Why are horses so mollycoddled here?!

Oh my I also own a pampered horse, don't do tit bits accept to catch as he can be a b*****d sometimes but don't do it if his pals are nearby. Rugs - yup - I do rug when cold, windy AND wet, only as he sometimes gets stiff in his loins/back. Vet? As little as poss, lameness if I am not sure I get farrier to agree with my diagnosis, if he isn't sure then and only then do I get out vet. My first aid kit comprises of salt, cotton wool, Gold Label wonder gel (heals everything) and purple spray. Having been brought up in Pony Club in the late 70s/80s I do remember the old new Zealand's and jute rugs!! I don't gave rude horses, I can go I to the stable without been pushed out of the way, I scratch my horse in his itchy places on my say so instead of tit bits. In some people's eyes I poss do pamper him but I have only 1 horse and want him to last for a long time as I don't have the moneyor time for another horse if he goes wrong. :)
 
jsr said:
On our yard only 1 person puts her horses in if it's raining, and 'mollycoddles' them. Must be because I live in a very rural farming area where animals are treated as animals, because we certainly don't have a majority of spoilt horses, we have fit healthy working animals who enjoy as much of a 'natural' life as possible. Interestingly enough the only person who used to 'mollycoddle' his was the P2P trainer...Irish fella he was. ;)

And yes KatPT I dislike your photos, I'm strongly against circus tricks for any animals and those are way too close to the bone for me..no matter how they are achieved. (And don't get stroppy people, she posted the pictures so an honest reply is to be expected.)
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I believe Harvey Smith used to teach his show-jumpers tricks. He said it kept their minds agile. And I don't think they come more old school than Harvey.
 
I agree with your post to a point!

However there is no reason why you can't do both!!

I spoil my horse in that I give him a treat after being ridden if he has been good. He gets the best rugs I can afford. A nice stable with rubber matting and a deep shavings bed. The reason for me is that the yard I am at has no shelter from either the wind or the rain, it is very open so is nothing like a horses natural environment. If it is very hot I bring him in out of the sun because of the lack of shade.
Does that mean I treat him like my child, possibly yes but there are reasons too. I had kids but I didn't smother them!! I like the looking after and pampering to a point, sometimes it would be easier if he was on a yard with shelter so I didn't have to bother so much. But I like everything else about the yard

BUT he is never allowed to be disrespectful, he would never dream of stepping into my space, mug me for a treat, pull while being led etc etc

I NEVER have to walk to fetch him from field, he comes to me NO TREATS. he comes because I call him. If I am poo picking he doesn't annoy me or get in my space but he is only ever a few yards away.

When ridden he is the most polite gentle lad. Yes like most on here I have had to work at this part as he did used to be unsure and have the odd buck and threaten to rear when he got scared but he would dream of doing it now. He is the least spooky horse on a very large yard and the youngest, yet the only one you could put a novice on in the school. He still gets too excited hacking/jumping to let a novice ride but that is work in progress
 
firewell said:
My horse is definitly mollycoddled and I couldn't give a toss what people think.

He is out 24/7 at the moment, fed no cereals just fibre and is worked twice a day or once properly.

However he is in a l/w today as it's peeing it down and I'll put a m/w on tonight if it's still raining.

I spend pretty much every penny on him and he has the best of everything. He has dentists twice a year, back treatments every 3 months, shod every 5/6 weeks, saddle checks, new saddle.

I'm meticulous with EVERYTHING. From his numnah being clean, comfy and pulled up to the prolite comfy pad on his headpiece of his bridle. I'm meticulous in the way he's worked, always warming up and down properly never riding fast on deep or hard ground.

He gleams, I groom him every day all over, he is booted up every time I ride. If he has a little scab I wash it and treat it straight away.

I also give him cuddles and lots of affection (no treats though!!). He is not allowed to misbehave but I like him to have a personality and be free to be his own person. If he moves when I'm grooming him yes I'll push him back, if he goes to bite I elbow him but if he has fun picking his bucket up in his teeth and waving it around I laugh at him and tell him he's clever.

If he's wet I towel him off and put a dry rug on. His stable is cleaner than my room!

I've seen horses that have had their personalitys squashed out of them so they are like robots and I don't want my horse to be like that! I've also seen horses that tread all over their owners.

