Will a horse that has been bar fired fail vetting?

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Echo24

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Seen a horse that I really like and am considering putting a deposit down subject to a five stage vetting. Now the horse has been bar fired and the owner believes the horse had it done when he was about two (he's a TB but never been raced). Instructor felt that he was pretty sound and couldn't feel any lumps and bumps and I am planning on getting a vetting from Rossdales but wondered if it was worth spending that much if he was going to fail anyway. He's ticked all the boxes for me and the instructor felt he'd be right for me as he is a straight forward and forgiving horse, although there are a couple of minor things we would need to work on. I'm paying £2,500 for him as well.

Thanks for your thoughts.
 
It will definitely be commented on in a vetting. Depending on what your purpose for the horse is, how sound he is during the vetting and to some extent the vets personal opinion he may pass as fit for purpose, with a comment noted or he may not pass at all.

Either way bear in mind your insurance will exclude any tendon related issues from your insurance cover.

I'd be inclined to have the horses tendons scanned at the vetting if he trots up sound and 'passes'.
 
I hadn't thought of the insurance exclusion for thanks for mentioning that! He's not had any leg issues as far as the owner is aware and hasn't been lame since she's had him. I want to do a bit of everything, so dressage, showjumping, xc, sponsored rides but mainly local shows and riding clubs. My instructor said he's a nice enough horse but his concern would be he might fail vetting based on the bar firing.
 
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3 of my tbs have been bar fired- all passed the vet, it was just mentioned :) none ever had any problems! I didn't have any of them scanned either after vetting. Good luck hope it goes well! X
 
Thanks for the tips! Will have a chat with the vet and see what they say. Having checked this forum with people's experiences with horses that have been bar fired and it doesn't sound like many people have had problems with their legs.

Am very excited and also very nervous! He was so lovely though and my instructor put him under pressure to see what he would do and he was so genuine! Fingers crossed everything goes well.
 
Is bar firing still done today, dunno why but I thought it was banned now.

I had a ex racer who was bar fired and never had problems he hunted and team chased.
Never had a horse vetted though.
 
I looked after 2 hunt horses that were fired in their former racing careers and one that wasn't fired but had a bowed tendon. Never had any problems with them and hunt horses work pretty hard, either whipping in or hunting hounds with a non too lightweight man on board and that's in rough, boggy terrain. No idea about vettings though. Good luck with it.
 
I had a horse vetted that had been bar fired and he failed it because of it despite me just wanting a local level all rounder. I think it all totally depends on the vets on the day. I went on to buy him regardless but at a cheaper price suggested by the owner. However, please be aware some insurance companies won't insure the whole leg if it's been bar fired and they don't tell you this at the time! My horse went on to have completely unrelated hoof problems and the insurance company wouldn't pay out as it was on one of his bar fired legs. Just something to keep in mind :)

I had a friend whos horse failed a 5 star due to bar firing and she went on to have her re vetted by a different person and she passed!
 
Thanks for the heads up telfs, I'll really have to scrutinise the insurance companies then. Was planning on going with either Petplan, KBIS or SEIB but if anyone can recommend one particularly as the horse has been bar fired that would be fab.
 
God I would hope it would fail a five stage vetting .
Ask the vet first if it's a complete no no you have saved your money .
I will be amazed if anyone will insure him for the affected limbs and it seems an awful lot of money for a horse with that sort of issue.
 
The problem will be that even if the horse passes vetting the fact that he has been fired will be mentioned by the vet in his report. To get your insurance the insurance company will want a copy of the vetting & as soon as they see that he's been fired there is little doubt that they will hit you with an exclusion on the fired legs. :(
 
Goldenstar said:
God I would hope it would fail a five stage vetting .
Ask the vet first if it's a complete no no you have saved your money .
I will be amazed if anyone will insure him for the affected limbs and it seems an awful lot of money for a horse with that sort of issue.
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Seller originally advertised him for £5,000! Seller also didn't mention about the bar firing, (not that I would have known what it was anyway) and thankfully had my instructor with me who recognised it straight away.

Seller is reluctant to let him go for any less than £2,500, so do you feel he's overpriced with his leg issues?
 
charcoalfeathers said:
Seller originally advertised him for £5,000! Seller also didn't mention about the bar firing, (not that I would have known what it was anyway) and thankfully had my instructor with me who recognised it straight away.

Seller is reluctant to let him go for any less than £2,500, so do you feel he's overpriced with his leg issues?
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These sort of things are to a degree personal if say he passed vetting including being the fetlock flexions and lunging on a small circle on concrete or Tarmac I still would not give stable room to a bar fired horse I would feel the chances of disaster where too high and the vet costs so high now I simply would not chance it .
It's not just what you are paying for him it's what he will cost if it goes wrong .
Sorry to be negative when you have found a horse you ilke enough to buy .
 
It's no problem Goldenstar, it's my first horse so it's nice to hear everyone's opinion and I want to make sure I'm making the right decision and it's always hard as I'm incredibly indecisive (I'm better off with someone telling me yes or no!) But will have a long chat with the vet and see what they think and if they feel it's not going to pass a five stage vetting I'll walk away.
 
Sorry but I'm afraid I agree with Goldenstar, there are plenty of horses out there to not need to buy trouble by taking on one with a known issue. Fair enough it may be sound but as others have said insurance companies will use any excuse to take your money and not pay out.

I'd be looking elsewhere, sorry. It's not as if the price is low enough to negate the issue either. Sorry not what you wanted to hear I'm sure but talk to the professionals, your vet, instructor etc and make an educated decision based on what they say.
 
