why do you break a horse then turn it away?

[california dreaming]

Genuine question. Why do you start a horse then turn it away?? What is the reasoning behind it.?? Also, the UK the only country that uses this approach. Thanking you in advance for your answers.

 

[HaffiesRock]

I am no expert, but after backing my mare the end of last year she was doing great for a few weeks and then became very sour and unwilling. It was Christmas so I chucked her out for 3 weeks and she came back into work a completely different pony! So willing and with so much more concentration. I am not 100% sure why its done, Id assume for it to have time to sink in and for the horse to mature. In my experience it worked, even with only a few weeks of being turned away.

 

[Bestdogdash]

I am just about to do exactly that.

Not sure about anyone else, but I tend to handle young stock very well, show, on of the wagon etc as a yearling and two year old and break just after they turn three, before they are too strong. We then either turn away, but still handle daily or show in hand during the summer, so he has chance to grow a little more and strengthen up before re backing and bringing into light work and start to school in the autumn / winter just before they turn four.

 

[TarrSteps]

Genuine question. Why do you start a horse then turn it away?? What is the reasoning behind it.?? Also, the UK the only country that uses this approach. Thanking you in advance for your answers.

Everywhere else I've been/other countries seem to be more inclined to do short breaks as needed/convenient and possibly not ride their young horses as much when they do ride them. (With the exception of Western horses, especially Futurity bound ones.) I think it's mostly tradition here and based somewhat on the way horses are kept - it's quite cheap for people to stick horses in a field here and look after them DIY, which is not really the way things are commonly done in other countries, except when people have their own land. (That said, I've not met many breeders who routinely turn away for winter even though they have the space.)


It would be interesting to know if it made a difference. On surface examination, I'd say not - the average general riding horse don't seem any sounder or to last any longer than horses elsewhere.

On a personal note, there is no question for me that short breaks and variations in work as the horse needs them ARE beneficial. It's amazing how much better a young horse can be for even a week or ten days off at the right time. I would even say some are well served by having a complete break, especially if it involves shoes off and turnout in a good varied area, if they seem immature or struggling. I can even see the reasoning for not putting miles on the clock when the horse just needs to grow and mature. On the other hand, I know many horses who have never had huge chunks of time off and, over all, I'd say they were well served by keeping up base fitness and doing little and often rather than nothing and then a lot.

 

[_GG_]

Same reason I time my rest days when training new exercises. Horses learn more when you are not in the saddle than when you are IMO. After over 30 years of riding and breaking and training literally hundreds of horses and ponies in my teens and early twenties, I found without fail that horses absorb lessons when not in work. When doing something as major as backing, I think it needs a major break. I've seen too many horses have issues when not given this chance to just relax again, take it all in and realise it's all ok.

 

[EstherYoung]

All my horses get downtime over the winter, regardless of age. I just can't physically keep them going all year round what with working full time and having no facilities. Whatever age they are, they come back stronger after a break.

 

[kassieg]

Same reason I time my rest days when training new exercises. Horses learn more when you are not in the saddle than when you are IMO. After over 30 years of riding and breaking and training literally hundreds of horses and ponies in my teens and early twenties, I found without fail that horses absorb lessons when not in work. When doing something as major as backing, I think it needs a major break. I've seen too many horses have issues when not given this chance to just relax again, take it all in and realise it's all ok.

100% agree with this ! I love giving my mare holidays shes 5 this year & started proper work last March. .. she had numerous 1 & 2 week breaks last year & everytime she came back better

 

[Patterdale]

Because its generally easier to start them younger and smaller, so you get them backed and learning the basics at 2 and/or 3, like 4-6 weeks in, lunged lightly, tack on, rider on, walk trot canter, short hack then that's it, and turn them away until 4.

Then, when you get your 4 year old in, aswell as being bigger and stronger and in a more mature place to start work, it already knows the basics so nothing is too much of a surprise or too stressful.

 

[louiselowe]

Totally agree with GG to a horse weeks are months its like started college craming all that knowlege and not having Xmas and summer holidays and just working through it on a human perspective. More sinks in with a bit of time off

 

[dianchi]

I disagree that there is no evidence that this more beneficial.
The rate of OCD in young horses is much greater on the continent than it is in this country.

