Why is the Ellen Whitaker case kept quiet in the media?

[Queenbee]

She was disqualified from driving for 18 months, fined £150 and ordered to pay £85 costs and a £15 victim surcharge.
She spent time in police cells.
She has been in the dock in a criminal court.
She has been splashed all over the tabloids.
She is being subjected to borderline harsh language and a good dose of bitchin' and hatin' from randomers on an internet forum.
Oh the humanity.

but it doesn't make what she did ok now, and it does not account for the fact that 'normal' people who have done the equivalent have had a far harsher penalty than she has.

And none of the above makes up for the fact that she was endangering peoples lives when she is an intelligent person who does know better. The thing is that if she had hurt another human being the penalty and repurcussions for her would have been far worse. If your loved one was hurt, do you think that the above would be just payment for even just risking a life.

(I may add, that I have never been in the situation where I have lost someone to drink driving, but I really can Imagine it, my father is an alcoholic and has driven while drunk, I am thoroughly ashamed of him, he has had the book thrown at him twice, I wish they would ban him completely, I would rather that than he risk a life)

 

[DragonSlayer]

I only came on the forum tonight to help a friend without a PC look for her loan horse that was sold today in the sales and thought I would put my view across on the Ellen story as I was thinking about it after reading my h and h. You don't agree with that, it's cool, as by tomorrow I would of forgotten all about this post and your views which mean naff all to be to be perfectly honest. We are talking about a horse that was sold 10 yrs ago and a silly young woman who wont have a licence for the next 18 months. Clearly you wont have forgotten as by tomorrow you will still be sitting on your laptop at 11.55pm on a friday night writing about crap that is completely irrelavant.

Yup, and the majority of us will sit here with a clear conscience knowing we did NOT deliberately set out to defraud an innocent buyer...

 

[DragonSlayer]

but it doesn't make what she did ok now, and it does not account for the fact that 'normal' people who have done the equivalent have had a far harsher penalty than she has.

I believe someone has already quoted figures of those who did NOT lose their licence because it would ruin their livelihood....

 

[CorvusCorax]

but it doesn't make what she did ok now, and it does not account for the fact that 'normal' people who have done the equivalent have had a far harsher penalty than she has.

Where did I say it made it OK? Please read back, or read my long and boring and patronising post about how I feel about drink driving on the other thread.
I was responding to the OP who said all Ellen got was a driving ban, whereas she was complaining that her friend was fined. It was also laced with sarcasm, please see part in italics.
Ellen Whitaker has been dealt with through the legal system.
If anyone has an issue with the sentencing/punishment in her case, take it up with the judge and the Courts Service.
Right, I really am going to sleep now. Honest.

 

[Queenbee]

LOL! Is this the story maker again? How can you say that she got what she deserved when you do not even know the full story!! Also how can you describe the horse sold as an inexperienced 5 yr old horse that was sold to a nervous owner? The horse was experienced for it's age and had done an awful lot of local level events and was extremely well schooled with many BD points that was sold to an experienced dressage rider! The only reason it was sold was because it was not scopey enough for BSJA. The complaint was raised 3 months after purchase after the new owner had looked into the paperwork. The horse was not dangerous and could not have been responsible for any accident.

no offence engab, but your getting extremely hot under the collar seeing as the horse in question has nothing to do with you and belonged to a 'friend' and seriously, if you or anyone else can EVER claim that a 5 year old horse was experienced, well your sodding barking hun. I mean no offence, but really no horse can be that no matter how well behaved it is or isn't, it can never be experienced at 5?!

 

[Queenbee]

So give us the story then!

Why did the buyers want to return it? As you say, lots of people would have been happy it was two years younger. Was it because they felt that at 5 it had done so much, so young that it was already half crocked? Or because it was not as far on in its schooling as they thought, thinking they had bought a 7 year old? Or what?

Why did your friend have to be taken to court by them to make her do the right thing?

Tell us, we need to know!

Queenbee, trigger happy with the posting again, but you have an excellent point there cptrayes:

If I had been sold a 7yr old and found out it was 5yrs but it did what it said on the tin, I wouldn't be sending it back or wanting my money back. NOW, if there were other problems or issues with the horse, then that would be a different matter.

 

[Queenbee]

My gosh cptrayes you are so knowledgeable I wish I knew as much as you. By looking at your threads you like a good debate and enter into heated discussions. Maybe that's what happens when you get old? Now go and get off the computer, make a fuss of your hubby and go have a good old shag! That's providing you have a hubby? I'm guessing maybe not given you are so bitter

sorry, I am even more trigger happy, I just can't cope with multiple quoting tonight. OP, CPT can come across as an annoying know it all bunion (sorry CPT) but do not attack when CPT speaks obvious sense. You are attacking for attackings sake and are making yourself out to be either a poisoned little troll or just plain poisonous. I will probably get to the end of this thread and find out my first prediction was right and I should take my own medicine but I only meant to read the first page of this thread. so sorry if I have cross posted with some people

 

[Syrah]

but it doesn't make what she did ok now, and it does not account for the fact that 'normal' people who have done the equivalent have had a far harsher penalty than she has.

