Why do people feed so much?

Cortez said:
Yes, but what do you do when the horse is obese, greedy and underworked? Do you still let it stuff it's face all day?
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Humans are greedy - horses are just trying to lay down fat for the winter - so I object to them being called greedy - they are just following their biological planning - they have no idea if they will go out in the same lush field do they?

It is down to the owner to control the horse - and at 1.5% of body weight then then horse will loose weight unless the poor mite has EMS or Chushings - and then starving it is down right cruel.

And whilst over feeding is bad - so is under feeding - its amazing all the skinny horses i know are kept by right fatties - and they always say things such as "he will have to learn to eat slower" - "it won't hurt him to be hungry" and i think no - it wouldn't hurt you either !
 
I think many people do not understand the concept of hard feed, I would much rather mine had a extra haynet than a bucket of feed, They only get hifi no mollasses and pura beet and I have cut that back and fed extra hay as they cant be ridden, so many people also dont realise horses should only be fed small feeds not great tub fulls its a waste to feed that way as it has no benefit to them little and often is best, many people I know also over feed there horses then wonder why they are nutters to ride most horses dont need extra feed for energy for an hours hack everyday.
 
Cortez said:
Yes, but what do you do when the horse is obese, greedy and underworked? Do you still let it stuff it's face all day?
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I think I said in my post? Weigh the hay to make sure you're not overfeeding. Soak it, double net, place hayneys over stable. You could mix it with a good quality oat straw. Oat straw burns more calories eating it than it gives the horse so this is brill to make sure you can maintain digestive health whilst not giving your horse extra calories. You can also feed a nutritionally poor quality hay (not poor as in dusty, mouldy etc, just not a 'rich' hay). If your horse is stabled during day at a yard where people are around you could ask them to put in a small haynet every couple of hours so the horse doesn't bolt the hay but instead has a constant supply.

I know it isn't easy and I agree that obesity is a major problem in horses but it isn't fair to starve a horse or not supply them with enough forage to ensure they maintain digestive health.
 
Gingerwitch said:
Humans are greedy - horses are just trying to lay down fat for the winter - so I object to them being called greedy - they are just following their biological planning - they have no idea if they will go out in the same lush field do they?

It is down to the owner to control the horse - and at 1.5% of body weight then then horse will loose weight unless the poor mite has EMS or Chushings - and then starving it is down right cruel.

And whilst over feeding is bad - so is under feeding - its amazing all the skinny horses i know are kept by right fatties - and they always say things such as "he will have to learn to eat slower" - "it won't hurt him to be hungry" and i think no - it wouldn't hurt you either !
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Some horses are greedy, just like some humans, and some are picky, likewise. Of course underfeeding is wrong, but so is overfeeding, even if it is done with the best of intentions or through lack of knowledge. Getting a horse just right takes a bit of experience, or very good advice, which isn't generally what you get from feed companies who are really most interested in selling you their products. The average overweight leisure horse most likely does not need supplements, hard feed, ryegrass (haylage or hay) fed adlib. Some horses, which are not overweight or are skinny, do need more, obviously.
 
It depends what they're being fed. Mine gets a big tub-trug full a night. To a passer-by it would look like way too much, however it's all fibre/hay replacer to pick at overnight. I don't really understand feeding mixes/pellets when they don't need it. It's just a waste of money, if they're eating grass all day then what differende does a scoop of hard feed make.
 
People at my yard feed only a few handfuls a day to get the daily requirements of vitamins, minerals and essential fatty acids which is lacking in our hay.
 
I do think that folk need to understand the crap in most of the feeds - why i would want a horse to be fed salt and sugar in the same feed i have no idea.

People also need to realise that a horses stomach is about the size of a rugby ball, and any more feed than this is a complete waste of money and rather dangerous to the horse.

I agree that most feeds i see, could and should be split into 4 smaller feeds during the day - and the horse would get much more from them and gain much more weight - if that was the intention.

My youngster whom is growing at a right rate of knots is on good grass and good quality hay - the tb - is on the same and he is a perfect size.
 
xxRachelxx said:
I think I said in my post? Weigh the hay to make sure you're not overfeeding. Soak it, double net, place hayneys over stable. You could mix it with a good quality oat straw. Oat straw burns more calories eating it than it gives the horse so this is brill to make sure you can maintain digestive health whilst not giving your horse extra calories. You can also feed a nutritionally poor quality hay (not poor as in dusty, mouldy etc, just not a 'rich' hay). If your horse is stabled during day at a yard where people are around you could ask them to put in a small haynet every couple of hours so the horse doesn't bolt the hay but instead has a constant supply.

