Which bit for strong horse?

Having been through pretty much every biting option with my very strong young mare we have now found amazing success with a myler combination short shank. She has a history of tanking off when excited and we now have brakes and steering for the very first time and she loves the bit. Hope you have success in your search but I would recommend the myler, it was recommended to me.
 
This is a good explanation : http://horsebitbank.com/myler-combination-bit.shtml

They are a really kind bit and work on 5 separate areas, my mare was shocking in every bit, she absolutely loves her myler and goes really well in it. She has tried to tank off with me when she's got excited and very gentle application has stopped her in her tracks! It was recommended to me by her previous owner who now has a 17.1 shire who bolts and it stops him and he's now attentive and responsive in the school (as is my mare).

It takes a bit of fiddling to get it adjusted initially (I had to buy shorted cheek pieces as the side of the bit is longer than standard bits) and I put it on her three times on the ground and got her used to the feel of it before riding in it and she was an instantly different horse.

This is the bit: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/2713...1=ICEP3.0.0-L&ff12=67&ff13=80&ff14=108&ff19=0

This is a really good price (I won my on ebay auction for £28), the only thing I found was the rawhide noseband rubbed her nose (as she has a dent in her nose from headcollar cutting into her nose as a baby before I got her!!!!). You can buy a leather noseband replacement (lady on ebay sells them for £16) but I actually cut the rawhide off and replaced it with a curved piece of dense foam and she much prefers it, I also have a cord on mine as they use in the US (they don't seem to use them over here) which just helps keep the noseband in the right place. If you need anymore info of pics of mine fitted then just shout. There also really good vids on you tube by the myler brothers who go through all the fitting of it.
 
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If she likes the mouthpiece with the copper peanut I'd try to find others with the same mouthpiece - you should find at the very least a 3/4 ring gag with a lozenge (maybe not a copper one though) and probably others too. I'm big believer that the horse chooses the mouth piece and the rider chooses the cheeks. Trial and error is the only way though unfortunately.

It took 18 months to find a bit (well 3 in fact) my boy and I were both happy with. He has a mullen mouth hanging cheek for dressage, a waterford hanging cheek for hacking and a waterford 3 ring gag (with two reins) for exciting stuff. The mouth pieces he's happy and comfortable with, the cheek pieces give me the requisite amount of control!

If she's good in the snaffle for schooling I'd keep her in that and just use the other bit when you need it. It's an excuse for another bridle if nothing else!
 
annagain said:
If she likes the mouthpiece with the copper peanut I'd try to find others with the same mouthpiece - you should find at the very least a 3/4 ring gag with a lozenge (maybe not a copper one though) and probably others too. I'm big believer that the horse chooses the mouth piece and the rider chooses the cheeks. Trial and error is the only way though unfortunately.

It took 18 months to find a bit (well 3 in fact) my boy and I were both happy with. He has a mullen mouth hanging cheek for dressage, a waterford hanging cheek for hacking and a waterford 3 ring gag (with two reins) for exciting stuff. The mouth pieces he's happy and comfortable with, the cheek pieces give me the requisite amount of control!

If she's good in the snaffle for schooling I'd keep her in that and just use the other bit when you need it. It's an excuse for another bridle if nothing else!
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That is a really good way of looking at it! I think you are right, trial and error is the key so I am going to have a fiddle about with the martingale, then the flash, then I may try removing the noseband, all with her copper peanut bit and see how we go. If none of these work I will then try another bit!

Wish me luck! lol
 
I really like using a Pelham with my strong fell, he responds brilliantly to it and its not harsh at all since I ride with light hands all the time other than when hes strong
 
Slightlyconfused said:
Have you thought about a kineton? It's helped my friends horse have brakes, she can now go out in a group in the kineton and a gag, or snaffle, and stop.
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I was going to suggest this as well. It worked really well for mine. The loops of the noseband round the bit will also stop the bit being pulled through her mouth if you are fighting her spinning.
 
I second the myler combination bits, I have one For my pony and it stopped all the head tossing, chomping backing off etc. the only other thing that worked, and was surprisingly effective was a Dr. Cook bitless bridle, which works on the whole head, without causing unnecessary pain in the mouth, which tends to occur when applying that much pressure in such a sensitive area when a horse won't stop. Might be worth a try
 
I managed to dig out my old martingale last night so tonight I am going to give that a go with her full cheek snaffle with copper peanut. If that works then I will be very pleased!!
 
Martingale shouldn't do anything to help other than allow your reins to work better when the head is raised above the neck.
The martingale on this pic is a little short, but you can see how the rider's reins work to pull down the head and so still has some control/can regain control. Without the martingale, any rein pressure would increase the "head up" behaviour. So worth keeping it on so that you have a little more control when she tosses her head.

http://www.compassionatehorsetraining.com/runningmartingale.jpg
 
If you have tried all theses different bits and combo's with no improvement then I'd be looking elsewhere...
I'd probably try a different vet/dentist first for her teeth and take it from there...check saddle again and any possible pain elsewhere.
Otherwise...how about bitless?
 
Kylara, I agree I am going to keep it on as I think to a certain extent it will help!!

Amymay, it was a running martingale.

_HP_ said:
If you have tried all theses different bits and combo's with no improvement then I'd be looking elsewhere...
I'd probably try a different vet/dentist first for her teeth and take it from there...check saddle again and any possible pain elsewhere.
Otherwise...how about bitless?
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Honestly, its not pain related! I know this horse inside out and also really trust the specialists that work on her. She is going better than ever at the minute, just with lack of brakes!! Like I said, she isn't nasty or malicious at all, she is just really enjoying her work and almost forgets I am on top which is why I have always been reluctant to up her bit, but now I think I have to admit defeat.
I think its more a case of finding the right combination which as of yet I haven't seemed to have found!
 
