Which Calmer? (again??)

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Alter ego

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Hi,

My horse gets genuinely nervous of anything different. This makes her bolshy and clingy at the same time.

Despite training her and lots of in hand works she still needs more help :(
When she gets nervous you can see her heart pounding.

The problem is which calmer would help her?

Any thoughts or experiences of using calmers, good and bad would be appreciated.
 
Mine goes great on naf magic. Been much braver and lot less stressed since on it. Basically the magnesium that does that. Only really works if the horse has a magnesium deficiency. So can be a bit of trial and error which calmer works but this one works for us. ;)
 
I am currently using Lincoln Valerian Cordial... a lot of people I know use magnesium but apparently it only has a real benefit if your horse is low on magnesium... I've been using Valerian for two weeks now and there does appear to be a difference... I have found that when ridden my girl seems to focus more and keep focusing, don't get me wrong, she wasn't a loon or anything but as she was getting fitter she seems to have a shorter attention span and was a bit spooky... seems quite chilled now tho :)
 
Feedmark Steady up.. one scoop = 4gms magnesium, it has other herbs and stuff in in as well as the magnesium.
I found my boy's anxiety levelled out at 2 scoops, he weighs 450kg
Almost all soil and forage in the UK is relatively low in magnesium.
There is some cheap MgO on Ebay, but I prefer to use a balanced reliable product when there is a definite problem, more expensive, but one vet call per annum is about the same as the annual dosage.
 
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Alter ego said:
Hi,

My horse gets genuinely nervous of anything different. This makes her bolshy and clingy at the same time.

Despite training her and lots of in hand works she still needs more help :(
When she gets nervous you can see her heart pounding.

The problem is which calmer would help her?

Any thoughts or experiences of using calmers, good and bad would be appreciated.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you also need to work up a routine where she is more confident, try a few lessons using grid poles and avoid over long sessions in school. Assuming you can do it, take her out with something bombproof and let her walk out on a relaxed rein. I have had to do a lot of singing out on hacks, also talking to my boy....... a bit embarrasing at times, but who cares!
If you have lessons, you will be concentrating on taking instruction and will be less uptight, this will have a knock on effect on the mare.
 
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Calmers are a minefield! If you are already feeding magnesium then none of the mag. based calmers will help. Valerian is very good - get the James Hart VCalm as it is better than the Lincoln one, more concentrated.

The Equifeast website is worth looking at for their Relax Me calmer. Their research has shown that by feeding more magnesium to a horse that is not deficient can actually make it worse in some cases where a horse is in fact calcium deficient. They do calmers with and without mag.

It makes interesting reading and their helpline is very good.
 
Miss L Toe said:
Sounds like you also need to work up a routine where she is more confident, try a few lessons using grid poles and avoid over long sessions in school. Assuming you can do it, take her out with something bombproof and let her walk out on a relaxed rein. I have had to do a lot of singing out on hacks, also talking to my boy....... a bit embarrasing at times, but who cares!
If you have lessons, you will be concentrating on taking instruction and will be less uptight, this will have a knock on effect on the mare.
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Thanks for reminding me - singing is always a good one! I often get my clients doing this too :p

When schooling it's the unexpected that gets to her, so I can be at the end of a session and have an issue (we are training at AM - dressage). That and her heart going wild is why I think is genuine fright.
 
Tammytoo said:
Calmers are a minefield! If you are already feeding magnesium then none of the mag. based calmers will help. Valerian is very good - get the James Hart VCalm as it is better than the Lincoln one, more concentrated.

The Equifeast website is worth looking at for their Relax Me calmer. Their research has shown that by feeding more magnesium to a horse that is not deficient can actually make it worse in some cases where a horse is in fact calcium deficient. They do calmers with and without mag.

It makes interesting reading and their helpline is very good.
Click to expand...

Thank you - I will have a read and give Equifeast a call to see if they can suggest something for us.
 
Alter ego said:
Thanks for reminding me - singing is always a good one! I often get my clients doing this too :p

When schooling it's the unexpected that gets to her, so I can be at the end of a session and have an issue (we are training at AM - dressage). That and her heart going wild is why I think is genuine fright.
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Pretty much my symptoms, which lessened gradually over time, but he throws a wobbly if we school him too long, I always have three poles, or five poles on the ground in the middle of the school, just to bring him back to concentration, if he seems to be "thinking", otherwise he sort of "builds up pressure"
Part of the heart racing could be because he is not relaxed, he knows things are going to explode, and this will mean "something awful" will happen.
 
Miss L Toe said:
Pretty much my symptoms, which lessened gradually over time, but he throws a wobbly if we school him too long, I always have three poles, or five poles on the ground in the middle of the school, just to bring him back to concentration, if he seems to be "thinking", otherwise he sort of "builds up pressure"
Part of the heart racing could be because he is not relaxed, he knows things are going to explode, and this will mean "something awful" will happen.
Click to expand...

She is a very switched on horse and loves her work.

I find with her that once something is over then it's done and dusted and straight back to work - which does make things easier ;)

Poles are a great idea though
 
Alter ego said:
Thank you Kikke.

Sorry should have said, the grazing is low in magnesium and salt.