I know I spoil my horse but he looks amazing and feels amazing to ride, he's so happy and confident and I feel we have a partnership of mutual respect.

I think people should just look
after their horses the way they want. It doesn't really bother me if someone feeds their horse a polo or puts one too many rugs on it, the only thing I don't like is when ignorance causes a horse pain or confusion but I don't think anyone likes to see that.
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This! This is exactly how I feel and how I treat my horse . . . except that he's not out 24/7 . . . why? Because our grazing is too good and he is already slightly porky from being on box rest.

Live and let live people. Just because I don't look after my horse the same way you look after yours doesn't make either one of us wrong or right. There sure seem to be alot of zealots on this board sometimes.

P
 
Seafarer said:
I believe Harvey Smith used to teach his show-jumpers tricks. He said it kept their minds agile. And I don't think they come more old school than Harvey.
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That's very nice but as I said I personally don't like tricks. Don't teach my dogs to do tricks and I certainly wouldn't have my horse doing them. I don't go to circus's, 'natural' horse displays, those god awful things where horses have people standing on them and stupid men pretending to be wizards or anything of the like..get my drift? I like my horse to ride and enjoy the countryside with end of.
 
go to a commercial racing yard, the amount of horses there that nip, bite, kick is incredibly large, these horses are not mollycoddled by any means in terms of lifestyle, it is just the way some things are accepted and some aren't, they get a slap and still do it next time. If your horses are so well behaved enjoy them and ignore others!
 
ellie_e said:
The worse which drives me to madness is foot scraping!! ARGHHHHH people just let their horses stand outside their stables and do it, wo betide mine if they do it! One girl at our yard her horse will do it constantly, she does nothing!!!! Madness!!!
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Maybe she has found that if the horse is doing it for attention then any attention, even telling him off, encourages him to do it more? Sometimes all you can do with attention-seeking behaviour like foot scraping and door-kicking is to ignore it until they realise it's not getting them any attention - running straight to them every time they do it, even if it is to give them a smack and tell them off, still reinforces the idea that it is a good way to get your attention.
 
Totally agree with the post.

My vet even commented to me how she likes coming out to see me as there is always a real reason for it, and not a tiny scratch.
 
SusieT said:
go to a commercial racing yard, the amount of horses there that nip, bite, kick is incredibly large, these horses are not mollycoddled by any means in terms of lifestyle, it is just the way some things are accepted and some aren't, they get a slap and still do it next time. If your horses are so well behaved enjoy them and ignore others!
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I worked in jump yards and our horses were nearly all well behaved, a few were a bit quirky, but we did not live in fear of our lives. Some horse threaten to bite or kick if they have been "teased" and some came with ideas of their own importance, and were soon put straight, but not by thrashing them, just handled firmly and [usually] gently and in a consistent manner, They are intelligent enough to know if their handler is in fear of them, so in this case will be given a more experienced groom, usually a good quiet "talking to" , will let them relax.
Some TBs will "try" to bite, but they are tied up when saddled, so it is just a threat, nothing serious. They are often ticklish so you have to be careful, but this is not them being aggressive, it is just their way.
 
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Daisydo - I am one of these mad people who rug a Shetland. She is clipped in summer for sweetitch and clipped and rugged in winter as she works hard as a driving pony. Why do people always assume that Shetlands are pets and don't do any work?
 
ok has anyone thought why horses roll? And in Mud?? Anyone?? FLIES /WIND etc


Out 24/7 aclimatised and very happy and natural as can be! Saves me lots of money as he is exercising himself too and no mucking out of stables...if he needs anything I will spend but I want him to be a horse. He has a lovely personality(dont they all).

....CUDDLES I mean come on CUDDLES thats for human benefit.

My horse does NOT love me.....I love him. I know I am FOOD! Thats the bottom line!
Yes he may like me and see me as non threatening human but when will people realise they are cuddling them for their own benefit!! urghhh despair with some of these posts...........WE ARE THE WALKING FEED BUCKET! DOGS are exactly the same!
 
Well, one of my horses came straight from a racing yard, and he had attitude in the stable when I first bought him. He's fine now and accepts and trusts people to enter his stable.
The moment I bought my warmblood was the moment he stopped getting treats out of peoples hand, as he was nippy. He's great now, and when he's done well, he gets verbal praise and a pat.

