"Worried about daghters horse" Update!

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When I was 16 I was offered the ride on a very successful M&M show pony. She was stunning and had won lots and I felt really honoured. Shortly after starting to ride her and winning a few shows I had a terrible accident on her. I knew the owner wouldn't ride her but I was told it was because owner had a bad back.

I now know the real reason....!! Whilst mounting the mare she suddenly bolted before I had fully got on. I was thrown onto her backside and she bucked and bucked until I fell off. She then span round and attacked me with her front feet and teeth!! The result was a broken arm and a severed ear, the hat shattered and literally sliced my ear off.

There seemed to be no reason for this behaviour & although my parents insisted to the owner the mare was dangerous, the owner insisted that wasn't the case.

To cut a long story short, the mare then went on to KILL a 15yr old girl so I personally think you would be doing the right thing, I just wish the owner of the mare who hurt me had done the same and that girl would still be alive.

Good luck with your decision and DO NOT feel guilty, if someone decided to take Boomer on and it didn't work out I'm sorry to say that eventually his final journey in life could well be on a boat to France

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That's awful!
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If Boomer had started attacking her, he would have been gone a long time ago! He does buck untill he gets them off and bolts when mounting sometimes though. I think it is the right thing to do to put him to sleep. I mean if he wasn't so bad on the ground aswell I could have kept him on my friends farm as a companion just on grass, but he's too risky even then! Don't want him hurting someone getting their horse from the field or anything.
 
I am really pleased to read such a positive update
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And being a Mum myself I know I would be worried stiff about daughter having a horse such as Boomer - its just not worth the risk.

You sound like incredibly sensible and responsible owners, I wouldn't want to pass a dangerous horse onto anyone else either.
 
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In a similar situation. bought horse for hubby and daughter, had a call from a prev owner to let us know that he had previous history of being dangerous, cut a long story short, this particular horse has periods of being great then freaks and dumps rider. He has been very badly treated apparently. Had everything possible checked out, vet suggest PTS cant sell him as cant guarantee his future and also would never pass the problem as the last owner did ( they knew he had really hurt prev owners)
we have taken the view, because we love him to keep him as a companion and hopefully in time he will come right, I buy my horses for life and sometimes things do not plan out, we think we owe it to him to give him a chance. I know not everone would choose to do this and each person has to do what they think is best for them and their horses.

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That's exactly what Boomers like. I do admire you for keeping your horse. I did think of the companion route but he's dangerous on the ground and in the field he can sometimes go for someone (kicking etc) I never bought a horse to be a pet, just for my daughter to do a sport she loves and if she was older I she could ahve kept him and paid for him to be a non-ridden animal, I just don't ahve the money for him.
 
Pleased your daughter has now got a safe horse
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Regards Boomer, did you know when you bought him that he had behavourial problems?
Personally, I couldn't put a horse to sleep just because he wasn't well behaved. I'm not saying I would want to ride him if he's also naughty when ridden but maybe he just needs a more experienced handler/rider who's used to horses with issues.
Alternatively, could you find him a companion home?
 
I read your first post and I'm glad your daughter found a new horse
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I had a horse that I had to PTS due to being dangerous. At the start he was only dangerous with some people (randomly), then it became everyone but me and we tried to hang onto him, worked on him and got him checked out. Eventually he wouldn't even stop when I was there. We found out he had been kept as a stallion till he was 10 (attitude of a stallion) and we tried hormones but eventually he went over the top of them. Having 4 mares didn't really help but we couldn't risk selling him to someone not knowing what he would do, as he could turn from a split second etc. We PTS this summer and I feel that I did him justice, gave him a good life for what he had and in the end stopped him being pushed on to scary situations and potentially the meat man.
Sometimes its hard, you have to check every opportunity before you feel confident enough that you have done your hardest, but in the end you have to put yourself in their situation and ask if you would like to go to a different home every couple of weeks, and then onto the meat man. This helped me make a clear decision and I hope you work out what is best for you and your daughter.
Best of luck
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Boomer sounds very similar to a horse i knew last yr although we called him beamer! What does this horse look like? i heard he was passed through beeston sales around may 2009 ?? Is he a light bay TB type white star?
 
