Why are horseboxs so expensive??

[Firewell]

This is something I have always pondered.

It's very rare that you see old cars about, because they have all died. My 1990 ford escort died in 2001.

Cars depreciate quickly but even then you can get a brand new car for 6k, vans, 4x4 ect yes some are expensive but 2/3k can buy a tidy safe 2nd hand car. We got a 9yr old Jeep, full service history, 70k miles, top of the range model for 3.5k.

So how come a lorry with a 9yr old
van chassis, same milage, service history and a shiney horse box conversion on the back costs 15-20k???

How come a 1990 horsebox with a recent respray is for sale for 6-7k???

It's common to see these horseboxes for sale that are ANCIENT, a good 20 years old for sale for so much money? Even a horrendous rust bucket commands 2-3k. Also a lot of the chassis used to be commercial vehicles before they were converted, I know both the lorries we have had have been and both came with very high milage.

I just find it totally mind boggling how much money a vehicle commands just because it's a horsebox!

My dad made my mums horsebox when I was younger. They got a ford chassis for next to nothing and my dad built the horse box himself with his friend. It was very nice, safe, and just how my mum wanted it. All the horses travelled well in it. It didn't cost that much to build at all!

My dads a bit old to be making horseboxs now but for the same 6-7k for an ancient 20yr old 3.5tonner I'd rather have my safe tidy jeep and a decent 2nd hand
trailer!

When we went looking for a
horsebox with 5k honestly we saw loads and most of them were frankly dangerous. The horse part looked very smart on the back but when my dad climbed underneath the old chassis were rusting. People would umm and ahhh and say 'well you can't expect a decent lorry for less than 10k'.

Is there actually a good reason as to why we are happy to pay so much for 22year old rusty vehicles?? It just seems totally rediculous to me. The word 'horse' just seems to add ££££ to any price tag!

 

[trottingon]

Because people with horse are so rich of course! Silly you! )))

 

[Firewell]

Lol!! Doh of course! I forgot that

 

[becca1305]

I think people just try and recoup their money more on horseboxes as they are so expensive to buy in the first place. I would hazard a good bet the lorry in your first example cost a lot more new than a jeep did. Also lorries are designed to do a lot more miles than cars and from my experience with horsebox builders up to 100,000 miles is considered relatively low mileage for lorries as they are designed to do around 500,000 before the engine will likely need looking at/replacing. Thats the general info I got from a range of manufacturers anyway although that was in relation to post2000 lorries so prior built ones it may not be the same for.
I dont agree with the prices people try and command for rust buckets I think it gets to a point where you should just accept it needs to be scrapped rather than fobbing it onto someone naive who doesnt realise how much it will cost to fix up to be safe.

I also have big issues with the old 3.5tonners people sell which dont have enough payload for even a small horse and arent safe for them. I totally agree with a lower budget you are usually safer with a car and trailer option for your horse . Someone on here bought a 3.5ton and converted it themselves, it looked brilliant and had a good payload I believe so was a fantastic solution if you have time and some expertise . I dont think it was really cheap to do from what I remember but certainly a huge saving on buying similar from a manufacturer!

However personally in general Im glad for the lower depreciation rates on lorries having had a new one built to spec its reassuring that it doesnt go quite the same alarming way in depreciation once its left the builder's yard as cars do from show rooms!

 

[perfect11s]

because of the cost to build and the fact they arnt bought in vast numbers by companys and written off against tax like vans ,lorrys and cars etc , and so the rules of supply and demand apply!! plenty of people can afford £6k , not as many £12K even fewer 24k very few that can afford a new one and so on, so there are plenty of cheap cars around and not many horseboxes ..

 

[Firewell]

The thing is no. Our Jeep was 40k brand new but a new 3.5t is less.
And my dad built ours so they don't have to cost that much to build and there's a guy in CR who built a really beautiful 3.5t and it was around 7k all in if I remember rightly.
Obviously most people don't have time, knowledge, materials ect to build the box but horseboxes shouldn't cost that much. Especially the old ones, in fact half of them shouldn't even be on the road (sitting for 12hrs broken down on the M4 in one means I can speak from experience!).
Honestly how can a 22 year old lorry complete with rust, an exhaust held on by string and a ramp that's bent be worth more than a 3yr old car??
I can understand the cost of the new ones (even then how often is a new horsebox on a brand new chassis?) but not the older ones.

 

[becca1305]

Oh sorry thought you were comparing jeep to 7.5ton! I agree most 3.5tons are drastically overpriced but I think thats become worse since the law came into effect making it that most people can only drive a 3.5ton and cant even tow a trailer without a test.

Re the new prices I got a very good deal but did see plenty I thought were overpriced though really its the VAT thats the killer on them particularly now its even worse at 20%. its rare to build on new lorry chassis as they are so expensive and because they are expected to do much more mileage than a car so its usually more cost effective buying one with under 100k mileage instead for a new build providing a good mechanic checks it out.

I completely agree with the rustbuckets the prices are ridiculous. I wonder how much they are worth as scrap though? Id much rather have a decent 2nd hand car and trailer than a rusty lorry I couldnt trust.