My horses aren't deprived of carrots or apples or mints, but they go into their dinner bowls :)
 
well my big girl came over from ireland and obviously missed out on all the manners lessons:rolleyes: when her previous owner went to try her half the yard turned out to see the 'show'! if you tried to go in the stable when she was eating she'd damn near take your face off! She has been put straight in her ways since coming to England so i don't think you can claim that only horse cared for the irish way are well mannered and all english horses mollycoddled as IME with the big girl it's the opposite!
That said i beleive in treating horses like horses, mine live out 24/7, big girl gets rugged from about half way through winter but none of the others do, they rarely get treats and in the last 5 years there has only been 1 non routine vet visit!
I don't like seeing horses over fed and over rugged, other than that if people want to treat them like kids then that's their choice
 
After reading this thread i guess we can all agree than everyone has different ideas on how to look after their horses!!!! As long as they are well cared for ( everyone has different ideas on this) they have clean water, are not starving and have shelter whether you rug/call the vet etc is all peoples opinions, some people are more confident in dealing with cuts etc than others if it puts the owners mind at rest to call a vet then let them its their money and aslong as the pony isnt being left with its leg hanging off does it matter? Different countries deal with animals in different ways our ISH when first over from Ireland wouldnt let you go near his one ear....then found out that they twitch their ears in Ireland where generally i guess we twitch the top lip/nose. I guess we are all different and it makes an interesting read seeing how everyone deals with their horses.
 
I agree with ellie_e you can really see everyones different opinions on this thread. Everyone thinks the way they treat their horses is the right way and as long as everyones individual horse is happy who gives a damn?

Some may think I mollycoddle my horses, they get treats when they are good, they get rugs on when I feel they need them, they get groomed twice a day, they get fussed when im around them, I ring the vet if Im worried about them even if its just to ask advice.

Others may think im cruel because they do not live out, they get fed hay and feed 2-3 times a day and only turned out for a few hours, they get worked 6 days a week, I will slap them if they misbehave.

My horses are happy and well mannered, they look amazing and work hard for me :) thats good enough for me
 
Little Squirrel said:
So the moral of my story is this, because I deprive my horses of polo's, don't buy them every gadget under the sun or wrap them in cotton wool do I love my horses any less than those who treat their horses like human children?
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Maybe if more children were treated like your horses we'd have fewer 'problem' children too! (ducks for cover....)
 
Well you would probably consider my horses mollycoddled which they probably are BUT they are both polite, rideable, do not bite, kick etc, load without a fuss, don't mug you for treats, lead quietly beside you and so on.

Whilst I whole heartedly agree with your post, I don't think you should tar us all with the same brush and I manage my horses the way I do because that's what works for me. I most definitely have learned over the years not to call the vet at the slightest pin prick but on the other hand have also learned and developed a greater sense of awaress as to why some horses behave the way they do, which in most cases is due to a discomfort somewhere.

In my opinion there is a difference between mollycoddling a horse and spoiling it and I think what you are talking about are spoilt horses...........and people!
 
Lurky McLurker said:
Maybe she has found that if the horse is doing it for attention then any attention, even telling him off, encourages him to do it more? Sometimes all you can do with attention-seeking behaviour like foot scraping and door-kicking is to ignore it until they realise it's not getting them any attention - running straight to them every time they do it, even if it is to give them a smack and tell them off, still reinforces the idea that it is a good way to get your attention.
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This^^ believe it or not, some horses actually like seeing you run up to them to tell them off. Negative attention is better in their mind than no attention. Just like kids. My mare constantly bangs her stable door if I am around and talking to someone else or doing something with another horse. She would even deliberately try to get her foot caught on something such as the kick bolt or a hay net so that I would panic and come running! The only thing that stopped her was a spray with the hose. She stops immediately if I so much as pick up the hose. Problem is, she knows when I don't have it in my hand too. Door banging and foot scraping are one of the hardest attention seeking behaviours to cure.
 
Flying in and out and don't have time to read all posts, but will be back later as the bit I did see made for interesting reading :D

I don't see a problem with people mollycoddling their horses, so long as the horse is polite, does as is asked as and when it is asked, and is not a danger to themselves or the people and animals around it.