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But is the horse actually 'malicious' or is it yet another case of an over-horsed teenager?
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If the trainer has been subkect to the same behaviour as the daugher then I would think not.

Some horses are just not meant to be ridden, and to be honest would be best left wild!

When I worked at a local stud farm they had a young horse one year who was very very dangerous. e would attack other horses and people, and cows/sheep etc. In a stable he was a lunatic. He would lunge out of the door, kick rear, squal paw etc etc. TO get him in or out he has to be hearded.

The vet advised that he was PTS as he was a stallion, and no one could get close enough to him. He was darted for the Vet to examine him.

I reckon it was his breeding that made him like that as his sire was a nutter to. Had to be handled by 2 people in hats. back protectors each with a lead rope to a stallion bit and carrying a stick. In the stable you had to wear the hat and back protector to muck out and like 4 layers as he would bite you.
 
I was in a similar situation to you recently except the horse was a serial rearer, in addition to doing the other stuff you describe. I'm going to see an osteopath tomorrow due to landing on my neck on concrete on one of the falls I had from him. He was also dangerous to lead and an expert professional rider also experienced the same behaviour. Teeth, back and saddle all 100%. Fortunatley the dealer I bought him from took him back and exchanged him for me. I went through exactly the same stages as you and decided that I would PTS as I did not want someone being paralysed or killed on my conscience. He was not suitable as a companion as he was too finely bred and needed to live in at nights in winter and was also too beautiful and young a horse not to tempt someone to ride him. If it had been a mare, I would not have kept for breeding - I would not want to breed from those traits.

Just one thing I would question - because your daughter is a teenager and you describe the horse as "so big" (16.1 is not big, its an average sized horse), to be fair to the horse, I would send him away for some professional schooling for a month to 6 weeks to see if he displays the same behaviour.
 
My current horse was very dangerous when I got her and tried to kill me on a number of occasions. She wasn't just bad when she was ridden but also on the ground and in the field. It got to the point were she was just to dangerous and I wouldn't go anywhere near her unless absolutely necassary. I had pretty much decided to have her put so sleep as I just couldn't cope with her and couldn't have her hurting anyone else on the yard.
However a very experienced family friend came out with a girl who 'would ride anything' my mare had her off before she could walk half a 20m circle and the girl refused to get back on. To cut a long story short he helped me with her and got me back on her and refused to let me get rid of her. I'm so glad he did so as she is an absolute angel now (well a lot of the time anyway). She's by no means perfect and she still bucks and bolts and tries to rear but I wouldn't change her for the world. And not having her PTS was the best decision I ever made!
So I'm sorry this post got long but I guess what I'm trying to say is there is always hope. And I now definatly believe in giving horses a chance. Obviously is you don't have the experience or the money to get someone with the experience it's hard and it shouldn't be something you do alone. But PTS is not the only option for 'problem' horses. Good luck with what ever you decided but I just wanted you to know these things can work out.
 
Congratulations on the new horse.
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I hope you're daughter enjoys him - it's what horses should be about . It shouldn't be dangerous, stressful or frightening.

I too would be an advocate of having him put to sleep, providing you've explored all the avenues of cause.

He's a horse - he has no concept of being 'put to sleep'. He will come in, be given a big dinner and lot of carrots, then some human will come up to him, give him a pat and a small prick in the neck, before he falls asleep and never wakes up. It's tragically sad for US as humans, but he will be happy and safe once he's gone.

For that reason i would have no qualms about putting a dangerous horse to sleep. It would be the responsible thing to do. Incredibly difficult and sad, but the bravest and most responsible thing you can do.

It would highly IRRESONSIBLE to pass him onto someone else - he's unlikely to be happy and could potentially hurt or kill someone. There's plenty of Do-Gooders out there would will acuss you of cruelty blah blah blah, but I doubt if THEY are willing to take him on as a responsibility and keep him forever.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
 
^^^^^^^^^^ WHAT SHE SAYS!! ^^^^^^^^^^

It's a decision I hope I will never have to face, but if I were to, I would want to do everything possible to ensure the welfare of the horse.

To PTS a dangerous horse is alot more humane, then him falling into the wrong hands at a sale. Getting beaten because his psychological problems are misunderstood as general behavioural issues which these people may think 'can be beaten out of them'....

