Where do I stand with an incident of another livery owner letting my horse loose, out of their field...?

[ycbm]

Because from what i understand the YO hasn't provided a safe environment for the horses to come in/out of the gate.

But everyone who is a livery there can clearly see that and has accepted both the gate situation and the practice of feeding horses just outside the gate. The YO would possibly be liable if a horse got out on the road but I can't see how they are liable for grown adults who choose to keep their horses at that yard. The setup is completely normal. There are many better but it's far from uncommon to have only one gate.

If you choose to keep your horse at a place like that, why should you expect to be able to sue the owner if it goes wrong?

.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Having read the thread on Facebook the livery is claiming that her contract wasn’t adhered to as the horse had several injuries that she wasn’t told about and that should have been checked over and seen to by the YO as it was in the contract her horse would be checked daily. This has apparently not happened. Just what I’ve got from reading through it. Also asked for different turnout options and was told no. Also YO called livery’s vet and told them not to recommend box rest as she wasn’t willing to let her put her now Lame horse in a stable despite that being part of the contract that boxes were available for injured/on boxRest horses.

No I am on no ones side however a Few more things came to light than is put on this very one sided thread.

 

[ester]

Oh that's why there was excitement at it having seen a vet. I couldn't see how that was such a bonus for the livery, but the YO called them.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

Oh that's why there was excitement at it having seen a vet. I couldn't see how that was such a bonus for the livery, but the YO called them.

Didn’t call them out, livery did that, just called to make sure the vet didn’t recommend boxrest as she wasn’t giving her an empty stable for the injured horse.

 

[Red-1]

I am totally shocked at how a lot of people have responded on this thread. I see it as the OP is worried for the future not looking for revenge. Like if her horse got loose on the main road and caused a car crash and somebody sued her she could be bankrupt and lose her home if she owns one. As for the yard set up being less than ideal I agree but also wondering what planet most of you live on because 90% of the yards I have viewed or liveried on have been like this even the more expensive ones. IME coralls around gateways are not normal or usual and main gate if there is one is usually permanently open except nights.

I would hope that OP has 3rd party insurance, it is cheap enough. As for the future, the offending livery has left, so I don't see that as the reason OP posted.

To me, it is all about the OP accepting the ways of the yard. OP says that they all feed at the gate, and doesn't see an issue with the one gate onto the main road. No, I would not be happy for the future. I would either ask the YO for a more secure set up, or leave.

 

[ester]

Didn’t call them out, livery did that, just called to make sure the vet didn’t recommend boxrest as she wasn’t giving her an empty stable for the injured horse.

Oh definitely don't understand why the horse getting the vet was a good thing then. Much better to not need one in the first place.

 

[WellfieldWR]

Is that the other side to this particular incident Auslander or are they discussing on FB a similar incident?

Either way I have to say OP's rather smug and self satisfied obvious delight that this livery has been thrown off with an injured horse to find stabling for is actually rather offensive and speaks volumes to me of the attitudes on this particular yard to new liveries.

OP was asking for advice on what could be a potential claim against the lady if something HAD happened.

Your comment is unhelpful and judgemental and certainly being overlooked..

 

[WellfieldWR]

I am totally shocked at how a lot of people have responded on this thread. I see it as the OP is worried for the future not looking for revenge. Like if her horse got loose on the main road and caused a car crash and somebody sued her she could be bankrupt and lose her home if she owns one. As for the yard set up being less than ideal I agree but also wondering what planet most of you live on because 90% of the yards I have viewed or liveried on have been like this even the more expensive ones. IME coralls around gateways are not normal or usual and main gate if there is one is usually permanently open except nights.

Thank you for your supportive answer and reading and answering my original question at hand - I''ve had to disregard most of these answers unfortunately! - Thought usually the Horse and Hound forum would provide some better clarity than a facebook group or somesuch, but apparently its just as bad, so will probably deleted my post now Its been up for a while and most people seem to prefer to bash the yard, as oppose to answer the actual question!

Just an FYI for people, no I'm not money grabbing, or looking to claim unnecessarily, but please do imagine how you would feel if your horse was let loose and not caught in a timely manner and returned to his field when the front gate was open! For anyone who has seen the FB post, you will very easily be able to see the holes in the other livery's story she has fabricated about the place/YO....

 

[Mrs Jingle]

OP was asking for advice on what could be a potential claim against the lady if something HAD happened.