Does it matter if they have fifty different rugs ;):p, so long as they are used responsibly, as in suited to the horse and the conditions. Note: I have an excessive amount of rugs for my horses, and considering they live out nekked most of the time, most of the time my pretty and lovely rugs are living on stable partitions; it don't matter though, the horses are happy, the rugs are happy, and I am happy (though D thinks I should seek professional help :eek::rolleyes::cool::D).

Does it matter if one feeds treats? We do and our horses wouldn't dream of biting or nipping us, and to be honest, if they did they'd wish they hadn't bothered. We don't treat other people's horses unless we are told we can; we don't treat youngsters that aren't ours at all.

Cuddles? Our horses lean into us when we cuddle, just a bit, just relaxed, and don't pull back, no ears back, no tension, so I'm guessing they enjoy it as much as we do :D

Despite being cuddled and fed treats and being rugged sometimes, our horses are, on the whole, polite, courteous, and a pleasure to handle. On the other hand, one of them has to have the boundaries kept clear and if the handler doesn't, then she will take the upper hand and become a pain. For me and for those that handle her properly, she is a star, for those that handle her like a toy, they quickly learn it is not a good idea.

Maybe some of this energy and oomph could go into the horses at markets, and the ones that are abused beyond occasionally having the wrong rug on.
 
Little Squirrel said:
After living and working in Ireland for the past 12 years or so I must say that it has been a bit of a culture shock to return back and see how much horses are treated like "babies" here in the UK. I have seven horses in my yard ranging from 2yo's to 12 yo TB's and not one of my horses bite, kick, or is ill mannered. The reason I bring this up is I went to a livery yard last week, the amount of nippy horses who wanted a polo was getting on my nerves! One horse nearly took a girls hand off and she just laughed and said "oh stop trying to give mummy a love bite!" Pure madness!! Not one of mine would know what to do with a polo if I gave them one! I expect my horses to go past anything, lorries, tractors, pigs, blowing bags, explosions!. I don't beat them to do it, they trust and respect me and this starts from the ground up. I don't let them push or be bolshy I am firm but fair maybe I am old fashioned in my views but I am a firm beleiver that a horse is a horse and not something to be spoilt rotten. As for this Pirelli rubbish (I had never witnessed anything to do with him when I was in Ireland) someone is gonna get seriously hurt in trying his circus tricks. People should be taught basic horsemanship not effing about trying to get your horse to be a muppet.
I don't call the vet everytime one has a scratch, I dress it myself but I doubt half the horse population would even know how to do that now and cry wolf at the sight of a trickle of blood!
Every single one of my horses look a million dollars they are fed to what work they are doing, dont get any fancy potions. They are all sound (even my pride and joy who fractured his cannon bone and severed his tendon when racing, who was given to me and I now compete)
So the moral of my story is this, because I deprive my horses of polo's, don't buy them every gadget under the sun or wrap them in cotton wool do I love my horses any less than those who treat their horses like human children?
Well no I can't say I do, and why you may ask? Well put it this way I have no problems, am not afraid of them and they will do anything and I mean anything for me, even if they aren't sure they trust me enough to go forward. They aren't robots either! Maybe if people knew how to handle a horse properly instead of fussing over them there would be a lot fewer "problem" horses in the UK?
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Amen to the above!

I have a constant struggle with the (very horsey) neighbours abutting one side of my fields - they keep saying how 'sweet' mine are - and how they 'just love' polos and other treats! I KEEP asking them not to - and even with electric fences on, they STILL throw stuff over for them! :mad:

They are amazed I ride at LEAST 4 days a week (they have ridden the same amount of times this year - thats their choice)
They think I'm MAD to alternate routes to include road work (I don't have to - Its just good practice as far as I'm concerned) My choice, not theirs.

I caught one trying these downright DANGEROUS parelli stuff with one of mine when I was early back from a trip :mad: we had a long 'discussion' about it, as I was not impressed that a sensible horse was now headshy! :mad:

Someone else does mine now if I have to go away........

I don't interfere with theirs unless asked on sickness grounds, so bleeping well why do they have to meddle with mine unasked?