Then you go down the line of the possibilty of him hurting someone... killing them.

Whether you sell him, give him away or loan him out - it boils down to him and other people being in a serious, problematic and dangerous situation.
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Looking at the bigger picture, sometimes PTS is the kindest thing for everyone involved.

Hope you don't feel pressured in any way, it should be your decision, good luck xx
 
HHO at its best - sensible advice, little in the way of condemnation, heartfelt sympathy for your dilemma and genuine care and support for you in your unenviable position.

I too think that PTS is the very kindest, most sensible course of action for a genuinely and irreparably damaged horse which is either a danger to itself and others or terminally in discomfort. It is also the hardest thing to settle with your conscience. After all, he'd be a perfectly fine horse if he was as they were intended - part of a herd running wild and without intervention or demands from humans. This is the part I personally struggle with - having to remove the horses who don't conform to our wishes or desires.

I wish you well in a particularly difficult situation with a decision you alone can make - I'd go with everyone else who says PTS if professionals who know horses tell you he is truly one of those who could never be rehabilitated.

Enjoy your new horse and put this experience down to, well, experience.
 
Congratulations on your new purchase and as for boomer, I think you're making a very responsible decision. There is no doubt that SOME difficult horses CAN be changed with a change in management and or career however there are some that can't and some of those end up being passed from pillar to post because of itr until some brave person has the courage to deal with it in a responsible manner.
 
I too think that you are being very brave and responsible.I won't say don't fret about having Boomer PTS, because I know you will do, but you have given him every chance and are doing your best by him.Good luck to your daughter and her new horse.Hope they enjoy each other.
 
Congrats on your new horse I hope your daughter has an easier time now and enjoys riding more.

I would like to think that most horses given time and the correct owner will come round, but know that this is not always going to happen.

Is there anyone you know (that is very experenced with retraining problem horses) that would take him on and see if they can work with him?
I know you dont want him passed piller to post but could you not give him on loan with view to buy to someone who has delt with real problem horses and see if they can do anything with him?
I know this is not always an option and wish you well with whatever you decide, you know your horse.
 
Personally I couldn't have a healthy horse PTS just because it couldn't/wouldn't do what I wanted. But, then again I (well my family) have the luxury of having our own land so we could just turn a horse like that away.

I would want to try and find out more about the horse's history, I don't believe a horse is naturally 'evil' so I would want to know what was the trigger for the behaviour. I would also look at getting someone in to help - someone who knows about problem horses. I would maybe even resort to the route of an animal communicator (well some people on here seem to say they have had a fair bit of luck).

I believe every animal deserves a chance. No, I don't think you should pass the problem onto anyone else but I sure as hell want to know I'd done all I could before I decided to end an animal's life. Maybe I'm different than the majority on here as I keep animals for life and have bought an unsuitable, neurotic pony in the past and, 15 years later still have him and he is sooo much better although still quirky. I know he has been mistreated in the past and I think he may also have been involved in some accident although I don't know what. I know he was a jumping pony and then ended up being passed through dealers within a short space of time.

I think these days there are a lot of people out there with different approches to understanding horse behaviour so I do think it's worthwhile at least trying to get to the bottom of it.
 
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Pleased your daughter has now got a safe horse
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Regards Boomer, did you know when you bought him that he had behavourial problems?
Personally, I couldn't put a horse to sleep just because he wasn't well behaved. I'm not saying I would want to ride him if he's also naughty when ridden but maybe he just needs a more experienced handler/rider who's used to horses with issues.
Alternatively, could you find him a companion home?

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Well when we tried him, he was a bit spooky but didn't show any problems and seemed lazy, the trainer thinks they may have drugged him and tired him out. I tried to contact the old owners a few times and they blank the calls and don't respond to emails or anything.
 
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Personally I couldn't have a healthy horse PTS just because it couldn't/wouldn't do what I wanted. But, then again I (well my family) have the luxury of having our own land so we could just turn a horse like that away.



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I don't think (and I could be wrong) that the OP says the horse is merely not as good as they had hoped. Some horses are truly dangerous, and are NOT safe to be handled by people, let alone a 16-year old girl. This horse is also dangerous in the field - so "turning away" sounds like a still-risky option.

