Wondering if anyone elses local shows are a bit biased?

[miss_c]

The other thing that annoys me iss Welsh Cobs being shown in SHOW COB classes and then doing a Mountain and Moorland, or the M&M ponies doing a M&M class then going in show pony classes, I thought you could only do one or the other. Also warmbloods doing Foreign Breed classes which I thought were only for your more native foreign horses??

I take Genie in cob classes, as a Welsh Cob is just that - a cob. However I don't do SHOW cob classes as a show cob should be hogged, and she most definately is not. When I show her as a cob I show her as she should be - a running plait in her mane and her tail banged up, so show her as if she was hogged and docked. Last year she came 2nd in a very strong cob class and the judge said to me it was lovely to see a welsh turned out correctly for cob classes.

 

[LeneHorse]

As another idiot who helps to organise local shows, mainly RC but also steward at one fairly big local agricultural show, where a lot of classes are BSPS (is that now poniesUK?) can I make a plea to all those who are complaining on this thread, please remember the hours of volunteer time that is given up for you to enjoy your day. At the biggest of the RC shows, it takes the whole committee and a fair few other members, the whole of the day before the show to set up, the day of the show the same people do the entries, steard the rings etc. etc. and then at the end of the day pack everything up and take it back to storage. We do this so that people like you can compete, have a good day out and hopefully spend fun time with your friends and your horse. The things that make it worthwhile, are seeing people having fun, people proud of their rosettes and proud of their horses. The occasional thank you is a huge bonus. What gets my goat are the people who complain about everything, from the judging to the size of the rings, who speak to the helpers as if they were less than the dirt on their shoes and never ever help to do a thing!

Well put YorksG! Our annual RC showing show is looming and I would totally agree with you how much work is involved in putting these events together. We do get quite a few thank-yous from happy competitors but I have to say we always get more moans and complaints at our 1 showing show than at the 10 dressage shows and 3 jumping shows we run throughout the year. It particularly infuriates me when competitors start ranting at our stewards who often are non horsey friends and family of the committee who have been roped in to help as we can never get enough volunteers.

 

[Minxie]

I don't think people are commenting on the way shows are being run or underestimating the amount of work involved in running them. It was certainly never mentioned in the OP's original posting.

If there is bias in judging, personally I don't think that this reflects negatively on the organisers at all. My comments were about those entering open classes which they were 'over qualified' for, for the simple reason of getting the rosette. But I certainly wouldn't blame that on the organisers.

 

[TinselTurkey]

What I want to know is how they can charge so much for shows now? I remember when clear round used to be a £1 including a rosette!! Now it's nearer £3?
Also I know it's not about the winning but also back in the day you used to get trophies and very often prize money to 3rd etc, but now all you get is a rosette
Howcome they now charge more for entries but give less back?

At a local show near me clear round is £9.00! :O

 

[LeneHorse]

Am I missing the point somewhere - if a class is 'open' then surely anyone is entitled to enter. At our RC show we have around 40 classes including 'fun' classes so there really is something for everyone. We certainly won't be turning competitors away for our open classes if their horse happens to have been placed at a more prestigious event. If its an open class it's open!
Also, a lot of RCs now run qualifiers for other shows, and that tends to attract a wider range of competitors.
Sorry OP for straying off the original subject. I think judges have a pretty difficult time tbh and don't get much thanks for the time and effort they put in. We have all seen decisions we would not personally agree with, but at the end of the day, as it says in the rules, the judges decision is final. Why not offer to steward for a judge at one of your local shows, to get an insight into how they reach their decisions?

 

[Umbongo]

I don't think people are commenting on the way shows are being run or underestimating the amount of work involved in running them. It was certainly never mentioned in the OP's original posting.

Thank you! I think people are taking this all a bit too seriously. I am not commenting about how shows are organized, I infact help organize my show. We have to move all of our horses out and find livery elsewhere for a couple of weeks while the jumps and rings etc are sorted out so I know how hard it is.