I give her Equine America Magnitude Powder to help with this.
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I order pure mag ox, last time I bought it (last week) I got it from here; http://www.naturalhorsesupplies.co.uk/p/product/0802207584-Magnesium+Oxide+(Heavy)+900g++%A31299/

My shetland gets two pinches a day and the bigger boys half a teaspoon (all split between two feeds). I'll feed less when the grazing picks up though. A 900g bag will last the three of them 6 months or more and costs less than a tenner.
 
My daughter had huge success with her VERY nappy, spinning, rearing mare by putting her on a calmer called Klop, a year one this mare (the only one I would shoot) is off the Klop and hacking out alone and in company quite happy, we visited over the summer and everything about the mare is calmer, she now lives in the New Forest and meets all sorts on a daily basis
 
kellybee said:
I order pure mag ox, last time I bought it (last week) I got it from here; http://www.naturalhorsesupplies.co.uk/p/product/0802207584-Magnesium+Oxide+(Heavy)+900g++%A31299/

My shetland gets two pinches a day and the bigger boys half a teaspoon (all split between two feeds). I'll feed less when the grazing picks up though. A 900g bag will last the three of them 6 months or more and costs less than a tenner.
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This is not enough, from my google research [yes, I know] the average 500kg horse needs 6gms magnesium per day, which is 12gms of MgO.
Barefoot horses may get a lot more, 2-3 times as much. Excess should be excreted, but one has to take care they don't refuse to eat larger amounts.
THe cheapest I have seen is currently on Ebay from http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/130579791391?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
 
I feed magox, but the heavy one as I think it is less fluffy and makes less mess. Also I can use a smaller scoop of it and get the same amount and it has no taste so my fussy horse doesn't mind! This is the cheapest I can find now http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121038128134?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1562.l2649
Normally get from natural horse supplies but will give this a go when I run out in a few weeks. I don't think the dose on the equine America stuff is actually high enough, but correct me if I'm wrong
 
Fat_Pony said:
I don't think the dose on the equine America stuff is actually high enough, but correct me if I'm wrong
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This is REALLY interesting.

However the EA version contains calcium too, which seems to be the alternative reason for extreme behaviour.

These articles discusses it:
http://www.horsehero.com/editorial?feat=83626
http://calinnova.wordpress.com/2011/07/07/horse-hound-look-at-calcium-calmers/

It's a mine field :eek::confused::eek:

I've also been given the idea of feeding Hops.

Thanks everyone for your ideas and thoughts - please keep them coming :)
 
Hi,

A friend and I have had great success with Dodson & Horrell Placid:

http://www.dodsonandhorrell.com/our-feeds/herbs-supplements/behave/placid.html

Although we both use the liquid version from our local feed merchant and at £15ish for a months supply - we reckon it's great value when it comes to our health, safety and sanity!!

My boy becomes overly reactive, spooky and bolshy this time of year and Placid appears to level him out so that he can assess situations instead of just throwing all his toys out of the pram.

My friends mare is 7 and has been a real handful since she got her at 8 months old. Just leading her to/from the field can result in the mare doing airs above the ground, bucking, barging and generally being a nightmare. Any small change in her environment (such as a haylage bale left on the tractor) would send her into orbit. Winter stabling induced kicking the walls and general stressful behaviour.
All I can say is, what an amazing change since going onto Placid 8 weeks ago. This mare is now the most relaxed I have ever known her - she will stand and wait without rearing, she considers situations instead of just reacting (badly!!) and, to date, has not tried to muller my friend into the hereafter.

My friend won't mind in the slightest what I've written about her girl as she fully acknowledges all her idiosyncrasies - she's just relieved to find something that finally works for her!

Good luck with finding a product that works!
 
I use cool, calm and collected by equifeast. I think it has made a difference as my horse will actually concentrate in the school now! They do a version which is magnesium free if your feed already contains a good dose of magnesium.
 
My advice would be to cut all sugar and mollasses from feed. Ensure that you are feeding low starch and protein. Diet can have a massive effect on behaviour. Plenty of turnout. A lavender essential oil soaked rag is handy for offering in hand at times of stress - it has a calming effect and can also be sadlely hung in the stable so your horse has the option to sniff it.

I used FirstHorse - RelaxMe calmer. It's not the cheapest, but it works and it's not magnesium based.

Good luck.
 
I use magnesium oxide (calmag) as its the basis for most calmers, huge difference in my horses behaviour within 10 days (30g a day) and every time i take him off it he turns horrible - cant lead him, box walks, cant stand still etc. its the best thing I ever found, also pretty cheap... about £4 a kilo so cheaper than most calmers.
 
YasandCrystal said:
My advice would be to cut all sugar and mollasses from feed. Ensure that you are feeding low starch and protein. Diet can have a massive effect on behaviour. Plenty of turnout. A lavender essential oil soaked rag is handy for offering in hand at times of stress - it has a calming effect and can also be sadlely hung in the stable so your horse has the option to sniff it.

I used FirstHorse - RelaxMe calmer. It's not the cheapest, but it works and it's not magnesium based.

Good luck.
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Thanks for the input. She has NO sugar in her diet, and low starch/protein, so nothing I can cut from her diet unfortunately :(
 
TheBigPony said:
I use cool, calm and collected by equifeast. I think it has made a difference as my horse will actually concentrate in the school now! They do a version which is magnesium free if your feed already contains a good dose of magnesium.
Click to expand...

Thank you, this is actually what I put her on.

Things seem to be going well so far :cool:
 
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