No one has said it's ok.

Ellens 18 month ban is bordering on harsh to what 'normal' people get.

 

[Syrah]

Just a snippet c&p'd, easily found by google:

A Freedom of Information request revealed Suffolk to be the most lenient district alongside the City of London, with 4.7% of drink-drivers escaping disqualification in both areas. Meanwhile, 3.4% of drink-drivers avoid bans in Norfolk – and the figure is less than 3% in Essex.

Nationally, 1,480 of 55,539 people convicted of a drink-driving offence last year were not disqualified.

Readings of less than 87 (Ellens was 77) usually receive a 12month ban depending on the circumstances.

 

[Dubsie]

Tim Stockdale's news came out after the drink driving case, and is published in H and H page 5 today

I think it was a timing issue - whilst the EW story was in HH online, as it broke last week but too late to make HH, it was featured in the dailys (and poss Sun Times - I got one this week and am sure I read the news in a paper), by the time this weeks HH got to print it would have been quite old news.

 

[Queenbee]

Where did I say it made it OK? Please read back, or read my long and boring and patronising post about how I feel about drink driving on the other thread.
I was responding to the OP who said all Ellen got was a driving ban, whereas she was complaining that her friend was fined. It was also laced with sarcasm, please see part in italics.
Ellen Whitaker has been dealt with through the legal system.
If anyone has an issue with the sentencing/punishment in her case, take it up with the judge and the Courts Service.
Right, I really am going to sleep now. Honest.[/QUOTE

CC, as you know I have responded to your pm, I concede that I took your previous post in the wrong manner, It looked to me, a bit tongue in cheek but I realise it was not, I wish you to also realise that whilst I responded to your post, it was actually in far more of a generalised nature that it may have come across.

Dragon slayer, believe me, I am fully aware of the legal statistics and how they 'balance out' in reality, I wish I weren't, and I wish it really was a case of equality for all, honestly, the legal justice system is not all its cracked up to be whether her outcome was fair, lenient or harsh, the justice system is not right. It is happy to make examples of some and go easy on others. Thats what annoys me. Sorry, perhaps I'm just having a pissy day

 

[cptrayes]

I believe someone has already quoted figures of those who did NOT lose their licence because it would ruin their livelihood....

This applies only to totters who get twelve or more points on their licence for speeding, jumping red lights etc.

The only ways to avoid a ban for excess alcohol is to prove your drinks were spiked, have a good reason for driving (to get a dying man to hospital, for example) or that the distance was EXTREMELY short.

Ellen was given EXACTLY THE SAME PENALTY in court that anyone with her income with her alcohol reading would have got.

 

[Horsesgalore]

Clearly you wont have forgotten as by tomorrow you will still be sitting on your laptop at 11.55pm on a friday night writing about crap that is completely irrelavant.

Isn't it funny that when people get cross on internet forums, they nearly always accuse the other person of having no life, their evidence being they're on an internet forum!

When they get REALLY cross they then say that because other person's on an internet forum they clearly have no job!

 

[AmyMay]

Engab, I have to take issue with you on having a go at Cptrayes. She's responded to this post in an intelligent and engaging fashion (which she actually does in all of her posts, which can't be said of all of us).

It shows a clear lack of maturity on your part to debase the thread by resorting to personal insults.

By the way - what was the answer to Cptrays question?

Why did the buyers want to return it? As you say, lots of people would have been happy it was two years younger. Was it because they felt that at 5 it had done so much, so young that it was already half crocked? Or because it was not as far on in its schooling as they thought, thinking they had bought a 7 year old? Or what?

Why did your friend have to be taken to court by them to make her do the right thing?

 

[Horsesgalore]

go have a good old shag! That's providing you have a hubby? I'm guessing maybe not

Oh yeah, I forgot, that's the OTHER thing they always say!!

 

[jeeve]

over here if you do something like that you will lose your licence for 3 years, which is a pretty hefty penatly.

 

[livetoride]

...She had her registration suspended and was ordered to pay a £2000 fine for supposedly bringing the sport into disrepute - Even though it was nothing to do with the bsja! It was also heavily featured in the media. Now, I am not saying this lady was right for what she did, although had a very good reason,...

Could you please let us know the "very good reason" that your good friend sold a 5 year old as a 7 year old. I am intrigued.

 

[Daytona]

Well in defence to OP footballers for example are often fined by their clubs for inappropriate behaviour when they get in trouble and bring shame on themselves by being papers, often due to drink. Other stars have lost sponsors / contracts etc due to drink and drugs etc. So in all fairness her sponsors should reconsider the face they have premoting them as she is no longer really a role model to young impressionable show jumping fans.