I like to implement the basics at 3 1/2 then let them have the winter to chill out and grow before coming in Spring of their 4th year.

 

[Goldenstar]

I always started in their three year old summer they are easy and compliant and most tire easily you can them backed and lightly ridden way without working them Long once you have achieved that theres no point in keeping them up so I turned them away to grow and mature .
I always had other horses so it was ok get that's three yo backed ridden away then get have more time for the fun stuff .
I give adult horses breaks to I believe it does them good to have down time just to be horses .
I give probably six to 16 weeks a year sometimes in two lots depending on what the horse is up to .

 

[montanna]

I backed mine in August of her 3yr old year, did something with her every day until the clocks went back... then she was only hacked at weekends up until two weeks ago when I started doing more due to lack of turnout as our fields are absolutely saturated! She is now ridden in the school on a Monday and Wednesday, lightly lunged on a Friday, hacked on a Saturday and has a lesson on a Sunday. She will start jumping in the Spring this year with a view to doing our first shows in the summer.

 

[TarrSteps]

I disagree that there is no evidence thUyat this more beneficial.
The rate of OCD in young horses is much greater on the continent than it is in this country.

I like to implement the basics at 3 1/2 then let them have the winter to chill out and grow before coming in Spring of their 4th year.

Could you send me the links, please. Keeping in mind the fact that it's virtually standard practice for young horses to be xrayed in Europe and increasingly in North America but almost unheard of here, so I'm not sure how reliable anecdotal evidence would be.

Edited to clarify, I'm not advocating one approach or the other, I'm just genuinely interested that there is a proven link between turning away for extended periods and a lower incidence of early onset DJDs. I can't say, over all, I've sounds found horses in one group to be sounder than the other so I'm interested in tracking the numbers.

 

[dianchi]

I haven't seen a study yet done of turning away and not.

But when we suspected that my 2yo had OCD I did a lot of investigating.

http://www.ighz.edu.pl/files/objects/3428/64/pp205-218.pdf

http://europepmc.org/abstract/PMC/PMC3113880/reload=0;jsessionid=QonYOl25Qb6i7DE0f5l9.2


OCD is caused by a disruption of the normal growth process of bone, this can be caused by many different things, feeding, work load, environmental conditions.
I think that having a break in training at a young age is just another tool that should be used to minimise the risk of OCD during the growth period in horses.

 

[flyingfeet]

Generally because winter is depressing and I cannot do a young horse consistently when its peeing with rain, blowing gales or snowing

Bad enough keeping the working ones fit!!

 

[TarrSteps]

Generally because winter is depressing and I cannot do a young horse consistently when its peeing with rain, blowing gales or snowing

Bad enough keeping the working ones fit!!

I think that's a big part of it here, and also why it works differently elsewhere. In Canada the competition season is short but quite intense so many people concentrate on their young horses in the off season with the idea that they will be ready to go out and school, if not compete, the following summer. There is also likely to be a period in the winter where turnout is tricky and you don't want baby horses stuck in, doing nothing. Older horses are more likely to have a break at the end of the season. Horses that live completely out over winter are much less likely to be doing any work at all.

We also usually either kept horses unshod or took their shoes off over winter, as that's much easier with snow and less likely to be a problem indoors.

The thing is, there is very little hard proof with horses. They are expensive research subjects and the market is very niche so there is little reason to do huge controlled independent studies. What's more, almost everything is swings and roundabouts. You know what they say, ask 3 horse people, get 5 opinions.

 

[california dreaming]

Thank you everyone for replying. All very common sense answers.

 

[MagicMelon]

I think its because some people back them at 3 which is still very young, so they do the basics then turn them away to mature before asking more proper work from them. Might be wrong. I personally only back at 4 (usually in the spring) and have never turned away, they get a couple of months off over the winter (always done this with all my horses, including older ones) to give them a proper break.