 

[PeterNatt]

I would suggest that most people that buy a horse box buy on impulse and are taken in by the shiny paint job and smart living accomodation. Purchasers very rarely take a good look at the vehicle from the underside or get a commercial vehicle mechanic to thoroughly check it out. The vast majority of horseboxes spend most there time sitting around doing nothing apart from rotting. Commercial vehicle chassis cabs can be bought relatively cheaply but the expensive part is servicing/refurbishing them and then building the container which is labour intensive as they are mostly all one off's.
Maintaining horseboxes is not cheap so always ask to see the invoices for work done on the vehicle over the last 5 years. That will give you an indication of how well it has been looked after.

 

[JennBags]

As with most things, it's about supply and demand; and something is only "worth" what someone is prepared to pay for it.

As becca1305 said, most 3.5t became overpriced once the new driving laws came into force. So a lot of people want a 3.5t but the supply isn't there, so therefore it becomes more expensive.

You say how building one only costs £7k - but you're not factoring in someone's time and expertise to build it properly. If you added the cost of time that your dad and the guy in CR put into building their boxes, at a good mechanic's rate - what are you talking about - 100 hours @ £35/hr? That's on top of the actual cost of the parts and materials, and is a substantial part of the cost of the vehicle.

 

[cattysmith]

They're dreadfully overpriced purely for the fact it's such a small market and suppliers and sellers have the upper hand!

 

[kerilli]

i think you're mostly forgetting the most important thing... it has to carry HORSES fgs. Now, when they're being docile big teddy bears all you need is a good strong ramp and floor (not always a given, but that's another story), the strength of the walls doesn't matter unless they start acting up, but IF they decide to play nasty you need that box to be rock-solid, really strong, but also made of reasonably lightweight materials... having seen one section of a Pro's HGV box that had been completely kicked out by an eventer who 'lost it' in transit (and very nearly ended up falling out onto the road once he'd kicked out the panel behind him) i have renewed respect for those who build really good solid strong boxes that are safe to take horses in.
many shouldn't be on the road, i agree. and some manufacturers are an embarrassment to the industry. but you only find that out when you've handed over your £££s and driven away...

 

[perfect11s]

Oh sorry thought you were comparing jeep to 7.5ton! I agree most 3.5tons are drastically overpriced but I think thats become worse since the law came into effect making it that most people can only drive a 3.5ton and cant even tow a trailer without a test.

Re the new prices I got a very good deal but did see plenty I thought were overpriced though really its the VAT thats the killer on them particularly now its even worse at 20%. its rare to build on new lorry chassis as they are so expensive and because they are expected to do much more mileage than a car so its usually more cost effective buying one with under 100k mileage instead for a new build providing a good mechanic checks it out.

I completely agree with the rustbuckets the prices are ridiculous. I wonder how much they are worth as scrap though? Id much rather have a decent 2nd hand car and trailer than a rusty lorry I couldnt trust.

I think people are going to have a nasty shock with alot of the 3.5 ton boxes as what they are built on is just a cheap tradesmans van with a limited lifespan if rust doesnt get the better of them then the tiny engine, gearboxes and running gear and french electrics failing will... I would say 10 ish years and your on borrowed time.... there wont be many about as old as a 7.5ton ....

 

[becca1305]

I think Id probably agree with that. I certainly wouldnt expect a 3.5tonner to be able to do more mileage than a car. Just realised I should have clarified I mean 7.5ton and over re buying a used chassis and longer (up to 500k average) life expectancy

 

[FairyLights]

because the word BOX is preceeded by HORSE. and everyone knows how rich us horsey people are ;-)

 

[Jesstickle]

Because people are snobs about using a trailer and would rather have even the most clapped out old lorry over a new 4x4 and ifor (or bateson or equitrek, whichever you prefer)?

I think mostly because not many are sold and it's an economy of sales thing. Either way I'm glad I can tow and just have a car and trailer.

 

[5horses2dogsandacat]

I have a lovely 6.5ton. The horse area is a little small but will happily take a larger one and a small one or just 2 normal sized. It has a good chassis, little rust and good solid floors. I did try and sell it, everyone was so impressed with it however the size of the horse area let it down each time.
Anyway I paid 3.6k in Aug for it I think I over paid a little.. its F reg and what I like about the older models is it can be fiddled with, I don't have to pay for mechanic to plug it into a computer and charge me £70 an hour. its a layland daf so parts are easy to come by and I'm pleased with it, only reason behind selling is I can't really afford to do my hgv so I can drive it.

I think horse lorrys hold their value because the older ones that are still around are well made, that's why they are still here. Obviously caution with flooring ect.. but u have to also look at how much machine you are getting for your money. the new 3.5tons are good however there are a lot of poorly made ones around, and I can not abide the ones without an emergency exit for the horse.. accident waiting to happen. But it is like others have said if everyone wants one then prices can go up. Tbh its cheaper in the long run to buy an older but well maintained larger lorry and take an hgv test.