I Haven't read all the replies, so apologies if someones already suggested this, but I've found a vulcanite/rubber pelham used with 2 reins very helpful. This will help keep her head carriage lower -practice this in walk, nice and calmly, and her neck and poll nice and soft. I know a lot of horses can end up 'leaning' with pelhams, but I've had a lot of success with them. If you get control of her neck, softly, I'm sure this would help your dilemma. Good luck!
Market Harboroughs'can be quite a useful piece of kit if used with right bit, and if you're really skilful with your hands , draw reins..
 
_HP_ said:
If you have tried all theses different bits and combo's with no improvement then I'd be looking elsewhere...
I'd probably try a different vet/dentist first for her teeth and take it from there...check saddle again and any possible pain elsewhere.
Otherwise...how about bitless?
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I was just going to mention bitless? It sounds like you have tried so many bits without success, would this be worth a try? I think so tack shops rent out bitless bridles for you to try. It could just be as simple as she doesnt like the bit. No amount of martigales etc will change that I can see that making her more upset.

I had alot of success with a full cheek waterford and a well fitted grackle with my uber strong Irish but I have seen that hasnt worked for you.
 
I have umm'd and ahh'd with the idea of bitless but have never really felt brave enough to give it a go! lol As like you say she doesn't seem to be accepting of anything really. I think I need to keep a list and see how each option goes. I am currently moving house so lessons are a no go at the moment due to funds but I am going to try and start having a lesson a month over the winter and see if that helps too!
 
She sounds similar to my horse,he is now good but strong in the school in a snaffle,he likes drops or grakles, he's a swine for niggling & argueing if he doesn't get on with a bit or noseband, I've experimented with loads of differant combos over the years(& I had regular lessons & the horse regularly has back checked,teeth done etc). I used to use a universal which he got on well with, he's now always in a pelham for hacking & fast work,I use it with 2 reins. He's very good at gradually speeding up & then not wanting to stop & if he's feeling in a spooky mood has a great line in putting his head really high to spin, the pelham really helps better than anything else with both these problems plus he seems to love it far more than any other bit!
 
I can take bitless or leave it but an acquaintance has had considerable success with a mare that she previously had to stop by running her into things - no joke. She said that the idea of having no bit in scared her at first but that she wouldn't actually be less able to stop than in a bit since she couldn't stop, period... and she has brakes now. She uses a Dr Cook but, again, there are plenty to chose from with different actions. Otherwise I would also suggest looking at the myler combination.
 
0310Star said:
I can see a lot of conflicting info about 1 or 2 reins with a dutch gag now I am looking into them.... What do people suggest?
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I ride with 1 rein on my Dutch Gag (I know, I'm naughty!) with a grackle for my mare out hunting, as she's very strong. She also has a martingale attachment on her breastplate which I use. The Dutch Gag on the 3rd rein to me would be good for your mare.

Maybe going noseband-less is an option? Then she can't fight with the noseband? :)
 
I personally find in some horses hackamores do more of a job than a strong bit. I rode a very strong mare a few weeks ago who had been in a snaffle but been changed to a gag. I almost had less control than when I rode her in a snaffle as she was fighting against the bit. I rode another strong horse later on who was in a hackamore and actually had way more control! She responded to half halts in some of very bolty canters. However i have ridden many a horse in a gag who have been way more controllable.. I suggest either a hackamore or a gag
 
Ihave just taken on a new client who has an Irish draught x that's built like a tank. Imwould say that he was verging in dangerous to canter in the school,he would grab the but and run out of control like a bulldozer until he hit a wall. Not nice. He was in a waterford and it was doing nothing.
We have since tried him in a magic bit, I taught the rider in it for half an hour and the difference was immediate. Two weeks later she had a lesson having ridden him in it several times and the out old control bulldozer is now cantering balanced, steady twenty metre circles and stops when asked.
 
I agree with you, schooling is important in this situation rather than so much as going to a stronger bit. I would try a kimberwick, using the top slot for schooling and bottom slot for hacks. I would turn her in circles (meaning pulling with one rein and the other rein totally loose, like a one rein stop) whenever she gets too strong or ignores you. I would also back her every time a few steps for the same reason as the schooling. Hope this helps a little bit at least. Cheers

QUOTE=0310Star;12628557]Thank you :) fingers crossed the martingale will help, I think schooling properly again is going to be a big step too as she has mostly been hacked for the last couple years and although I try and school on hacks I think being in the school may benefit her a bit too[/QUOTE]
 
Another vote for the myler combination, am using one with a micklem bridle ( combination fitted above the drop noseband) and a sheepskin sleeve on the combination noseband. Horse still forwards but polite. Sheepskin noseband stops him putting his head up as he can't see if he does! was teaching a young girl with a horse that refused to stop. we pratcied 100's of halts , just go a few steps and then halt, few more then halt, reward and just keep repeating. Build up to trot and halt from trot, two or three steps only at first so that you always achieve it. keep going for half to threequarters of an hour or until you can halt from trot going towards the gate and canter at any point in the school. then do the same the next day. we changed the bolting pony , he just charged straight back to his box into a nice pony that could be ridden cross country in a snaffle in four lessons. he just had not been taught to stop when asked. have used this method with show jumpers that rush, bolters and rearers. they just seem to misbehave because they have not learnt to behave. Be very consistent and you probably will not need to change much but if the horse does have a damaged mouth then a combination bit would make sense. said pony was 15 so don't worry if he is older. It does work.
 
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