 

[dieseldog]

25% of OCD has been proven to be heredity, 75% due to environmental factors. KWPN are investing a lot of time and effort to identify stallions that pass it on.

http://www.kwpn.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2013/09/2011-1_Offspring_inspection_in_progress.pdf

 

[Clodagh]

I did it because my giant 3 year old was mentally ready to be backed but I can't face riding anything in this weather, so he is vegetating. In March he is off to a friend to be produced for BYEH.

 

[TarrSteps]

I haven't seen a study yet done of turning away and not.

But when we suspected that my 2yo had OCD I did a lot of investigating.

http://www.ighz.edu.pl/files/objects/3428/64/pp205-218.pdf

http://europepmc.org/abstract/PMC/PMC3113880/reload=0;jsessionid=QonYOl25Qb6i7DE0f5l9.2


OCD is caused by a disruption of the normal growth process of bone, this can be caused by many different things, feeding, work load, environmental conditions.
I think that having a break in training at a young age is just another tool that should be used to minimise the risk of OCD during the growth period in horses.

Sorry, I'm still not seeing the data for a lower incidence of OCD in horses of similar genetic backgrounds in the UK. Both those studies are of Continental horses.

Which isn't to say you don't have a point, although it doesn't explain the significant number of horses that show radiographic changes before they start work. Presumably this was the case with your own 2 year old?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not picking a fight, I just think so many of these discussions centre on "belief" rather than "proof". People should do what they feel is best but to say that one choice is based on hard physical evidence is based on irrefutable truth is to imply that any other choice is wilfully and consciously damaging.

My issue is that each situation is individual. Sometimes problems are unavoidable and we must accept, in those instances, that another course may not have guaranteed a different outcome. I think a great deal of navigating through this though, is about reading the individual horse and constantly monitoring what is REALLY happening. Again, no guarantee, of course. But saying if you do a, b, and c then everything will be fine is to undermine the necessity of constantly evaluating and reevaluating our systems. It may very well be that a substantial period of time off at 3 or 4 lessens the chance of OCD. But then it might be just as true that many small breaks do the same while optimising the benefits of progressive fitness and education. More likely, as I said above, one course has some benefits, the other course has other benefits.

 

[zaminda]

They do this with the majority of racehorses I came across in Australia. The horses over there often go on racing on the flat for much longer. (Although I suspect that is partly due to a lack of jump racing for them to move onto.) I find it helps them to mature physically, and lets them learn a little about what life is all about before being thrown into full time work. Mine get a break most winter, even if it involves just cutting down to a few days a week, and I find it keeps them mentally much sweeter.

 

[Oscar]

I think this stems from the hunting brigade of old. Most horses would spend all winter stabled, fully clipped & in hard work, then get completely turned away at the end of the season for a rest, before commencing their fattening work again.

My own young horse is currently off work for the winter, stabled at night still though. I struggled to ride regularly due to the weather, and he is quite sharp so my trainer suggested we down tools until Spring.

There may be no evidence to suggest it better than keep going, but anecdotally it seems this method is tried & tested & I'm sure it can't do any harm, as long as the work is re-introduced gradually.

 

[khalswitz]

I don't always turn away - depends on the mentality of the horse. Some youngsters feel a bit mentally immature at the end of their first summer, and a winter off lets them mature mentally before starting work again. Others I continue to hack out during the winter (usually the more confident ones) so that they are settled in a routine and getting stronger and fitter without too much intense school time. I don't tend to start schooling until their 4yo summer though.

For me, it's nothing do do with the physical benefits, but the mental ones - if they are the type to be better in continuous low impact/low intensity work then great, if not they are turned away the first winter.

 

[TarrSteps]

I think this stems from the hunting brigade of old. Most horses would spend all winter stabled, fully clipped & in hard work, then get completely turned away at the end of the season for a rest, before commencing their fattening work again.

My own young horse is currently off work for the winter, stabled at night still though. I struggled to ride regularly due to the weather, and he is quite sharp so my trainer suggested we down tools until Spring.

There may be no evidence to suggest it better than keep going, but anecdotally it seems this method is tried & tested & I'm sure it can't do any harm, as long as the work is re-introduced gradually.

I think with sharp ones you do quite often have to take an all or nothing approach. If you're getting two rides a week and nothing but drama I think that's harder, physically and mentally, than just waiting for the sun to shine and starting properly.