Thanks for your thought bikerchickone. Instructor thought he was a nice enough horse but was concerned about the bar firing. Will chat to the vet as I'd hate to spend £250 on a vetting if they expect him to fail it anyway. This horse hunting business is so frustrating!
 
NL strikes again. OP, Rossdales are (as I'm sure you know) very, very knowledgeable vets. I would be led by them, or your own vet, as to whether the horse is sound for what you want.

If you are worried it will be an automatic fail, ring them and ask. For all the world I can't see why it should be. Horses that do tendons and aren't fired pass the vet all the time once recovered.

As to whether it's worth the money, who knows. It depends what he does and how well. If he hunts over big country day in, day out or jumps 1.30 classes he's worth more than 2.5K whether fired or not.

All just MHO of course :)
 
jesstickle said:
NL strikes again. OP, Rossdales are (as I'm sure you know) very, very knowledgeable vets. I would be led by them, or your own vet, as to whether the horse is sound for what you want.

If you are worried it will be an automatic fail, ring them and ask. For all the world I can't see why it should be. Horses that do tendons and aren't fired pass the vet all the time once recovered.

As to whether it's worth the money, who knows. It depends what he does and how well. If he hunts over big country day in, day out or jumps 1.30 classes he's worth more than 2.5K whether fired or not.

All just MHO of course :)
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Not sure what you mean jesstickle people give their opinions and OP gets a range of views to think though thats NL doing what it ought.
 
NL strikes again

As to whether it's worth the money, who knows. It depends what he does and how well. If he hunts over big country day in, day out or jumps 1.30 classes he's worth more than 2.5K whether fired or not.
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Not if she doesn't want to hunt all day and can't jump 1.30 :D


OP if you buy this horse don't forget too that every time he gets the slightest niggle you will be worrying that it's his legs. Whether they fail or not, you will see the burns and you won't be able to stop worrying about the tendons.
 
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Just that you nearly always get the bad news from NL. It isn't criticism, I agree that it's very good for making you consider how bad things could be. But it's blimming scary reading!

I used to be so happy go lucky before NL came into my life, now I assume every bump is cancer and every stumble is navicular. :eek: :D
 
jesstickle said:
Just that you nearly always get the bad news from NL. It isn't criticism, I agree that it's very good for making you consider how bad things could be. But it's blimming scary reading!

I used to be so happy go lucky before NL came into my life, now I assume every bump is cancer and every stumble is navicular. :eek: :D
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Like this, and don't consider sending your horse on loan and it's wieght is it to fat to thin ?is it ok to look at dragon driving ?
Help.
 
You're right jesstickles, some of the things you read on here can be very off putting! Sorry if my post came across as quite numpty, just wanted to get people's opinions and experiences, which have all been very useful! Will see what the vet says now, eeek!
 
OP, I really wasn't trying to imply you were a numpty. Not at all! :eek:

And yes GS- just like all of those. I am constantly paranoid my horses are going to die or at least have a career ending injury every time they look at me wrong! :D
 
I'd be inclined to agree with others on the potential issues surrounding insurance and future complications with the fired limbs.

Bear in mind, that vets do not "Fail" and do not "Pass" a horse for vetting, but advise on whether in their professional opinion, the horse is suitable and fit for the purpose of purchase. Some will also advise verbally to thier client if the horse is worth the price being asked, and some will suggest what findings during the vetting could be used to negotiate on that price.

It is then up to the individual whether to go ahead with the purchase based on the vets findings. There is no pass or fail.
 
I know a horse that went through the elite dressage sales, where they have to pass a vetting before being entered. That had been pin fired, I'm assuming that is the same as bar firing, regardless, it passed the vetting and sold for a good sum of money.
 
lizziebell said:
I'd be inclined to agree with others on the potential issues surrounding insurance and future complications with the fired limbs.

Bear in mind, that vets do not "Fail" and do not "Pass" a horse for vetting, but advise on whether in their professional opinion, the horse is suitable and fit for the purpose of purchase. Some will also advise verbally to thier client if the horse is worth the price being asked, and some will suggest what findings during the vetting could be used to negotiate on that price.

It is then up to the individual whether to go ahead with the purchase based on the vets findings. There is no pass or fail.
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Pass equals suitable for purchase for the purpose stated
Fail equals not suitable for purpose stated.
It is of course up to the buyer whether they take the vets advice .
 
quirky said:
I know a horse that went through the elite dressage sales, where they have to pass a vetting before being entered. That had been pin fired, I'm assuming that is the same as bar firing, regardless, it passed the vetting and sold for a good sum of money.
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Pin firing is very different. It covers a much smaller area, causing much less damage to the skin and far less of a blemish. It is done by pushing red hot needles into the injury. It is also not usually done for tendon injuries, which are more normally bar fired. Pin firing was sometimes used to make splints harden off. Once a splint is hard it usually causes no more trouble. A tendon, on the other hand is weaker after an injury than it was before and there will always be a risk of more injury.
 
Goldenstar said:
Pass equals suitable for purchase for the purpose stated
Fail equals not suitable for purpose stated.
It is of course up to the buyer whether they take the vets advice .
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There is no definition of pass or fail except in the opinion of individuals. Vetting certificates tend to urge on caution to avoid any legal action taken on the decisions made, therefore they are usually worded in an ambigious way such as using statements such as "not likely" to effect purpose/ suitability or "likely" to effect purpose/ suitability. Very few vets would subject themselves to being as black and white as to state a fail/ pass - or a straight yes or no (in writing that is).
 
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