Would you class her as dangerous?

[diamonddogs]

As a retired 'professional' I've witnessed numerous folk 'waterskiing' behind Shetlands and similar.... Headcollars don't put you in command, you handle any horse only with its permission and anyone who thinks otherwise fools only himself. A lot of 'horsey woes' are down purely to the increasing levels of restraint we think we need to control our mounts.

To control any horse you merely need to interact with a pound and a half of the animal... once that relationship is formed you can do anything with the horse, whether it is adorned with a collar, or just standing free. To quote Harry Whitney, "It's easier to direct a thought, than it is to drive a horse."

^^^This! ^^^

 

[Equilibrium Ireland]

Pulling faces won't get me killed. Do not lecture me on horses as individuals. I know. Backing up to kick you is too late. That is clear. Nobody thinks their horses are spoiled. Fortunately I chose to learn from my failings. Had to admit I was wrong. The majority of people think they have timing. They talk about it but don't really. This leads to bad behavoirs with the the best of intentions. Like me or can't stand me, it doesn't bug me. I have had actually real life dealings hands on/riding of over a thousand horses. But mostly I don't hang here anymore because it's the same ole stuff. And too much going on in real life. I've met great people here and keep up with them on FB. This here is sometimes exhausting having

to be PC.

Terri

 

[mandwhy]

She just sounds like a dominant mare, no need to get hysterical about it. My mare does things like this about twice a year when she thinks I need testing, with lunging to bite me, circling me, trying to get me against the fence. Of course it is unacceptable and duly dealt with, it only happens when dealing with her loose in the field, unfortunately in the 'amateur horse world' some of us have to do things like walk through the field to get to the feed shed, or cross the field to go get the wheelbarrow. We don't expect to be attacked when doing so but sometimes horses surprise us and we have to remind them that such things are unacceptable.

My mare has never made contact, not that I would let it get to that stage, and although she behaves in a threatening manner on these occasions she has never so much as bitten me unlike other horses I have met. She very rarely even puts her ears back. She does not respond well to overreaction and shouting and being aggressive is a good way of getting her to rear or come at you, but of course you need to be very firm and insist on boundaries.

I think dominant horses are fascinating, I know another mare that is like this through bad treatment in the past, but alas my mare is just a dominant cow that you have to be careful with.

She also has a sensitive stomach so it is important to keep her happy from the inside, and it is more likely to happen when she is getting cold due to turbulent weather, even though she should be able to live unrugged all year round, one of many reasons why it is important to know your individual horse. There are probably a few like this in the 'overheight pony' category.

 

[littleshetland]

Pulling faces won't get me killed. Do not lecture me on horses as individuals. I know. Backing up to kick you is too late. That is clear. Nobody thinks their horses are spoiled. Fortunately I chose to learn from my failings. Had to admit I was wrong. The majority of people think they have timing. They talk about it but don't really. This leads to bad behavoirs with the the best of intentions. Like me or can't stand me, it doesn't bug me. I have had actually real life dealings hands on/riding of over a thousand horses. But mostly I don't hang here anymore because it's the same ole stuff. And too much going on in real life. I've met great people here and keep up with them on FB. This here is sometimes exhausting having

to be PC.

Terri

EI- I think your above post was referring to one I put up earlier (you mention the face pulling reference).

I certainly didn't mean to sound like I was lecturing you - apologies for that. I thought I was posting in the spirit of debate. You sound very much like you know what you're talking about - I was just 'up' for a chat -thats all.
I do agree with you tho - it can be a bit of diplomatic minefield on here sometimes, PC can be exhausting!

Best wishes.

 

[Elsbells]

As a retired 'professional' I've witnessed numerous folk 'waterskiing' behind Shetlands and similar.... Headcollars don't put you in command, you handle any horse only with its permission and anyone who thinks otherwise fools only himself. A lot of 'horsey woes' are down purely to the increasing levels of restraint we think we need to control our mounts

To control any horse you merely need to interact with a pound and a half of the animal... once that relationship is formed you can do anything with the horse, whether it is adorned with a collar, or just standing free. To quote Harry Whitney, "It's easier to direct a thought, than it is to drive a horse."

Love this. You talk a lot of good sense Urban horse.

 

[coen]

Definitely not.
May not be ideal but easily manageable.

 

[SnowPhony]

Not dangerous...but bad mannered.

I had a highland on loan who had clearly been allowed to get away with throwing his weight around. One day when I tried catching him he turned his fat backside on me, ears pinned back and started backing up. I wasn't standing for his bullying and stood my ground whilst frantically searching my pockets for something to defend myself with....found a conker so took aim at his sizeable bum. Gave him quite a shock and he was an absolute angel to catch after that

 

[SpringArising]

She is fine around her food. In fact she has never as so much put an ear back on the yard.

She won't charge at you or anything so I wouldn't say she is danger to anyone else (unless of course you want to catch her) people go in and out then field all the time turning out/bringing in their own Horses or to poo pick, in fact I've always had compliments about how laid back and sweet she is in the field.

It's just when she thinks she is coming in. Again she won't chargeor anything, just turn her bum on you, and keep doing it until she gives in. She kicks when you swing something at her bum or use a whip.

Last summer when I used to circle her, it was very rare she did actually kick out. I didn't allow her to eat, just kept walking until she stopped turning.

I must admit, it sounds as though you are defending her. It doesn't matter if she's perfect in all other ways, the fact is she kicks and it should have been nipped in the bud the first time it happened. What if a child unknowingly went near her with a head collar and she lashed out?

 

[LaurenBay]

Thought I'd update you all.

