why has her behaviour changed so much? is it..

china

china

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i have had my new mare now 4 months and she had been out of work since last october so i started bringing her back into work, she was the sweetest little mare, very sweet under saddle on the ground and she still is sweet on the ground but under saddle she is turning into a madam. she is very nappy which i will not tollerate but she throws the toys out the pram, now im a confident rider and ride her forwards but i have seen what she can do on the lunge and DO NOT want to be sat on her if she decides to do that with me on her. she has started stopping out on hacks and refusing to move forwards but now she has started spinning which i think she has very quickly picked that up from the horse i was hacking with so i now only go out on her with a sensible horse. she has schooled wonderfully round the school so i know she can do it but now she has started unnecesarily spooking and running away from things and napping at the gate again, she is now off all hard feed and i lunge her before i get on. the only thing that has occured to me was when she was schooling foot perfect was when my gelding went away to horspital for a week and since hes been back she has been a goat to school ?? could that really be the issue? they arnt in together but they are next to eachother. i cant think what else it is, she nearly kicked my head off on the lunge the other week and she meant it to. iv not lunged many horses that run at you and turn onto you, all because one of the horse walked off the yard to go for a hack.
sorry for the essay but im not sure whats going on in her head.
(p.s) shes going for a weeks borstal schooling at the end of this month but i have a sneaky feeling shel behave if she is completley away from my gelding.
 
Why was she off work? Same old, same old, but bear with me - saddle, back and teeth checked recently? Those would be my first thoughts way before I considered her behaviour to be badness.
 
Ditto Glosgirl. You need to rule out all possibilites. Has she changed shape that would affect the fit of the saddle?? Have you used / bought a different saddle?? Is her back ok?? Has she been seen by your vet ?? Once these things have been ruled out you can then look at other ways to address the issues.
 
I generally think people are too quick to blame all schooling problems on the saddle, back and teeth but in this case she has been off work for a long time are you using a saddle that fitted her back when she was in work, I would have thought she has changed shape quite a bit in that time, also has she had her teeth done while she has been off as she prob will need those done now. Otherwise I would say just go back to basics with her. After such a long time off she is probarly just testing the boundaries with you, be firm, but patient do losts of little excerises with her, some transitions changes of rein circles she needs to know when you put your legs on she goes forward, especially important when out of the school.
 
Ditto glosgirl, get everything checked first.

Also, how long has she been back into work? I would do at least a month of walking on hacks to get her muscles all strengthened up, then introduce small amounts of trotting, then gradually do more and only after she is fit start schooling her.

If she is fit, have you got an instructor? It might help to get someone on the ground to assess her behaviour and give you some tips on how to react to her.
 
Thing is - as I'm sure you know - there are so many things it could be :/

This is the standard answer but I'll say it anyway: get her back / teeth / saddle checked. If she is napping, spinning and generally throwing herself around it could be because she is in pain and trying to escape it. Some horses can get very defensive if you keep asking them to do something that hurts.

Why did she have a year off? What fitness programme did you follow / are you following to bring her back into work? She will have lost all the muscle on her topline that allows a horse to carry a rider comfortably and it is difficult to fit a saddle to a horse with no topline. Lots of ground work including teaching good manners when led, longlining and lunging built up gradually will help you to gain her respect and trust, and allow her to build up muscle for carrying you comfortably. Have you already done these things?

Could she have a hormonal imbalance? This could explain the mood swings and suddenly getting very attached to your geldiing.

If you have eliminated physical problems then I would say she sounds insecure. She is looking to other horses for security and not to you, whereas you want her to trust and respect you. I have handled one mare like this - to start with if she wanted to be with the other horses she would do whatever it took - biting, kicking, barging, trampling etc. If she actually did get to the others she would often start a kicking match. When I say insecure I don't mean timid, I mean defensive.

