Why are horses supplements so expensive

[RHM]

If i was part of a horsey crowd of 10 interested in devising a bespoke supplement mix, no iron, more copper/mag/zinc than most etc - made with bio-available minerals and vits, and avoiding synthetic versions, i’d then find a biomed company in china who do such bespoke blends and order the necessary tonnage. A bit like a ‘horse supplement syndicate’.
The kilo price would be a tenth of common branded equine supplements. Thats including shopping and import taxes. I did a rough calculation a while back.

Sign me up! After the equimins nightmare I’m in the market for a new one!

 

[criso]

I'd agree with this, except to say that there are likely to be levels of purity in other ingredients too - and this is often reflected in the price.
Also buying in bulk is not always the cheapest if you cannot store the extra in optimum conditions.

I'm just talking straights here not blends so in theory there are no other ingredients.

However in terms of straights, i think magnesium is the one that's most transparent in terms of purity to the point that some suppliers sell different grades at different prices.

 

[ycbm]

We could have discussions about whether going for the low iron, high purity version is justified or better but in terms of price, it's not comparing like with like.

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It is comparing like for like for the cost of delivery of magnesium into the horse.

Calmag as animal feed is high purity. Rockleyfarm use it and Progressive Earth sell as their cheapest mag ox at a vast markup.
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[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

If i was part of a horsey crowd of 10 interested in devising a bespoke supplement mix, no iron, more copper/mag/zinc than most etc - made with bio-available minerals and vits, and avoiding synthetic versions, i’d then find a biomed company in china who do such bespoke blends and order the necessary tonnage. A bit like a ‘horse supplement syndicate’.
The kilo price would be a tenth of common branded equine supplements. Thats including shopping and import taxes. I did a rough calculation a while back.

Sign me up!

I feed dried Cleavers (Clivers) and sometimes get a Clivers & Marigold mix at the same price if available for lymphatic support - No Fill is about £42 for 1.3kg whereas the Cleavers are £19 for the same amount.
Also Limestone Flour - NAF 15kg tub is £20 whereas I get 25kg for £8.95
Boswellia is another one, I get 1kg for about £14 whereas the horse one is £25.95 for 900g, or you can get various boswellia based supplements for much more, although they tend to have MSM and Glucosamine as well.

 

[ycbm]

If you have horses permanently on acid reducers, the ingredients used are usually calcium triphosphate, calcium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate. If you've got the space, all of those are available in food grade 25kg sacks and you'd save a fortune.
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[criso]

It is comparing like for like for the cost of delivery of magnesium into the horse.

Calmag as animal feed is high purity. Rockleyfarm use it and Progressive Earth sell as their cheapest mag ox at a vast markup.
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It is not the same specifications as the high purity low iron magnesium oxide sold by fp so not the same product. Yes you can compare it to buying small amounts of calmag from some ebay sellers who sell it at a far higher price per kilo. But if you want to compare bulk buying with small amounts, then you need to compare the same product.

It's not just the % purity to consider which you can get round by feeding more but also iron. The intralabs stuff is slightly pink which is a give away.

Recently fp did an analysis of other supplements for iron. None had iron added but came out really high due to incidental iron so it is something to consider. I wonder which of the ingredients supplied this extra iron.

I appreciate alot of horses won't show a difference but i have a sensitive one that does. He goes footy on calmag and also doesn't do well on the intralabs stuff.

I'm not saying don't buy or use calmag, I'm just saying compare like with like for pricing.

 

[criso]

Just to add to the magnesium. PE do sell calmag at £4.99 per kg and the low iron stuff for £12.99, Forageplus very high purity low iron £18.79.

So there is a huge saving from £4.99 per kg to £15 for a whole sack and actually at that price you could afford not to use the whole sack before it spoils.

But the price ownerbyaconnie quoted did not sound like she was buying calmag so just need to be aware of what you buying if switching.

 

[05jackd]

Very interesting! For those that do feed calmag - how do you work out the dosage?

 

[PurBee]

Away you go PB, I'll buy it. 2/10, 8 to go.