I also think a lot of people commenting on here probably go to bigger shows than the little ones around here that I am talking about. Yes obviously it's fair for the deserving winners in competitions, and to Teagreen...how can I be jealous of the person who has won and say they are not deserving when I actually am not in the competition?

This was all meant in jest and not to annoy anyone, all I wanted to do was see what kind of things happened at others peoples small local shows. About all the horses and riders you see who win because the judge doesn't want to make the child cry (and ADMITS it), about the misbehaving horses with horrible confirmation you see win because of it's colour etc etc. Probably because the judge is the little old lady next door who knows nothing about horses but has lots of cats These are not RC shows, and so the judges vary greatly in experience.

BUT it is still a lot of fun to go, and no one is complaining but I just wanted to see what other people have witnessed. So I think some people on here need to CHILL OUT!!!!

 

[ChesnutsRoasting]

If you are taking a county standard horse out locally for experience then why should you go HC? You pay your entry fee and are perfectly entitled to go to that show. The judge has to judge what is put in front of them, so if you present a horse 10x better than anything else in that class, the judge HAS to have it to win - it's not the judges fault, they can't put it last because they don't think the owners should be showing at that show. It is the same even if you are simply pothunting - the judge has to put the best horse first. However, you ought to feel guilty if you are pothunting, that's the owners fault, not the judges.

Because next year, all your local, showing for fun riders won't turn up and then you'll be complaining that the show isn't viable financially and cancel it.

 

[Serenity087]

This thread is weird.

I went to a variety of riding club shows and I pretty much won everything I touched (including a young handlers class a jealous mother tried to have me thrown out of despite having the right DOB! and a Prettiest Mare class that Doriann spent on two feet... well, it was pretty, wasn't it?). I didn't know any of the RC bods, didn't have an overly fat cob, nothing!

I just won lots

Back to when I was a bit younger, I was one of the horrible brats that won a clear round rosette for not doing a clear round. I did it once, and my pony bronked at the sight of the judges, so they gave me another chance with them out of the ring. Pony did much better till he bolted at the last fence and jumped another three before stopping.
Judge reasoned that I'd have been clear the first time if they hadn't been there (about 20 of them, not really paying much attention to me!) and that I'd jumped clear the second time, just jumped a few more jumps...

Surely that sort of reasoning is better than "Oh, but you'll cry"?

Sadly, that was the 2nd last time I ever jumped in public, as I had a crippling fall two classes later. *sigh*

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It would appear that none of you moaners on here have actually ever helped to organise and / or run a show? If you got off your backsides and put yourselves on the other side of the fence and found out how much effort is needed to put on a show, try to find people to judge, steward, score, do parking, put up poles, run refreshments, do secretary, do announcements and all the other myriad jobs you might have a different view and be just as fed up as I am to hear "It's not fair" all the time. If you actually bothered to have some input you might be able to influence the choice of judge to one who, in your opinion, is not biased.

.

I know exactly where you're coming from. Our RC tries to vary the judges to avoid accusations of bias but it is inevitable that local judges know local competitors. I find that even in affiliated shows the society approved judges will have their own preferences. I think that some people should remember that officiating at shows in whatever capacity is a thankless task and done far more for the benefit of other people than for one's own benefit, in fact I'm not sure why we do do it
Although I will say that getting involved is a good way for any-one to increase their experience and knowledge.

 

[Katie]

i haen't been able to get to many shows yet. Last year i did some local RC showing and came 3rd both times, i had no idea who the judge was (as in i didn't know her), i don't think my instructor knew the judge and i was riding awfully! though apparently 2nd place cantered on the wrong leg

also i HATE it when people who should be entering more advanced classes enter lower level ones. i went to a dressage show and 2 girls who my instructor knew and told me did BE eventing (quite high up i think) entered my prelim class on one horse she won, bt the other she came 5th.

generally our clear rounds are about £2/£2.50, and you always get a rossete. i think the most expebsive one i'e done is riding school clear round!! other prices are ok too, average is £6.50/£7 but RC jumping is £8

 

[Minxie]

