Worming equest promax and sore foot

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Poppys Nannan

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I have just been reading a post in new lounge re short short hooves - poor horse and owner!

Reading through the posts there is mention of some wormers and in particular equest promax causing some 'footiness'

Can anyone shed any light on the incidence and reasoning behind this. Also we are planning on our yard to use equest promax this time - what are the alternatives.

Thanks for reading, i am a little cautious, i was finding best prices for the wormer just last night and don't want to be causing footiness in our horses.

Thanks:(
 
If your horse is shod, then you are unlikely to notice much difference, to be honest. If your horse is barefoot then yes, there is a chance that he could become footsore. My ex-TB was barefoot for a time whilst I rehabilitated the terribly hooves he came to me with and he definitely was sore after Pramox. Not the plain Equest, just with the addition of the tapewormer in it.

Have a look on the UKNHCP (barefoot) forum as there are some threads on there about your enquiry.
 
Second hand information but reasonably reliable - I understand that Pramox has very high levels of Praziquantel; far higher than a horse would receive if they were just being wormed with a single wormer rather than a combo.

Praziquantel has been shown to cause problems with blood glucose (in rats); so if you have an IR or otherwise sugar sensitive horse then I wouldn't be surprised if footiness were to result.

I know my own mare who is not IR but is sensitive to sugar reacted to Pramox and there is anecdotal evidence that this is not an isolated incident.
 
I have just read another post re equest promax probably causing colic in a horse with a result of the owner having to have the horse pts - so so sad!

What are other people using and why ?

Many thanks
 
My vet in discussion previously advised: worm count, if heavy worm burden then worm in stages so that you don't block exit to caecum with large volume of dead worms (impaction colic) and possibly laminitis from toxins.

In any event split your wormers up, so for example you do encysted worms one week, give a couple of weeks break and then do tape.
 
I second LucyPriory's post. I would use panacur (5 day) guard first always.
Do try and get an accurate weight so dosing is correct as well. Under dosing has problems as well as over dosing.
 
I'm not 100% sure of the reasons for a worming possibly causing sore hooves but I'll have a stab.
Wormers are strong chemicals and as such have a direct affect on the horses body. Any physiological disruption is often reflected in the hooves. Also when a horse is wormed, especially with the one hit types, if the worm burden is high there is a sudden massive die off of worms and consequent release of toxins (chemicals) from them into the bowel and then horses system, as well as the possibility of a quantity of dead worms balling together and forming a bolus in the bowel. I've often wondered if the toxins released also have an effect on the motility (movement) of the bowel as well, so contents aren't passed along normally.
I've covered colic a bit as well.
Do feel free to trash my thinking if it isn't accurate, anyone.
 
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amandap said:
I second LucyPriory's post. I would use panacur (5 day) guard first always.
Do try and get an accurate weight so dosing is correct as well. Under dosing has problems as well as over dosing.
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Actually mine had a reaction to the above, got gradually more and more footy over the 5 days and improved as soon as it was stopped.

The issue with pramox is that it is designed to be long acting so if your horse does react it could be 12 weeks before it is out of the system.
 
I'm sure there are a good few horses like yours, sensitive to panacur guard, criso.
Your experience emphasizes that horses are individual. All chemicals need treating with respect and less is more usually imo.
 
If you're using praziquantel, it's because you want to treat tapeworm. Worm egg counts are great for redworm, but they don't show tapeworm eggs - you have to have a blood test and ELISA to accurately guage tapeworm burden. I've found it too expensive to do this, so I worm once per year for tapeworm using a double dose of pyrantel - the best-known brand is Strongid-P, but there are cheaper wormers with the same active ingredient. I use worm egg counts the rest of the time, so they only get one worming per year.
 
Poppys Nannan said:
I have just read another post re equest promax probably causing colic in a horse with a result of the owner having to have the horse pts - so so sad!

What are other people using and why ?

Many thanks
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Are you sure it was the Pramox itself that caused the colic or was it that the horse had a high worm burden which on exiting the body after worming caused a blockage?

There are some very common misconceptions about worming and wormers and it is not always the product to blame.

But as others have said all horses are individual and what works for one might not work for others.
 
domane said:
If your horse is shod, then you are unlikely to notice much difference, to be honest. .
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My shod horse became very footy after worming with Bimectin earlier this year - went from happily walking over big stones and being fine to falling over when he stood on a stone, and becoming generally unhappy, grumpy and IIRC he got filled legs too. I wonder if part of the problem is that wormers are putting such a massive dose of chemicals in the system that it just upsets everything / upsets the hindgut balance maybe?

I thought it sounded crazy that the wormer could have affected him like that but did a bit of research and it seems fairly common. Kept him in for a week on only soaked hay and he was OK. The shape of his front feet changed during that time too - they had been improving (I changed his diet and farrier earlier this year and was slowly getting somewhere), developing a bit of concavity etc and now they are flat again :(
 
Would never use pramox.. it is far too agressive.. if high worm burden it is better to get rid of them slowly..

Wormers (all of them) disturb the gut to a greater or lesser extent allowing toxins to pass into the system .. this directly affects the hoof..

I would avoid using a mectin and praziquantel combined wormer..

You only need to worm for Tapes once a year

red worms can be managed by egg counts.
 
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