It comes down to whether the horse's life is worth more than a human life, and I'm afraid, terrible animal softy as I am, I would value a human life higher than a horse life. If this horse is truly as dangerous as it sounds, then I think PTS is a fair option. Yes, the horse must have a lot of psychological issues, but how many times are people going to be injured in trying to get to the bottom of them?
 
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Boomer sounds very similar to a horse i knew last yr although we called him beamer! What does this horse look like? i heard he was passed through beeston sales around may 2009 ?? Is he a light bay TB type white star?

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He is light bay yes, but doesn't have a star and is a bit chunkier than a full TB.

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Just one thing I would question - because your daughter is a teenager and you describe the horse as "so big" (16.1 is not big, its an average sized horse), to be fair to the horse, I would send him away for some professional schooling for a month to 6 weeks to see if he displays the same behaviour.

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I only describe the horse as "so big" as our old one was 13.2 i think and I don't handle horses much so to be holding this thing trying to kick me, he seemed huge! I know he is average size for most people though, I'm just a wimp
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. He is having some prefessional training at the min also, he hasn't been sent away though - he comes to us.

Also I think some people think we are novice owners, which I probably am to be fair. But we have had horses for over 10 years so I hope we don't sound to bad! I just wanted to clear up, we didn't jump from a 13.2 to a 16.1, my daughter rides for other people in the school and at shows (as hers was really to small but she didnt want to sell him!) so she has had plenty of experince on bigger horses.
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I'm not saying she is an amazing rider or anything, just that we didn't just get a 16.1 out of the blue. Sorry if I rambled!
 
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sorry, but I cant believe that you think thats a solution for your horse, you took on the responsibiliy of him, and just because you want a new one, thats a real sad day for your old horse.. (dont you have any feelings?)

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Tamba..... get over it......clearly you have never had the misfortune to know / own a dangerous horse!
Many of these horses do actually have phsyical problems that are not found until after they are PTS.
It would be both unforgivable and unbearable to pass on a animal with issues such as this. Far better a certain fate than an uncertain future IMO

To the OP - PTS is absolutely the right decision
 
I know the feeling well. Have considered this option for LL. Have decided to keep him as none of us are ready to let him go, though he is fully retired at fourteen.

In our case, if LL was dangerous to handle, which he isn't other than the odd moment (in which case one just lets go of the rope!), then I would not hesitate to have him pts. As others have said, to a horse it's a big feed full of lovely things, a gentle prick in the neck, then a deep sleep that is never woken up from. He would have not concept of what was to come. There would be no 'afterwards' for him to suffer in. The human that is left, well, each would handle in their own way.
 
Boomer sounds very similar to a horse i knew last yr although we called him beamer! What does this horse look like? i heard he was passed through beeston sales around may 2009 ?? Is he a light bay TB type white star?


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He is light bay yes, but doesn't have a star and is a bit chunkier than a full TB.

Ok thanks ! This horse i talk about had issues like yours and i believe the best and kindest thing would have been for him to be pts the owners passed him through the sales and i very often wonder where the poor sod is now and what he has suffered over the last few months for his problems. I think your being responsible, some horses are better off .
 
if youu dont feel happy about re selling (and the consequences between a selling livery (agent) and yourself) then do the right thing and PTS. never to be resold, never a danger to himself and others, never to be beaten to a pulp, never to troll through the markets, etc. dont beat yourself up about it! just do it and be at peace with yourself! a hard choice but he is NOT suitable as a companion or anything else!
 
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sorry, but I cant believe that you think thats a solution for your horse, you took on the responsibiliy of him, and just because you want a new one, thats a real sad day for your old horse.. (dont you have any feelings?)

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Tamba..... get over it......clearly you have never had the misfortune to know / own a dangerous horse!
Many of these horses do actually have phsyical problems that are not found until after they are PTS.
It would be both unforgivable and unbearable to pass on a animal with issues such as this. Far better a certain fate than an uncertain future IMO

To the OP - PTS is absolutely the right decision

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eh, excuse me, but when did it become the situation, that one is not allowed to express one's opinion. Thats my opinion, and if that doesnt suit you, TOUGH!!!
I dont agree with putting a healthy horse to sleep, and we dont know personally what the horse or rider is like, so you cant tell someone, thats fine, yes, just kill the horse,
I think only a prefessional, who cant judge the situation in person, could decide what the best future is for the horse.
 