I know it isn't easy and I agree that obesity is a major problem in horses but it isn't fair to starve a horse or not supply them with enough forage to ensure they maintain digestive health.
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OK, so most of my horses (average 15hh, 500kgs, in light work, good+ condition) get between 7.5 - 8kgs of stemmy timothy hay a day. That is approximately 4 large flakes of hay (from a small bale). They are fed four times a day. There is no way that this amount of hay can last them all day, so they have some straw available to nibble on, but this is not "adlib". Even on 24hr soaked hay, if fed adlib, thay would gain weight. What would you do?
 
Cortez - you have what i call a speciality breed - I know nothing about how they are kept, or rather should be kept, i did look at the possiblity of bringing one back from Portugal but not knowing enough about what they are used to eating - from what i see out there - its nothing - bare soil - hot sun - little shade - and the hay.... well i have no idea what it is - it looks like twigs - so i can imagine that you have a pretty rough job keeping them at a decent weight if they get access to what is relativley rich food.

That however is not disputing that hard feed quantities pushed by the feed merchants is at stupid high amounts...
 
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I dont agree with feeding fat horses. I have a good doer and an oldie right now. The good doer is in work and getting ridden 4 times + per week schooling, long hacks and some faster work. She gets three slices of hay one AM and two PM in a trickle net and two feeds of alfalfa, oats and sugarbeet (half scoop of each) and is living out hunter clipped and rugged and is a good weight, not fat but not thin and has plenty of energy.

My oldie is unclipped, rugged out during the day in at night and is getting a scoop of conditioning fibre and two cups of Veteran vitality with his hoof and joints supps. He is now getting hay in the field and at night a large haynets worth each time as grass is now not providing enough. He is looking great for an oldie not fat nor thin but lacking muscle.

I watch people piling hay and feed into ponies prone to laminitis and it makes me want to cry :(
 
Hi Cortez, I recently needed to lose weight on one of my horses (PRE) but I swapped half of her forage ration for barley straw (gradually of course) and she gets as much as she can eat really (whereas before hay had to be half soaked) and has lost weight over the last 6 weeks or so... but not condition. Still very glossy and excellent horn quality and there seems to be no change in temperament. Hope that helps :)
 
Gingerwitch said:
Cortez - you have what i call a speciality breed - I know nothing about how they are kept, or rather should be kept, i did look at the possiblity of bringing one back from Portugal but not knowing enough about what they are used to eating - from what i see out there - its nothing - bare soil - hot sun - little shade - and the hay.... well i have no idea what it is - it looks like twigs - so i can imagine that you have a pretty rough job keeping them at a decent weight if they get access to what is relativley rich food.

That however is not disputing that hard feed quantities pushed by the feed merchants is at stupid high amounts...
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You are absolutely right; most Iberians can thrive on the barest minimum low grade forage (part of the reason people have problems with them over here, I suspect). But then so can most cobs and halfbreds (ISH types), which is why I'm amazed at the concoctions and quantities that a lot of people seem to feed their horses. I stress, NOT ALL horses are like this, but I have seen some of the fattest horses of my life over there in the UK
 
It boils down to two things imo. First is sheer stupidity/ lack of knowledge. Second is that everything is getting fatter. Let's face it, if yourself, your husband & your kids are all overweight its unlikely you'd notice your horse is fat.
 
Cortez said:
And reading the recommended amounts on a feed bag is not a good plan either.
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Completely agree with this. GD is not a particularly good do-er, but he'd be positively corpulent if I fed him what's recommended on the side of his feed sacks.

I err on the side of forage and forage replacers (e.g., chaff) as primary feed with something else to carry supplements (in our case a feed balancer). Not a fan of mixes as AFAIK horses don't naturally browse on peas ;).

I do, though, think that owners need to feed what their individual horse requires . . . we have quite a few veterans on our yard who do need large bucket feeds, in addition to grazing and copious amounts of hay, to keep condition in the winter.

P
 
Gingerwitch said:
Whilst i understand what your saying - have you thought about how others view you?

How you can say you keep a horse on the same feed come winter or summer, clipped not clipped in work and without it is beyond me. 2 sections of hay in the winter for a 16hh horse in my opinion is not enough.

As for your other horse - if your having to pump that much feed into him - then i would strongly suggest you look at the quality of hay and grass he is on.
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I agree with you GW.

We have had a cob mare for over 20 yrs. When she was in her prime and in full work, she had no hard feed and her overnight winter hay ration always had to be split into 2, one amount at 7.30 when she came in and one at midnight, when she haad finished that she could eat her straw bed until 7.30am when she went out. Now she is retired but no longer a good doer, she is fed on soaked grassnuts, grass chaff, linseed, a dollop of molasses, supplements and haylage. She would have faded away by now if we hadn't changed her feed regime. The others have to be rationed now!
 
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Theocat said:
Agree with Cortez - feeding them makes us feel good.