Your comment is unhelpful and judgemental and certainly being overlooked..

Oh do get over yourself dear - if you feel you need to delete a post because the majority of responses question your validity and motives for posting in the first place then maybe posting on forums is not for you?

 

[Red-1]

Thank you for your supportive answer and reading and answering my original question at hand - I''ve had to disregard most of these answers unfortunately! - Thought usually the Horse and Hound forum would provide some better clarity than a facebook group or somesuch, but apparently its just as bad, so will probably deleted my post now Its been up for a while and most people seem to prefer to bash the yard, as oppose to answer the actual question!

Just an FYI for people, no I'm not money grabbing, or looking to claim unnecessarily, but please do imagine how you would feel if your horse was let loose and not caught in a timely manner and returned to his field when the front gate was open! For anyone who has seen the FB post, you will very easily be able to see the holes in the other livery's story she has fabricated about the place/YO....

I'm sorry, but the posts here can't be deleted, as it is not Facebook. I think this is why usually there are more considered answers, because they are here forever.

My comment stands, I would not accept the current set up and would be either asking for the 'habit' of feeding close to other horses to stop, plus having a more secure set-up, or finding another yard.

I too would be peeved at the other livery, and would say more about that, but as she has already left, that is a moot point.

I did also presume you have insurance, at least 3rd party. If your horse crashed into something like a person or a Ferrari, it could prove rather expensive to you.

 

[WellfieldWR]

Oh do get over yourself dear - if you feel you need to delete a post because the majority of responses question your validity and motives for posting in the first place then maybe posting on forums is not for you?

I don't believe there is anything to 'get over' - the original questions was regarding if there would be any grounds for me to claim IF something had happened - Unfortunately as is the way of the equestrian world, people love to judge and dig in deeper - The question have easily been answered without judgement or finger pointing.
Admin are seeking to remove the post now as i have received some further perspectives on the situation and think it would be unnecessary for the post to continue snowballing in an irrelevant direction

 

[DabDab]

Thank you for your supportive answer and reading and answering my original question at hand - I''ve had to disregard most of these answers unfortunately! - Thought usually the Horse and Hound forum would provide some better clarity than a facebook group or somesuch, but apparently its just as bad, so will probably deleted my post now Its been up for a while and most people seem to prefer to bash the yard, as oppose to answer the actual question!

Just an FYI for people, no I'm not money grabbing, or looking to claim unnecessarily, but please do imagine how you would feel if your horse was let loose and not caught in a timely manner and returned to his field when the front gate was open! For anyone who has seen the FB post, you will very easily be able to see the holes in the other livery's story she has fabricated about the place/YO....

You haven't 'had' to disregard anything, you have chosen to, because the vast majority of answers don't agree with your viewpoint, based purely on your own OP.

People have answered you question. You are unlikely to have a viable claim against this livery.

 

[ester]

errm the post wasn't snowballing, it was quiet since Friday, you brought it back up again.

 

[DabDab]

I don't believe there is anything to 'get over' - the original questions was regarding if there would be any grounds for me to claim IF something had happened - Unfortunately as is the way of the equestrian world, people love to judge and dig in deeper - The question have easily been answered without judgement or finger pointing.
Admin are seeking to remove the post now as i have received some further perspectives on the situation and think it would be unnecessary for the post to continue snowballing in an irrelevant direction

Because your initial post about the other livery wasnt judgemental at all....

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Hiya!

There has been a recent incident at my yard, whereby a new livery, of about 4 days, came to feed her horse outside the field (This is common practice at our place, remove the horse from field, feed, return to field.)
I would like to know what/if I would have been able to claim against her, if something awful were to have happened!

When getting her horse in, a few in the herd followed to the gate (The herd consist of 8 horses - 4 Irish draught types, 2 cobs and 2 Thoroughbred types)
When she got to the gate (which opens inwards to the field) she was nervous of the other horses and has stated she felt threatened by them and they were bullying her horse (This isn't usual behaviour of our bunch..)
When she opened the gate to get hers in, she says that she tried to only let hers through, but he was nervous from the attention of the others and the others had clocked her feed bowl waiting and were rowdy and pushy.

She claims that one of the bigger horses pulled the gate open and out of her control.
Then the horses all pushed through the opening and ran up the driveway - She managed to keep hold of her horse though.