Am I missing the point somewhere - if a class is 'open' then surely anyone is entitled to enter. At our RC show we have around 40 classes including 'fun' classes so there really is something for everyone. We certainly won't be turning competitors away for our open classes if their horse happens to have been placed at a more prestigious event. If its an open class it's open!
Also, a lot of RCs now run qualifiers for other shows, and that tends to attract a wider range of competitors.
Sorry OP for straying off the original subject. I think judges have a pretty difficult time tbh and don't get much thanks for the time and effort they put in. We have all seen decisions we would not personally agree with, but at the end of the day, as it says in the rules, the judges decision is final. Why not offer to steward for a judge at one of your local shows, to get an insight into how they reach their decisions?

I've never doubted anybody's right to enter. What I don't understand is why people who are regularly competing and winning in novice / elementary dressage (and higher) then go into an open prelim dressage class. Of course they would win - the judge would have no option as the chances are they will be far and away the best test but why bother - other than just for the rosette and to 'clean up'.

Like I said in the previous post I find it hilarious they need to do that. Personally I think its pretty gutless they choose to enter classes below their ability they don't enter the next class up and test themselves against better competition. I'd have thought it would be a better learning experience.

I also think its more likely to kill off classes as people would be sickened of competing when its not on a level playing field.

And before anybody runs to the 'your just jealous' nipple. Nope. My mare is on loan to my mate who is competing very well with her (in fair classes). I've yet to be at any competition where I haven't thought that we were taking the best horse home. I couldn't care less if she was a mule, she's very very special, hugely loved by everyone who meets her (especially the wee tots who are super chuffed to ride this massive pony that is super safe).

I don't compete so I couldn't care less if she wins or loses as long as they are having fun and doing something my mare seems to really enjoy that's what matters to me.

 

[Cobsndogs]

I have done a bit of probationary judging at local shows in the past, and have been told by other judges to stop 'pulling in' what I would call the proper type winners, and to give the children a chance as that is what the shows are for. No further comment from me on that !.

 

[LeneHorse]

I've never doubted anybody's right to enter. What I don't understand is why people who are regularly competing and winning in novice / elementary dressage (and higher) then go into an open prelim dressage class. Of course they would win - the judge would have no option as the chances are they will be far and away the best test but why bother - other than just for the rosette and to 'clean up'.

Sorry, I thought this thread was about biased showing judges, not who should be entering various dressage classes?
For what its worth, our RC also runs dressage shows and include a 'closed' prelim class in which horse/rider partnerships who have previously won a dressage test are ineligible to compete. We feel this gives genuine beginners the chance to compete in a class against similar opposition. And guess what, often it is the kid on the hairy pony that wins, not because they are 'cute' but because they do a consistent accurate test.

 

[Laafet]

QR - As a judge I feel I should add my little bit, I have heard some awful things in my time. Last show was a good case in note - when I went to get the rosettes I heard one of the bystanders going 'well the judge only like thin show pony types' - I had just pulled in the chunky cobby allrounder in first! This was in a RC pony class. Said pony was well turned out and had done a lovely show, was obedient and jumped the fence nicely. The second placed pony was nice but had not jumped the fence so well and when the child came out was crying as she had not come first (she was on a showy type pony) and then proceeded to rag said pony over the practice fence next to the arena a good few times before dragging it off to its vehicle. I was apalled. I also had with me a friend to steward and she was shocked at the standard of riding, overheight ponies and fatties. I will not put a fat horse above a well proportioned one, it is my little crusade and I once upset a vet by saying that his child had been placed down the line in a best condition class as he was carrying a little too much weight for my liking.

 

[Cobbysmum]

One other factor that as an organiser you can't do anything about, if you engage a decent judge, you find that they have a huge following, and will follow them to any show!

 

[moses06]

My problem with local shows in my area is that they are all becoming qualifiers for more prestigious shows, so those of us with average horses or ponies haven't got a hope in hell of being in the ribbons at all. Years ago the average horse and owner could be well turned out and do very well at their own level, but now all the pros are coming along and cleaning up, the fun element has gone, I remember when the local show was a lovely day out more of a social than a serious competiton.