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sorry, but I cant believe that you think thats a solution for your horse, you took on the responsibiliy of him, and just because you want a new one, thats a real sad day for your old horse.. (dont you have any feelings?)

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Tamba..... get over it......clearly you have never had the misfortune to know / own a dangerous horse!
Many of these horses do actually have phsyical problems that are not found until after they are PTS.
It would be both unforgivable and unbearable to pass on a animal with issues such as this. Far better a certain fate than an uncertain future IMO

To the OP - PTS is absolutely the right decision

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eh, excuse me, but when did it become the situation, that one is not allowed to express one's opinion. Thats my opinion, and if that doesnt suit you, TOUGH!!!

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It appears that OTHER people's opinions don't suit YOU.

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I dont agree with putting a healthy horse to sleep, and we dont know personally what the horse or rider is like, so you cant tell someone, thats fine, yes, just kill the horse,
I think only a prefessional, who cant judge the situation in person, could decide what the best future is for the horse.

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Would you like to take him on yourself? What would you do if he were yours?
 
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sorry, but I cant believe that you think thats a solution for your horse, you took on the responsibiliy of him, and just because you want a new one, thats a real sad day for your old horse.. (dont you have any feelings?)

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Tamba..... get over it......clearly you have never had the misfortune to know / own a dangerous horse!
Many of these horses do actually have phsyical problems that are not found until after they are PTS.
It would be both unforgivable and unbearable to pass on a animal with issues such as this. Far better a certain fate than an uncertain future IMO

To the OP - PTS is absolutely the right decision

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eh, excuse me, but when did it become the situation, that one is not allowed to express one's opinion. Thats my opinion, and if that doesnt suit you, TOUGH!!!

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It appears that OTHER people's opinions don't suit YOU.

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I dont agree with putting a healthy horse to sleep, and we dont know personally what the horse or rider is like, so you cant tell someone, thats fine, yes, just kill the horse,
I think only a prefessional, who cant judge the situation in person, could decide what the best future is for the horse.

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Would you like to take him on yourself? What would you do if he were yours?

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THere wouldnt be one horse standing in my yard, if I put to sleep every horse with problems,
Im sure, maybe not on this forum, but some people take some time to work with their horses, I already had a 17.2, who bolted, bucked, spinning on hacks, etc, hes now completely bomb proof, with some patience,
Im not suggesting that everyone will put in time, but someone might be happy to do that.
its my opinion, surely everyone is entitled to an opinion.
 
Thats all very well and good Tamba - well done for turning around that horse - but have you thought about the fact that the OP's horse may well end up in the hands of someone not so gifted as you, the OP cannot possibly ensure a home for life if she gives this horse to someone else. She has already said that their trainer (a professional) has stated that there is no certain future for the horse.

You have to remember that once a horse has gone, its gone. Its not cruel, its not going to look down from rainbow bridge with a huge grudge and chip on its shoulder wishing it had lived longer to experience the sales rings!
 
Yes, tampa, someone might be willing to do that, but i personally couldn't live with myself if I sold a horse, even to an owner aware of the issues, and then it killed them. If you can sleep at night, then good luck.

Some horses are fixable, some are not. Some people can have counselling, some are serial rapists etc. for whom there is no fix, and the best solution is to remove them from society to protect them and others. Since prison for horses neither exists nor is desirable, I'd personally think PTS is a brave and sensible decision, and certainly the only one I'd make in the situation.

And BTW, above you say if a pro has assessed it- I believe if you read the 6/7 pages of thread regarding this horse, a pro has said PTS. I may be incorrect, but that is certainly how I understood it.

We've all had horses we've worked through, and a few of us have had to admit that our horses were too dangerous to work with. Please don't use that tone about 'some' people work through things, as it implies the OP and others on here do not, which is simply not the case. the OP has put time, effort, a fair amount of money and a hell of a lot of worry into working it through, and it has not helped.

Op- I hope the solution you seem to have come to does not weigh to heavy on your heart. I would PTs if it were me, as my life is not worth the risk.
 
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