Witnesses from other fields state that instead of acting straight away and putting her horse back and trying to start catching them, she called the YO, but continued to remove her horse's rug and let him nibble from his bowl - Taking time to put her rug away in the back of her car etc.

When her horse had finished his supplement feed, she put him back and went after the others with a lead rope and as the YO arrived from the house.

My horse was unfortunately in this group that had been let out - In one direction, the driveway they ran up leads to a heavy plant and lorry park, the other way leads to a busy road...

Fortunately, my horse and the others were returned and checked, by our yard owner upon her arrival from the house - No injuries or issues.

Unfortunately, this woman has proven fairly incompetent on a number of occasions, such as feeding treats to her horse in the field, struggling with latching the electric fencing correctly and this incident.
She was unapologetic for the incident, didn't consider our horses' welfare and in fact blamed the YO for 'lying' to her that the herd is a chilled out friendly bunch!
She was more concerned that the YO didn't pay her more attention and apologise to her for the incident!

I am of the opinion that this is nothing to do with the YO - The field gates are secure and safe. Metal gate, with two levels of electric fencing and a chain latch.
The usual behaviours of the horses is not of this nature - I've never had an issue exiting/entering the field and been here 2 years. So, we suspect she has been feeding treats regularly, which attracts them to her, as well as having the 'new boy' in the herd.

Additionally, my opinion is, and I am angry, that my horse was put at risk, by her incompetence (and to a degree, negligence) in leading her horse from the pasture safely.
She states she was nervous and felt threatened by the other horses, as she doesn't know them fully, yet had walked into the field in trainers, no hat or gloves, nor a whip to help her out of any potential trouble - When I first came to the yard, I was wary for a similar reason, of not knowing the boys, so initially caught my horse in all my PPE and walk at the edge of field, so I could get out if anything did happen... but it never has done!

As a result of this incident, she was asked to leave the next day, either returning to her old yard, or finding an alternative within 30-days - Our yard owner had zero-tolerance for the incident occurring, especially due to the livery's reaction and slow response to aid the situation and this never occurring before.
She has since left earlier, as her horse and another were playing/bickering and hers got a kicked to the knee, which meant she had to move swiftly to a yard with stables available for box-rest.

Thank you for any comments

You specifically asked about suing the livery.

What you actually need (like every other horse owner) is good 3rd party cover.

 

[gallopingby]

Wellfield are you bored? The response was you should have third party insurance, and the answer to the original question was YOU wouldn’t be able to claim. However l hope by now the security arrangements have been reviewed and there is now a closed gate into the yard. That means you have to drive to an entrance, open a gate, go through and close it behind you. Simple really! ? Oh and for the avoidance of doubt anyone who doesn’t close the gate could be asked to leave?

 

[JFTDWS]

errm the post wasn't snowballing, it was quiet since Friday, you brought it back up again.

Let's not let the facts get in the way of a good toddleresque foot-stamping flounce tantrum!

 

[Auslander]

OP - in a nutshell - any claim you had would be against the owner of the yard, for failing to risk assess/provide a safe environment for people to handle their horses, including bringing in/turning out. If it was my yard that this had happened on, I would fully expect any claim to be against me, not one of my liveries, who is not insured to handle other peoples horses, and who would not have been in the situation if there had been a pen/double gate setup.

 

[zandp]

But everyone who is a livery there can clearly see that and has accepted both the gate situation and the practice of feeding horses just outside the gate. The YO would possibly be liable if a horse got out on the road but I can't see how they are liable for grown adults who choose to keep their horses at that yard. The setup is completely normal. There are many better but it's far from uncommon to have only one gate.

If you choose to keep your horse at a place like that, why should you expect to be able to sue the owner if it goes wrong?

.

I wouldn't. As the rest of my post did say.

 

[Apercrumbie]

Well this is precisely why we always have electric corrals before gates. All the horses here are well-mannered and trained (well...as in the case of the shetland as well-mannered as one could expect...) but very occasionally they can decide to try it on and this has prevented a good few accidents. Horses aren't machines and you need to plan for these eventualities.

OP I understand that you are worried about your horse and what could have happened, but I also feel for this livery. I've been around horses my whole life and am a very competent handler, but I would struggle with 8 large horses crowding me and being bolshy around a gate. I don't think you would be able to claim against her in the circumstances. I suggest you move on as best you can and consider asking the YO about a corral.