Ruby has been in new field for 3 weeks now. The first day I put her out, I went to catch her and couldn't get near her, she didn't kick or turn her bum on me. Just kept running away. I had to leave in the end. Went back up in afternoon to poo pick and I made a fuss of the others and then I walked to her gave her a fuss and walked away.

Was dreading the evening as all her friends were out. So imagine my shock when she walked over to me! Lots of praise and a treat.

She has been an angel since! I've treated every time shes come to me. And touch wood I've not had an issue with her turning her bum.

Im shocked that she has changed so much, although I do feel like this is the year we have finally clicked.

I didnt want to speak before as thought it may be a fluke, but for 3 weeks I've been able to catch her straight away.

Long may it continue!

 

[Molly'sMama]

Wow. Well done New field, new her, maybe
Hope it continues. x

 

[myponyvic]

I wouldn't say dangerous, just without respect in certain situations. If you say she is good apart from that then she's not dangerous. Dangerous to me is the point where they have hospitalised someone and definitely meant to. I think your horse just needs some manners. The situations in which she puts you and other people are dangerous, but your horse on a whole isn't to me, dangerous.
At my livery / RS yard, we have a mare named Lilly. She is evil. Literally, evil. She is the only horse that you couldn't pay me enough money to go in the field with. She has chronic pain in her right side though but her owner will have non of it. I've seen her owner be kicked and bitten by her. I don't think she's ever been ridden at our yard because of her behaviour. That, to me, is extremely dangerous.

 

[GlitterPup]

Another who would vote dangerous - Sorry x

 

[Spring Feather]

Excellent! I'm glad it's all starting to resolve itself :smile3:

 

[TarrSteps]

Glad to hear things are turning around.

Is she in with the same group of horses?

 

[honetpot]

I would class her as a bossy mare that could be potentially dangerous with the wrong handling, like most horses. I am always surprised when people are surprised that horses have opinions and needs of their own and being with humans is not their main purpose in life.
I have an old pony club schoolmaster who will barge out the stable, he could flatten a child and a lot of adults, my friend can not cope with him for her he is a problem, yet he practically perfect in every other way. His problem is managed so he is not a problem for the people who handle him, but we did get some raised eyebrows when we used to take him to PC camp and had to back him into the stable and then barricade the door on the first day.
If I had a £1 for every time a horse or pony turned its bum to me in the stable I would have a nice nest egg. They are telling you something, usually b**** off, usually its as simple as going away and getting a carrot to get them to come to you. I think I would not chastise her for kicking out if she was mine as it make her do it more and imprints the behaviour and escalates the situation.
I am glad there are other people that 'chase off' to catch a reluctant to catch horse. I usually throw a feed bucket at them, it looks less aggressive to the passing watcher and there is now way the horse can be afraid of a feed bucket that is normally used for food.

 

[misskk88]

She is the only horse that you couldn't pay me enough money to go in the field with. She has chronic pain in her right side though but her owner will have non of it.

So Sad that the owner will not do right by the horse. In these circumstances, you can understand the reason for agression

 

[LaurenBay]

Yes same group of Horses (3 other mares, who get along really well)

 

[Urban Horse]

I am glad there are other people that 'chase off' to catch a reluctant to catch horse. I usually throw a feed bucket at them, it looks less aggressive to the passing watcher and there is now way the horse can be afraid of a feed bucket that is normally used for food.

Some of the current generation of 'New Age' trainers will tell you that horses live in a constant state of fear, but that's only because they're trying to sell you on their methods or training schemes. In truth horses live in a state of heightened awareness (a state we've largely grown out of due to our ill constructed belief that we are the masters of all we survey), but that state's continually balanced by their need to identify and classify things that they either find, or encounter in their world. In general, horses are afraid of only two things, the unknown, and the known behaving in an unknown way.... hence the reaction to your thrown feed bucket... it has become the known, acting in an unknown way. Were that not the case, throwing the bucket at them would have little or no effect.

I find it more than a little sad that the downside of today's NH practices is that people have to force horses into a situation where they have to be 'driven off' in order to be caught.... If looked at from the horses point of view, it merely tells them the consequences of their actions in refusing to be caught are something that they fear. I would hate to get to a point with any horse where it stayed with me because it feared what might happen if it didn't, that goes against everything I believe in and I find it morally wrong. In truth it's so easy to form relationships and bonds with an animal that is driven to investigate its surroundings and the people it encounters.

 

[Ladyinred]

I find it more than a little sad that the downside of today's NH practices is that people have to force horses into a situation where they have to be 'driven off' in order to be caught.... If looked at from the horses point of view, it merely tells them the consequences of their actions in refusing to be caught are something that they fear. I would hate to get to a point with any horse where it stayed with me because it feared what might happen if it didn't, that goes against everything I believe in and I find it morally wrong. In truth it's so easy to form relationships and bonds with an animal that is driven to investigate its surroundings and the people it encounters.

Too true! I would hate for my girls to stay with me because they were frightened not to. I would rather give up horses and take up knitting.

 

[honetpot]

My idea of chasing a horse to catch it is not to frighten it, far from it I want it eventually to stand still or come to me. They want to stay in the field and eat and not be caught, moving them on stops them from eating. They are rewarded with a carrot and scratch when they stand still and are caught, if they move off when you approach they sent on again, so they end up doing more work than you. No NH for me, came to this method through 40 years of catching ponies that often other people couldn't. As to throwing a feed bucket, usually used in a bigger area where clicking and saying trot on would have little effect, and the devil has stuck its nose in the grass for yet another mouthful. I find ponies are very smart they get the picture very quickly, there would be no point in trying to use this method if the animal was frightened of you.