Windsor jumping team scores

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lucretia

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these dont seem to have gone up yet but in another thread SJFAN said she didnt think the GB performance was lack lustre becuause they were not speed horses. Well i think the same can be said of most of the major teams who certainly dont go throwing their championship horse round speed classes as a rule
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anyway the scoring system is complicated but i have made an effort and even if the numbers are a bit wrong, the order and the distance between the teams should be about right. Counting the best three scores (and i didnt do all the team!) here is how i think the land lies so far
1. Holland 14 pts
2.. Switzerland 14.4
3. France 16
4. Ireland (hoorah!) 21.5
5. Italy 22.5
6.Germany 28
7. GB 42
8. Sweden 44.5
9. Austria 53.5
then after that i got bored although i think maybe Norway in 10th!
as i said i am not good at maths and am not sure if i am getting all the roundings up and differentials right but that should be the order and see how tight it is at the top and the quite large gap we have to close!
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It does on my Mac...

C+P:

1. SUI Chef d'Equipe: Rolf Grass
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
178 Ulysse Schwizer, Pius 0
175 Peu a Peu Etter, Daniel (6,54)*
174 West Side v. Meerputhoeve Crotta, Clarissa 3.61
176 Jalisca Solier Guerdat, Steve 0.05
3.66
2. NED Chef d'Equipe: Rob Ehrens
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
151 Blauwendraad's O'Brien Hoorn, Angelique 0.54
153 Exquis Walnut de Muze Smolders, Harrie 0.24
155 Oki Doki Zoer, Albert 3.18
152 Opium VS Houtzager, Marc (3,19)*
3.96
3. FRA
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
129 Lord de Theize Guillon, Oliver 0.69
131 Kraque Boom*Bois Margot Staut, Kevin 1.42
127 Lamm de Fetan Anciaume, Timothee (3,31)*
128 Ideal de la Loge Bost, Roger‐Yves 2.60
4.71
4. IRL
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
144 Urleven van de Helle Ryan, Thomas (7,47)*
142 S.I.E.C. Livello Hanley, Cameron 1.83
143 Rancorrado O'Connor, Cian 3.18
141 Night Train Kerins, Darragh 0.85
5.86
5. ITA
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
149 Hamilton de Perhet Garcia, Juan Carlos 3.29
148 Landzeu D'Onofrio, Giuseppe 1.43
147 Snai Seldana di campalto Chiaudani, Natale (4,47)*
146 Kanebo Bucci, Piergiorgio 2.28
7.00
6. GER
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
132 Plot Blue Ehning, Marcus 1.80
136 Corradina Nagel, Carsten‐Otto 1.64
135 Asti Spumante Mühlbauer, Thomas (5,43)*
134 Checkmate Michaels‐Beerbaum, Meredith 4.31
7.75
S
Alltech FEI European Championship for Jumping Windsor 2009
Standing Teams after competition 1
Chef d'Equipe: Otto Becker
Chef d'Equipe: Robert Splaine
Chef d'Equipe: Laurent Elias
Chef d'Equipe: Markus Fuchs
S
Alltech FEI European Championship for Jumping Windsor 2009
Standing Teams after competition 1
7. GBR
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
192 Fresh Direct Corlato Stockdale, Tim (5,20)*
188 Rosinus Billington, Geoff 4.82
189 Murkas Pom d'Ami Charles, Peter 5.14
190 Robin Hood W Maher, Ben 1.30
11.26
8. SWE
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
183 Madick Lundback, Helena (10,03)*
182 Saint Amour Johansson, Svante 3.70
181 Montender Eckermann, Henrik von 5.26
180 Ninja La Silla Bengtsson, Rolf‐Göran 2.66
11.62
9. BEL Chef d'Equipe: Lucien Somers
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
107 Aluna Bruynseels, Niels 4.36
110 Levisto Z Melchior, Judy‐Ann 6.08
111 Top Gun Postelmans, Peter (42,21)*
109 Bvigo d'Arsouilles Le Jeune, Philippe 3.88
14.32
10. FIN
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
125 Evli Cagliostro Forsten, Noora 2.54
126 Calandro Numminen, Sebastian 7.55
124 Isaac du Jonquet Forsten, Mikael 4.98
15.07
11. AUT
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
104 Night Flight Kölfer, Dieter 5.34
101 Chilli van Dijk Eder, Stefan 0.62
103 Pherna Kayser, Julia (11,14)*
105 11th And Bleeker Puck, Gerfried 9.29
15.25
12. NOR
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
158 Le Beau Endresen, Stein (9,93)*
157 Bessemeind'S Casino Djupvik, Morten 7.58
159 Cattani Gulliksen, Geir 3.14
160 Camiro Hansen, Tony Andre 4.94
15.66
Chef d'Equipe: Derek Ricketts
Chef d'Equipe: Gabriele Morbitzer
Chef d'Equipe: Lars Parmler
Chef d'Equipe: Sylve Söderstrand
Chef d'Equipe: Maria Gretzer
S
Alltech FEI European Championship for Jumping Windsor 2009
Standing Teams after competition 1
13. ESP Chef d'Equipe: Marco Fuste
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
118 Ranino Fernandez‐Duran, Alfredo 4.74
119 Lord du Mont Milon Garmendia Echeverria, Jesus 5.79
121 Guarana Champeix Latham, Rutherford 5.39
117 Mme Pompadour M Alvarez Moya, Sergio (7,07)*
15.92
14. POR
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
169 Lacy Woman Vozone, Antonio 14.75
167 Coltaire Z Frutoso de Mello, Marina 2.32
166 Winningmood Diniz, Luciana 2.91
168 Quick VD Breemeersen Rocha, Francisco (42,21)*
19.98
15. RUS
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
172 Aslan Kochetova, Ljubov 4.59
173 Al‐Passal Simonia, Natalia (13,38)*
171 Talk About me Berestov, Dmitry 11.77
170 Larkanaro Beletsky, Vladimir 10.56
26.92
16. HUN
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
140 KN Nemo Krucso, Balazs (15,51)*
139 Sassicaia II Kovacs, Henri 5.54
137 Eternally Horvath, Balazs 10.05
138 Cash Hugyecz, Mariann 12.57
28.16
17. POL
Table C round 1 round 2 Total
163 My Lady Ludwiczak, Krzyszlof 8.47
164 Castello Lusina, Aleksandra 9.77
165 Key Largo Zawada, Julia 11.15
161 Ritus Jonczyk, Lukasz (20,08)*
29.39
Chef d'Equipe: Sandor Szasz
Chef d'Equipe: Manuel Bandeira de Mello
Official Timekeeping and Data Handling
Chef d'Equipe: Alexander Varnavskiy
Chef d'Equipe: Rüdiger Wassibauer
 