 

[EquestrianFairy]

Well I paid £1000 for my horsebox and spent another £1000 having it all revamped. It's an R-Reg 3.5t ford. I'm really pleased it as far as expense goes.. However I have seen ones not even half as nice sell for £4-6k! I would rather spend the money on one and get it done myself.

 

[Super_Kat]

Because people are snobs about using a trailer

Or perhaps some people just dislike trailers.

 

[Jesstickle]

Or perhaps some people just dislike trailers.

I'd take a decent trailer over a horrible flimsy 3.5t lorry any day! I'm probably a weirdo

 

[perfect11s]

Because people are snobs about using a trailer and would rather have even the most clapped out old lorry over a new 4x4 and ifor (or bateson or equitrek, whichever you prefer)?

I think mostly because not many are sold and it's an economy of sales thing. Either way I'm glad I can tow and just have a car and trailer.

No I dont think someone with an old lorry is being a Snob some folk like to show off but no one is going to be impresed by most peoples lorrys esp when you look at the old crates that limp to most shows they are just a practical way of getting horses tack and family to events...

 

[Magicmillbrook]

No I dont think someone with an old lorry is being a Snob some folk like to show off but no one is going to be impresed by most peoples lorrys esp when you look at the old crates that limp to most shows they are just a practical way of getting horses tack and family to events...

For me its cheaper having a lorry and small car than driving around in a vehicle capable of towing a trailer. I do lot of miles for work and found that with my old disco the travel allowance wasnt covering the fuel costs. Road tax and insurance is surprisingly cheap compared to a 4x4. My old Dodge doesnt have any snob factor, quite the opposite in fact, but she's strong, sound and reliable - if sloooow.

 

[monkeybum13]

I'd take a decent trailer over a horrible flimsy 3.5t lorry any day! I'm probably a weirdo

Same, plus my horse wouldn't fit in some 3.5t

 

[dieseldog]

Because people are snobs about using a trailer and would rather have even the most clapped out old lorry over a new 4x4 and ifor (or bateson or equitrek, whichever you prefer)?

I think mostly because not many are sold and it's an economy of sales thing. Either way I'm glad I can tow and just have a car and trailer.

Most people probably go for a 3.5t over a trailer as they don't need to take another driving test to use it.


Also a 7.5t (if you can drive it) is a lot cheaper than a new 4x4 and trailer, and you aren't stuck having to drive the 4x4 to work.

 

[Jesstickle]

Most people probably go for a 3.5t over a trailer as they don't need to take another driving test to use it.


Also a 7.5t (if you can drive it) is a lot cheaper than a new 4x4 and trailer, and you aren't stuck having to drive the 4x4 to work.

You aren't stuck driving a 4x4 to work if you have one. If you'd have a lorry and a small car why not have a big car and a small car?

I can go out right now and buy a 54 plate Sorrento with 60,000 miles on the clock for under 5k. How can you buy a lorry for less than that?

And I understand the appeal of not having to take a test. I did have to and it was a pain but worth it to be able to transport both my horses or take a friend with me which is another huge downside to 3.5t ownership!

 

[Super_Kat]

I'd take a decent trailer over a horrible flimsy 3.5t lorry any day! I'm probably a weirdo

Would avoid a 3.5t as well, where are you supposed to put the cocktail cabinet and beer fridge!?!? 7.5t all the way, more payload = more cider

 

[Jesstickle]

Would avoid a 3.5t as well, where are you supposed to put the cocktail cabinet and beer fridge!?!? 7.5t all the way, more payload = more cider

Even better, get an HGV, take out some partitions and install a full on bar

If I could do that I'd understand the appeal of lorries a lot more!

 

[Super_Kat]

Even better, get an HGV, take out some partitions and install a full on bar

If I could do that I'd understand the appeal of lorries a lot more!

I've even got optics to attach to my cocktail cabinet so it's almost there!

 

[ROG]

On the subject of licences -
Any LGV licence is subject to always having a current medical but a B+E licence once got is there for life

Those with post 1997 car licences will already have B+E provisional so no theory tests etc

 

[dieseldog]

You aren't stuck driving a 4x4 to work if you have one. If you'd have a lorry and a small car why not have a big car and a small car?

I can go out right now and buy a 54 plate Sorrento with 60,000 miles on the clock for under 5k. How can you buy a lorry for less than that?

And I understand the appeal of not having to take a test. I did have to and it was a pain but worth it to be able to transport both my horses or take a friend with me which is another huge downside to 3.5t ownership!

You said New 4x4 and trailer in your original post which would be a good £25K of anyone's money. I bought a 6 year old Iveco 7.5t for £5K. Can you actually tow 2 big horses with a Sorrento - they look a bit flimsy. Even with your £5K Sorrento you have forgotten the cost of the trailer - another £3k? Now you are up to £8k. Why on earth are people snobs if they own a lorry?

 

[Abbeygale]

Or there's the people who have done their HGV test, and would have to do another test in order to tow a trailer. By the time you've done a trailer test, brought a 4x4 and trailer, I think I'd be better off sticking to my lorry!

I'm just thinking about selling my lorry and buying a newer smaller lorry next year - but it will be more than a 3.5t if I can help it