If you take her away from the horses she knows then she might behave better because she has no one to rely on but you, but when it's a choice between you and the others she picks them. You need to figure out how you are going to win her respect without making her feel threatened, because the more threatened she feels the more defensive she'll get.
 
yep everythings been checked, she was off work as old owner didnt have time for her hence her being sold to me she is only 7 and can be a typical testing madam but she has been aloud to get away with it. she had her teeth done a couple of weeks after i had her and they hadnt been done in a long time. the saddle that came with her is to tight so my saddler has adjusted one that i have lying around to tide her over untill she has a new one before she goes off for schooling. she wont hack alone as shes a nappy madam so she has done alot of lunge work to get her moving forwards in a contact, if only i could take videos on my phone so you could see what she does on the lunge, she goes from a dope on a rope to a raving loonatic jumping about 5ft in the air! i think most of it stems from being aloud to get away with it, when out hacking she would slow down and nap to follow the horse right behind them so i rode her forward and got her walking next to them and she actually walks really fast then just stops dead and starts again.
 
How well fitting is the saddle that has been adjusted to 'tide her over'? As she is coming back into work and you are spending time hacking and lunging then I would imagine her back will have muscled up and changed shape quite significantly. Often a 'near enough' fit is just not good enough for the horses comfort!
 
it has been fitted to allow for muscle change as she was slightly one sided on muscle so it was flocked to allow the muscle to develop evenly.
if she continues with this behaviour then looks like il have another horse having a workup done.
shes been in work for nearly 3 months now and has behaved perfectly but since my gelding has come back from horspital she has started being a madam. shes very teenager ish with her attitude, shes impatient and isnt impressed when she doesnt get her own way, im just about to go down now and exercise her so will let you know what happens today.
 
china said:
shes been in work for nearly 3 months now and has behaved perfectly but since my gelding has come back from horspital she has started being a madam. shes very teenager ish with her attitude, shes impatient and isnt impressed when she doesnt get her own way, im just about to go down now and exercise her so will let you know what happens today.
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It sounds hormonal. At this time of year a a lot of mares are in transitional oestrus and can be right funny bu**ers! We have an 'interesting' breaker here at present - and she turned very agressive and nasty when the mare who was turned out next to her (just by day) was in season. (I wouldn't DARE turn her out next to a gelding - she'd kill him!) But oddly enough, she was a different horse when she came into season.

I would try separating her completely from the gelding, if that's practical, and see how she responds.
 
i have extra fencing in her field to stop her sniffing him or else she comes straight in season. she always seems to be in season, he only has to look at her a certain way and she comes in season, shes a nightmare. they go into their winter turnouts in a few weeks and unfortunatly they are very close together but their is a paddock away from the others she could poss have. we have swapped them round so she isnt next to the mares as we think they might kill each other through the fence. is their any tests they can have to check hormone levels if this behaviour continues? shes a lovely mare when i handle her on the ground, abit pushy shovey but thats getting better. she is in season at the moment. well shes always in season!
 
il note that down, hes out thursday to re access my gelding anyway.
would a blood test show her hormone levels?
 
china said:
would a blood test show her hormone levels?
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Yes and no! Hormones fluctuate normally over one day -and day to day. It needs a couple of samples a day for several days in a row to determine if hormone levels are low - or high - and WHICH hormones. With vet call outs and lab fees, that adds up to a substantial amount - and may tell you nothing useful!

It's unlikely your mare is 'always in season' - mares will wink and squirt, suggesting they are in season,for other reaasons (a sign of submission to another horse, for example.) It MIGHT be worth getting her ovaries scanned, to rule out abnormalities -e.g. a large haemorrhagic follicle, or an ovarian tumour. (you DO need a vet who does a reasonble amount of repro scanning to be confident of a 'result'!)

Butthe easiest way IS to put her on Regumate for about 6 weeks. This will stop her coming into season - and stop behaviour associated with her being in season.If it works, you could then look into getting a marble inserted into her uterus. This fools the mare into thinking she's pregnant so has the same effect,without the need for dily dosing with a substance that is NOT without risk for the owner! The marble doesn'twork with ALL mares -and some reject it -butit does usually work!
 
just a quick update, rode her in the school 2nite and she was foot perfect, not one spook or even at attempt to nap, i didnt even have to put my leg on past the gate!
personality transplant?
 
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