OP, why do you feed pony nuts? I'm just curious - if all you need to do is get supplements into him, doesn't just chaff do the job? I'm not saying you shouldn't, but if he doesn't need them (and at a handful, it sounds as though he doesn't) you're presumably feeding them because you like the idea of it?
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I feed them because he gets bute in his feed and he wont eat it with just chaff, or chaff with garlic / mint which i've tried. It really is just a token gesture and part of me gives it to him as a "well everyone else in your block gets massive feeds so I'll give you something so you dont feel left out", but I figure 1 bag @ £7 every 6 - 8 weeks is nothing to me, makes him feel like he has something to look forward to when he comes in and cant be making a difference on his waist line.

I also totally agree about not leaving them without food for too long, people I think do read it and go well they must have hay all the time then but if I were to do that with him he would be massive. There are ways around it, he has straw because he doesnt gorge on it, and he always has a bit of straw left in the mornings, and it is double trickle netted.
 
My animals, not just my horses, get fed when and with what they NEED. None are at all overweight, I have a thing about overweight animals. Just wish I could only feed myself what I need instead of over eating!!!

Advertising and ood marketing have a lot to answer for in many things.
 
Gingerwitch said:
yes i totally agree - but then i would have to see the horses the op was on about too - but if a horse can be out on spring grass unclipped and need 2 sections of hay in the summer... then i would have thought it pretty obvious that the horse could not sustain on the same amount on winter grazing, and in this cold.
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Sorry gingerwitch I was not clear. He gets no hay in the summer at all, he lives out. The feed he gets is a token feed, in the summer he never used to get any feed but now he still gets his handful of pony nuts because he is on daily bute and in the winter I add a vit supplement to it. And also my mare has access to adlib hay which is of a good quality, she just picks at it and is far more interested in whats going on around her than eating. In the summer (though this was the first summer I have had her) she was fed nothing as the grass was more than sufficient.
 
Feed recommendations according to feed companies are absolute rubbish as well. When my 14.2 was in really heavy work she was eating about half the recommended quantities for a pony her size in light work. And even then I would increase/decrease quantities slightly each day according to plans, so more slow release energy for a full days hunting, lots less on a day off. If I fed her the 'correct' quantities she'd either be a dangerous lunatic or a huge ball of lard. She gets ad-lib forage, but its very rough quality, an average doer wouldn't manage on it. At almost 24 she gets half a scoop of hi-fi lite as a token gesture because she expects it.
Other is an 11.1 very good doer. Luckily she isn't food orientated, or I'd struggle with her rations. She gets through one small bale of the same low quality hay a week over winter, but there is always more than enough over to allow for extra in the field, & she wastes quite a bit. I think she actually only eats 3/4 of a bale per week from say Nov to mid April. And gets a supplement scoop of hifi when mine is fed. Yet as she isn't that interested in hay, others have suggested trying haylage, or buying different hay etc. Whereas I am pleased that a pony that is a ridiculously good doer can be allowed unrestricted forage year round.
 
the other thing i see is people feeding to the current weight of the horse when they should be feeding for the weight they want the horse to be:rolleyes:
 
Yep, people feed far too much and end up with fat or obese horses. Fat horses are a pet hate of mine, cannot stand them. I have 2 welsh D's and I am hot on their weight so neither are fat. Both get fast fibre, timothy chop in small amounts just to mix in supplements. They get hay overnight and sometimes in the field but its not ad-lib. In summer they'll be strip grazed and when/if they need hay due to no grass it will be weighed and then soaked! They'll still get their hard feed, but the bare minimum to get their supplements in.
 
Agreed...

Mine hunts twice a week on ad lib haylage and a handful of chaff and beet. As soon as the season is over, he is turned back out 24/7, and gets no further hard feed until after Opening Meet of the following season. During the summer he is hacked, lightly competed and attends fun rides, and always looks well and full of energy.

I think the feed world has gotten way too complicated, and the recommneded amounts are frankly ridiculous - no wonder there are some many obese horses!

Poor doers, or ones that have special needs I can accept, but your average happy hacker really needs nothing more than good forage imo.
 
I think the question can be answered in 2 words - ignorance and stupidity. Because we have 3 square meals a day, apparently horses do too. Because we ride them, whatever we do with them, they are working "really hard". Because hardly anyone seems to know that you feed approx 1.5% of bodyweight daily and then adjust for age/breed/good or bad doer. Because hardly anyone seems to know that most horses and just about every pony can do perfectly well on just forage. Because so many fall for every advertising slogan going. Because we ourselves overeat and we can't see what is fat any more. Because its fashionable to have a heavier-built warmblood rather than a leaner TB these days, and few people can tell the difference between fat and muscle. In summary :Because its too darn easy to pay peanuts for a horse and know absolutely nothing about how to keep it.
 
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