 

[AmyMay]

Well in defence to OP footballers for example are often fined by their clubs for inappropriate behaviour when they get in trouble and bring shame on themselves by being papers, often due to drink. Other stars have lost sponsors / contracts etc due to drink and drugs etc. So in all fairness her sponsors should reconsider the face they have premoting them as she is no longer really a role model to young impressionable show jumping fans.

I don't disagree with you. And we also know that the law can be an ass in many instances of penalties for drink driving.

However, the OP has posted this out of nothing but spite and sour grapes - because her 'friend' (who committed fraud, was taken to court for it and lost) had their story put in H&H and Ms Whitaker didn't......

Yet..........

 

[engab]

As I explained previously, she bought the horse from a dealer but did not get the paperwork. She bought the horse to jump but it was not talented enough to be a bsja horse so subsequently went onto sell as a dr horse a few months later. She did not have the horse vetted and nor did the new owner, therefore she went on the age she was told at purchase. The new owner then went onto trace the horses paperwork and realised the horse was 7. I am not sure of the ins and outs of the court case as I was not there and it was 10 yrs ago. I hope this helps all the curious people here. By the way, whoever said that a horse cannot be experienced for it's age at 5 is talking crap! What about young horse classes and the horses have to jump up to 1.20 for age classes, and the young dressage horses. Over and out

 

[engab]

Well in defence to OP footballers for example are often fined by their clubs for inappropriate behaviour when they get in trouble and bring shame on themselves by being papers, often due to drink. Other stars have lost sponsors / contracts etc due to drink and drugs etc. So in all fairness her sponsors should reconsider the face they have premoting them as she is no longer really a role model to young impressionable show jumping fans.

This is exactly what I am saying. I am not saying she should get a longer ban, or great treating by the law in any way. I am talking about the above. Someone with some commom sense at last

 

[Ladybird]

This thread is hilarious!

I am no fan of EW, or the family in general the majority of the time, and felt surprisingly smug to hear of her ill fate.

However OP, you are hilariously hypocritical and have just made an absolute moron of yourself. No doubt you'll have a different username soon enough!

 

[AMH]

This is not the first time this has happened, what with the John Whitaker fight...

And wasn't it Michael Whitaker who was arrested for assault? Get your facts straight before you rubbish people you've never met.

Ridiculous.

 

[Tickles]

TBH I can see that an equestrian (horse sale) offence is rather different to a drink-driving one in the BSJA's eyes.

If sponsors/membership organisations wish to withdraw their support from a sports person (e.g. what happed to Tiger Woods when his private life became rather public) then that is a valid decision, where it doesn't breach any contract or other law. They have a brand and all public perceptions of someone they sponsor/who is a member *can* impact that.

But it is an individual commercial decision for the brands in question.

And if the offense wasn't closely related to the brand in question (e.g. she wasn't driving a horse box through a show ground or similar) it would make sense to me that the BSJA would care less about that bringing them into disrepute than about something directly related to horses.

Having said all that I do feel a little sorry for the OP if all the previous pages of this thread have been so negative. Forums can be harsh places at times. Don't get disheartened.

 

[MissChaos]

Having said all that I do feel a little sorry for the OP if all the previous pages of this thread have been so negative. Forums can be harsh places at times.

Harsh, hysterical, slightly irrational and personally abusive - all of which OP must be so well aware of from their very own posts further down, Tickles

I'm another one not condoning drink driving (of course; arguments re that well covered) but definitely condoning even shreds of intelligence and a 360 degree view...

 

[MissChaos]

And another thing, seeing as how I've apparently failed to not get drawn into this ridiculousness, damn bl**dy right that BSJA hauled OP's 'friend' up if she was visibly connected to them and missold a horse - because that's exactly what she did. And if there's issue that the BHS, BD BE and any others didn't haul her up TEN YEARS AGO *headdesk* - I cordially suggest that perhaps any complaint should have been directed at them for not doing so - not a forum population*headdesk again* Get over the EW thing; she's been dealt with as prescribed by law and as others have explained, H&H DID cover it but it may not have made a mag issue for a multitude of valid publishing and journo reasons. If you've still got issues with it then write them a blooming letter. Or alternatively run for local council?! Eesh.

Back to my miserable, jobless, OH-less, penniless, tunnel-visioned and joyless life now. Oh, wait...

 

[Mithras]

As I explained previously, she bought the horse from a dealer but did not get the paperwork. She bought the horse to jump but it was not talented enough to be a bsja horse so subsequently went onto sell as a dr horse a few months later. She did not have the horse vetted and nor did the new owner, therefore she went on the age she was told at purchase. The new owner then went onto trace the horses paperwork and realised the horse was 7. I am not sure of the ins and outs of the court case as I was not there and it was 10 yrs ago. I hope this helps all the curious people here. By the way, whoever said that a horse cannot be experienced for it's age at 5 is talking crap! What about young horse classes and the horses have to jump up to 1.20 for age classes, and the young dressage horses. Over and out

To get banned for something like that, I'd be surprised if there wasn't a lot else, eg past history, additional bad behaviour, criminal prosecution, previous similar goings on...