I'm all for everyone doing what they like with theirs, whether its 10 rugson, waving sticks in their faces or feeding sweets etc, but I prefer mine to be done my way :)

Bravo OP :cool:
 
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I have to agree with whoever it was who said that everyone has different ways of "managing" their horses.
It also depends on the horse. No point being firm and dominant if the horse in question needs the more "softly softly" approach.
Last mare if she thought you were a pushover would completely dominate you, become a tw*t to handle, rearing, spinning, same under saddle. You had to be firm, consistend and draw the line and make sure she never crossed that line!
Current mare I can be alot more relaxed in the way I handle her as she won't take the p*ss like the last one!
I don't "mollycoddle" but I think there are so many variable as to the type of horse, the type of person you are etc as to whether it can be seen as mollycoddling and spoiling them.
I only know one mare who was properly molly coddled, allowed to do what she wanted.
(Drag owners everywhere then rear if she wasn't allowed to do it! Paw the ground, bang the door, figit then walk off if made to stand at a mounting block for more then 3 seconds..) and it drove me mad since it was a young persons horse!!
 
While I am by no means a fan of parelli, one of the best mannered horses I know is trained with parelli methods, the games, carrot sticks etc. I agree with your post but it does come across as very disdainful to those who rug their horses, give them treats or call the vet out if their horse has been cut. I would far rather people call the vet than treat it themselves not well enough. Feeding treats doesn't necessarily cause bad manners. I have a nippy shetland who has been fed treats a grand total of three times in his life. He doesn't nip me but he will try to nip a stranger, you may say it's because I'm not firm enough with him, believe me I am but he is a persistant little b***** and learning things takes a long time with him. There have always been bad mannered horses. I have been hearing the same things as you are saying for years. It reminds me how older generations always say that the newer ones are far worse than they ever were.
 
My irish cob would just die if i put him out without his thick rugs in winter and if i forget to give his tea which i have done has taken his stable door of his hinges in protest. But its all my fault he has been spoiled rotton he has so many rugs i run out of winter for him to wear them all but i dont overfeed him and bad manners is a big no no. But i dont have kids so i have to spoil something thats my excuse and im sticking to it
 
I was always taught by a very traditional older horsey lady who had been through it all ran a successful Riding School, Stud and livery yard and could come up with a old school remedy for anything that every horse is an individual. You can't just put a rug on all of them because its cold or wet but you might need to put a rug on one of them. Dont feed them all just because your feeding one of them but dont not feed any of them if one of them needs it and the thing she always told us kids was if in doubt call the vet and if you have a good vet they will always just give advice over the phone and actually tell you whether they think they need to come out if they know you well enough and can trust you can deal with it on your own. I have 9 horses in total most being rescue cases and all with at least one medical need and they are all treated as individuals. They are all well mannered even the blind one who has learned to listen to instructions rather than see them and are happy but they are individuals and therefore get what they need not what other people say think or do and now that we run our own livery yard the same is applied to every single livery on here. All the owners when they come to look around are advised to the best of our ability your horse is treated as an individual and it works.
 
Well what a can of worms I opened!! I must say that when being mollycoddled I am not talking specifically about rugs, I agree that a horse should be rugged if needed. I am not cruel in any way, I just cannot abide spoilt horses who's lack of manners is from humans completley doting on them and letting them away with murder and think it's "cute"! This for me is where problems start if a horse is let walk all over you then they damn sure will take advantage. As for whoever posted the reply about commercial racing yards and horses biting. I was head girl in a racing yard with over 80 in training, I can remember on one hand those who would nip but this was from adrenaline when being saddled rather than from ill manners.
I really beleive that basic horsemanship should be taught from an early age. I beleive in Germany ( I MAY BE VERY WRONG HERE) they have a test if you want to own a horse? I don't know what is taught in the pony club here as I never took part, but I think the BHS is a load of s****! I have had two girls come to work for me with every BHS thing under the sun. Neither could do what they were told (as they knew better) and both were horrendus riders who had the worst set of hands I've seen in my life. As for common sense that was out the window!! Anyway I have probably stirred another storm so I will now promptly shut up!!!:D
 
Wagtail said:
Door banging and foot scraping are one of the hardest attention seeking behaviours to cure.
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Really? I found that a stall chain across the open door and a rubber mat stopped my big mare. No noise = no effect = no point
 
My horses live out, all year round. Some are rugged, some are unrugged, it depends on the individual.
I was out with a group of horse people recently and felt like I was under attack for keeping them like this... how can I possibly excercise them, how can I ride them from the field in winter ? So you dont ride in winter? They need stabling and rugging to be able to work in winter...