Its very tempting, but a lot of research and development will be required to get it right, let alone the fun of liasing with the chinese Biolabs! (Their english is very good on the whole tho, just different ways of expressing terminology)

Im thinking more of a general supplement rather than a specialist one for pathologies. At least that way folk have it as a foundational great quality ingredients supp. which they can add to for their horses specific pathology.
There’s good balancer supplements on the market but there’s always 1 ingredient im not happy with! Many use salt, and research suggests this degrades the other minerals.
The best priced and quality generic mix seems to be P. Earth at about £9-11 per kilo -so roughly 50p per day for a 500kg horse..(without shipping costs) but i think its synthetic vit e they use. I need to confirm that, it needs to be RRR version thats watersoluble while also being natural.
Yet in terms of cost, they do give a very good deal for the quality of ingredients, except possibly the vit e!

The other thing is b vitamins. They degrade a lot faster than minerals unless they can be processed in a way as to ‘enterically coat them’ to prevent degradation. Once they go off, the smell is even worse than when fresh, which is pretty manky, as we know from equimins concentrate. It would be best to omit them, unless i can find a company that uses a technique to render them more stable while keeping them fully natural and bio-available.
Some horse owners arent bothered by b vits, some are. I personally would like a nominal dose of really good quality b vits, as a top up to what their guts are or are not manufacturing themselves (depends on the state of their gut bacterial biome really)
But if they are not best mixed into a balancer due to degradation its best to omit them altogether and have those as a separate supplement.

i’ll make enquiries, and in the meantime those interested if you pm me any specifications you really do or dont want in a balancer, that will go a long way to help formulate a foundational great quality mix.

 

[ycbm]

at that price you could afford not to use the whole sack before it spoils.

Calmag doesn't spoil it's a stable mineral. I keep it out in the tack room, which is damp. Zinc oxide in 25kg sacks goes like rock even in a dry room! Copper sulphate is fine, MSM seems fine so far but it came in a very good storage box.,

 

[ycbm]

Very interesting! For those that do feed calmag - how do you work out the dosage?

I feed it until i see the pee go cloudy, then reduce it until it goes clear. I settled on a 15ml scoop every day after starting with 25ml.

Rockley recommend feeding utterly ridiculous quantities of the stuff! Unless you are feeding it to damp down acid, feeding extra does nothing beneficial, they just pee it away.,
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[Pinkvboots]

If you have horses permanently on acid reducers, the ingredients used are usually calcium triphosphate, calcium carbonate and sodium bicarbonate. If you've got the space, all of those are available in food grade 25kg sacks and you'd save a fortune.
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Intra labs sell sodium bicarbonate as well do you know where to buy the rest

 

[ycbm]

I bought a sack of each in food grade from ebay, as I recall, but it was a while ago now. I might have got the limestone flour from the local farm supplies.
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[criso]

Calmag doesn't spoil it's a stable mineral. I keep it out in the tack room, which is damp. Zinc oxide in 25kg sacks goes like rock even in a dry room! Copper sulphate is fine, MSM seems fine so far but it came in a very good storage box.,

I wasn't suggesting it did particularly, just that you break even and start saving at 3kg and everything you use after that is profit. However even stable minerals can get wet if in a sack and we have very inquisitive rats here, they opened and scattered a sack of wood pellets recently.

 

[sherry90]

I use this https://www.viovet.co.uk/NAF-Glucos...MIvNOxvvHr7gIVomLmCh2pygAiEAQYASABEgLHJPD_BwE is there a cheaper alternative? It’s not too costly but every penny counts. I used to use Aviform Suppleaze Gold but it got costly and tbh I don’t have a horse (touch wood!) with any issues so more as a preventative....

 

[Ouch05]

I feed it until i see the pee go cloudy, then reduce it until it goes clear. I settled on a 15ml scoop every day after starting with 25ml.

Rockley recommend feeding utterly ridiculous quantities of the stuff! Unless you are feeding it to damp down acid, feeding extra does nothing beneficial, they just pee it away.,
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So just so I get this correct a bag of calcined magnesite from a farm shop can be used as an acid suppressor feed at the rate above.