It is on mine.

SUI 3.66
NED 3.96
FRA 4.71
IRE 5.86
ITA 7.00
GER 7.75
GB 11.26
SWE 11.62
BEL 14.32
FIN 15.07
AUT 15.25
NOR 15.66
ESP 15.92
POR 19.98
RUS 26.92
HUN 28.16
POL 29.39
 
We are less that 2 fences behind with 2 rounds to go. That is the beauty of the scoring system, and tomorrow should be exciting viewing whether or not GB win a medal. My point about speed was that some of the others are naturally fast e.g. O'Brien. Corlato and Pom d'Ami in particular are far more suited to NC & GP classes.
 
It does seem a strange way of starting the championship esp given how great these horses are - i am not sure i would want to push my top top horse in a speed class?!
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I believe the formula is to try &make sure there are not tied scores after the 2nd & 3rd legs. It could still happen in theory but odds are very much against it.
 
personally i think that this is favouring the lower placed teams. if you get three riders in the top twenty like the dutch and the french you deserve your lead.
Since I have been working for the GCT, i have got used to watching the best person win with no over complicated scoring or formula's that compressed the cores and give those that should be now out of contention a chance. I know what the speed class is for but the scoring needs to be changed so the people who do best get the appropriate advantage. Which is why I beleive this convuluted system has been dropped for some championships.
 
Which Championships are you thinking of? It's not convoluted - and it's the same as for the World Cup Final. I know you are relatively new to SJ which is presumably why you totally miscalculated the team scores. It's a tried & tested system, and I can't recall there being a fluke result. The GCT system, which of course is also used for lots of GPs means some who deserve their place in the 2nd round miss out because they are 100 of a second slower than another. There's no such thing as a totally fair system I fear!
 
the world cup final isnt a team contest........

and there is no reason why it wouldnt still be excitingthe way I did it (i missed out one more .5 division) but there were four teams all very close together all of whom jumped alot better than us in the first round. I just dont see why those teams should not have the advantage they earned.
 
No but neither is the GCT. The European is Individual as well as team, hence the need to keep it reasonably close until the end. Scoring wise, the speed leg is like the dressage in Eventing in not being the most influential phase. The 2 round phase has to be much more influential in deciding the Team classification.
 
as it happens most people would tell you that these days because of the scoring systems the dressage in evening probably does carry more weight than the jumping.
and I didnt say the GCT was a team contest, obviously. but the scoring is straight forward, everyone can follow it and the best person on the day wins. Now I am very happy if that turns out to be a Brit but what i prefer is just seeing a dead good level playing field class, usually with wicked jump off and i dont care which country they are from generally.
 
The point is that dressage is not intended to be more influential than x-country, the x-country being the equivalent of the Nations Cup leg. Actually to amend my earlier post the European system is arguably fairer than the World Cup because the differential between the actual scores is divided by 2 (actually perfectly straightforward albeit time-consuming to calculate) whereas in the WC they get points for placings in the 1st 2 legs, and only after those, does the differerential in points get divided. I'm still waiting for you to say which Championships have dropped the format. Not trying to be argumentative, just having a friendly discussion!
 
as it happens SJFAN, I think you are, you have been rather tweaky lately. And someone as knowlegle as you told me thay use a different system in other places but perhaps they mean a differnt differntial. i suspect that if it had been the Brits doing so well in the first round you would be seeing it differently.
I am afraid that i just dont see that if you are going to have a speed leg why the people who do well shouldnt have an appropriate advantage. Some of those will be disadvantaged soon enough when the jumps are bigger. I think that about the dressage in eventing as well as it happens.
And as it happens the reason there is a differential in event dressage is as much because the scoring for it is such large number compared to the jumping phases, but that does not apply obviously in pure showjumping
 
just read this.it sounds as if its getting rather heated.dont understand it myself so im not going to comment.i would just like to say though complicated scoring systems in any sport only serve to drive away average fans who arent totally into a sport.after all in football you either score a goal or you dont.
 
QR - I'm sorry, I was sure I had it bookmarked, but can't for the life of me find it. Please could someone tell me what the tv times and channels are for the next few days coverage?
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Thanks!
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BBC2 tomorrow from 1 till 4pm, Sat on the red button or online from 7.40-10pm, Sun from 4.15-5.35. FEITV (subscription) has all the Championship classes live (now for Mac users as well as Windows).
 
Sorry if I seemed argumentative, just stating things the way I see them. No, I'd not have seen it differently had GB been leading. Been there when we have been (and yes it was the same scoring system) - I'm old, and have watched almost all the Team Champs since 1983, plus Individual Champs earlier (Team event only introduced in 1975). And like you I want to see the best horses and riders come out on top. The event is about consistency over 5 rounds, not one or two brilliant performances.
 
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