Well, I ride from the field. Hell, I even compete from the field. Yes I ride all winter (unless theres ice on the bridlepaths, but then the stabled horses at the local liveries arent ridden then either). No, I manage fine without stabling and over rugging, thanks, lol.

One woman was particularly smug about the amount of rugs and duvets her cob was 'snuggled up' in, all cosy like, personally I was thinking poor blooming animal, but was too polite to say.

Then they all got into a pi$$ing competition about how bad their horses were for bucking/rearing/broncing, and how high/vertical/severe they all were. Well my poor unfortunate grass kept horse has never bucked/reared/bronced or done anything other than what ive asked him to do, with good grace and good manners.

Honestly though, I dont know why people feel the need to criticise the way other people do things, unless its an actual neglect situation, its just rude and uncalled for. I personally would not choose to keep my horse stabled and rugged all year round, thats their decision, wouldnt work for me, but Id never have just waded in to these people and 'got vocal' about it!
 
Little Squirrel said:
Well what a can of worms I opened!! I must say that when being mollycoddled I am not talking specifically about rugs, I agree that a horse should be rugged if needed. I am not cruel in any way, I just cannot abide spoilt horses who's lack of manners is from humans completley doting on them and letting them away with murder and think it's "cute"! This for me is where problems start if a horse is let walk all over you then they damn sure will take advantage. As for whoever posted the reply about commercial racing yards and horses biting. I was head girl in a racing yard with over 80 in training, I can remember on one hand those who would nip but this was from adrenaline when being saddled rather than from ill manners.
I really beleive that basic horsemanship should be taught from an early age. I beleive in Germany ( I MAY BE VERY WRONG HERE) they have a test if you want to own a horse? I don't know what is taught in the pony club here as I never took part, but I think the BHS is a load of s****! I have had two girls come to work for me with every BHS thing under the sun. Neither could do what they were told (as they knew better) and both were horrendus riders who had the worst set of hands I've seen in my life. As for common sense that was out the window!! Anyway I have probably stirred another storm so I will now promptly shut up!!!:D
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ah ... having just read through all of this you have just answered my biggest question ...... ..... nearly everyone here has a different defintion of what consititutes "mollycoddling" and yet I think that even those that appeared to disagree with you may now well agree. :cool:.. I do agree with all you have said in this post ..... (as to the previous I agreed in part )

I think that no matter what training is used there has to be consistancy, fairness and an appreciation of natural horse behaviour and needs... and in ALL training form CT, parelli, NH , BHS etc etc etc there are good practitioners and poor practitioners........ I think there are extrmes form people who set NO boundaries to people who will not let their hose into their space at all :rolleyes:



I mainly CT so there are going to be some aspects of other methods I dont like or would never choose to do ....... but I still expect good manners and politeness from the horses and I am capable and willing to apply "consequences of behaviour" should any of their actions be potentially harmful to anyone ;) . I take what is imo good and applicable to what I do from other peoples methods and try not to denigrate the whole.


I actually like it that we can enter each others space as long as its done politely ........ and that children can play, and people with special needs can be around, our horses with me having no reservations about the horses at all.


and I agree too with amandap

I
don't agree you can equate polos with NH either. Polo feeding seems to be done on many yards the only yard I was ever on in UK the local shop sold polos by the box. Willy nilly hand feeding is imo a big problem but goes along with no consistancy or clear communication with horses. This is found imo in every 'type' of horsemanship
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.

My horses are never nippy and if a finger gets in the way its spat out :D There are far more problems with horses fed treats for , to the horse, no apparent reason. My horses are always asked to do something first if someone wants to "treat" them ( for the humans benefit ;))



I like to "cuddle" my horses and they enjoy the interaction too .... having a scratch when I do so ...... ears, belly, teats, back legs. They sometimes enjoy just "sharing space" too when in the field and if I lie down in the field they will come and graze alongside or lie down too... as will my dogs. To me thats not mollycoddling, its just spending time together and creating a bond.


lost track now cos I got a headache :(
 
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