and having had many over the years which have all been entire, I've never had a dog display any form of sexual frustration. Similarly, with horses, if you go to Paul Fielder's dressage yard, you will see an 18 yo stallion who lives beside mares in a barn-stabled environment, he's never covered a mare, and he never will. He's a perfect gentleman.

Your last sentence was speculative and silly, unless it was intended to be t-
i-c.

It is a man thing and is not speculative or silly, read the other posts they all confirm it, that is not to say all men think that way, now that would be silly.

Im glad you dont say anymore that neutering affects the size of a dogs head or hind quarters as I have posted many photos in the past of my neutered male Dobes with big heads and lovely muscley hind quarters.

Alex I think we will have to agree to disagree over neutering, if what you do works for you then carry on and I shall do what Ive always done and neuter my male dogs.

 

[gunnergundog]

I am not male and I no longer shoot (eyesight!). I know many females, including myself, who are happy, indeed prefer, to keep their dogs entire, so I can assure you it is not a man thing.

My males do not smell anymore than any of my other dogs.....okay, they are normally shortcoats, but have had some wires over the years. Trust me, some of my more house proud friends would have pointed it out in their unsubtle way if that had been the case.

I agree with all that Alec has posted, including being able to spot an entire male at 20 paces, and thereby being able to discriminate the neutered male. I think it is the body language and the way the dog carries itself as much as anything, although with some you can still tell from a static photograph.

 

[Alec Swan]

.......

Your last sentence was speculative and silly, unless it was intended to be t-
i-c.

It is a man thing and is not speculative or silly, read the other posts they all confirm it, that is not to say all men think that way, now that would be silly.

.......

Were I to respond with a counter claim, that those women that want the nuts off everything, are of man-hating and dubious gender, would you consider that to be speculative, silly, and someway short of the mark? Most would. It's no different really from your assertion.

There can be no question that castrating a dog, alters more than it's ability to reproduce. Does a gelding resemble a stallion? No. Does a whether sheep resemble a ram? No. Does a steer resemble a bull?, or is a castrated man dissimilar in appearance, from a man who's entire? Castrated males are de-masculinated, and providing that the owner is happy with that, then the choice is theirs. I do feel though, that those taking advice with less than a fully informed view, should understand that changes will take place, and decide for themselves whether they actually want those changes.

The early gelding of horses, generally encourages their growth, and they become more leggy. The same, for early castration can be said of dogs and cattle too, if they live long enough, very often, and in the lands where boys were traditionally converted into eunuchs, so they generally grew to above average height.

The reasons given for the castration of dogs, rarely it seems to me, stand up to close inspection. It stops their sexual urges....... very often, it doesn't. It stops them from wandering off looking for bitches....... "looking for bitches", possibly, but it doesn't stop them from wandering. Aggressive dogs....... I once had the white GSD with me for a while, which belonged to Mike Read the actor and comedian, it was possibly one of the hardest dogs I've ever known, and it had a temper that only PTS would cure. At 12 months, the vet advised that castration would have a calming influence. That worked, didn't it!! The only thing which can be guaranteed is that a cut dog can't father pups, but then neither can a dog which is managed and controlled.

Despite the fact that I have never had a male dog neutered, it's up to the individual owner, and it's their choice. They should have an informed choice.

Alec.

 

[Dexter]

And right there a point is proven and a very sensible one "if he did he would be neutered", the arguments from some would be (you are wrong, dreadful, cruel and it's not neccessary) but clearly you would deem it to be for him and as a responsible owner

Of course. His well being is my number one priority. I did a lot of reading when I got him. And its my opinion that neutering has a lot of harmful side effects, so its something I actively look to avoid. Mines a working dog, in so much that he races etc, so that extra something is useful to him. How much of that is from being entire, and how much from his breeding I probably wont ever know. I suspect if I didnt manage him as a working dog his frustration at not being mentally and physically occupied may well show in the form of trying to hump things.

I'd far rather a dog with a numpty owner incapable of training it or remaining in control had it neutered.

 

[Dobiegirl]

Alex I do think you are taking this personally, I did say not all men Im sure there are women out there who would not dream of castrating their dog either.

Ive had entire males and neutered male Dobes of different bloodlines and I much prefer the neutered dog. I can list lots of reasons for that and they have all lived in my house and interacted with my family, not in kennels. Im sure if you and I added all the dogs we have owned over the years we wouldnt come close to the number Cayla has had through her hands and I happen to agree with her.

Ive never been of the opinion that an aggressive dog automatically becomes quiet and biddable after castration, aggression in dogs is a massive subject and caused by so many different problems. I would suggest if Mike Reids dog couldnt be fixed by training then it was either genetic or a medical problem ie brain tumour.

we can only give our experiences to posters and then it is their choice, but in this day and age so many dogs are being stolen to breed, having a neutered dog does rather rule them out which is another big plus for me.

As for changing the appearance of a dog again I can only speak from experience, my latest dog was nearly 2 when he was neutered and hasnt changed a jot.

 

[Alec Swan]

Dobiegirl,

apart from the fact that I certainly haven't taken your comments at a personal level, I'll accept your last post! Those who are undecided, may well benefit from opposing views. They may come away with a change of mind, or their previous thoughts, reinforced. There's little to be gained from a trunk to tail thread.

Alec.

 

[Dexter]

I should maybe point out that I'm a girl