would you do this

I am in two minds with regards to this.

If the owner decided to have her veteran PTS because she worried about the future health and safety of her horse then I think fair enough.

On a personal note I would not PTS my vetran just because I could not ride him. I believe that there is more to the realtionship I have with my horse, he is not just for riding he is my friend and sometimes my confidant so I would be happy just spending time with him and grooming him. If his health deteriorated and I had to make the dfecision I would obviously make the best decision with regards to welfare that I could.

The flip side of this is that I have been through something similar recently - totally different circumstances but I knew of a perfectly healthy horse that I would have had and taken care of and probably would have kept him for the rest of his life (he was only 11) had I even been consulted before he was destroyed. In fact I can not get past the thought that I wish I had followed my gut instinct and tried to save him :( I just thought that his so called owner would not have stooped that low :(
 
156 replies when really all that needed to be said was
*yes/no I *would\wouldn't do this but respect the woman's right to have her horse pts :)
* delete as applicable

;) but gosh that would be so un HHO and very boring:)
 
Things is though, OP says the horse was healthy and owner was overhorsed. There was no mention of financial hardship or it being a problem horse. This was a horse that could have been loaned/sold or simply ridden by someone competent or put into retirement.
The owner chose to end its life because she didn't want it anymore.
Whether or not, this is true, we do not know, but the deabte can only centre around the moral dilemma we were given.

Sick, injured or problem horses and/or poverty stricken owners are another debate.

I too, am interested in how vets view PTS, healthy horses from owners who are overhorsed.
 
Wagtail said:
Well I find that very sad. It is not practical for me to keep my current 'broken' horse. I now face not being able to have my own horse to ride. But I make a commitment to all the animals I take on, that if I possibly can, they are with me for life, or until they have to be PTS for humane reasons. If the vet tells me he is not paddock sound he will be PTS, but he looks to be fine in the paddock and so he has a home with me until he is not. I am gutted. Absolutely gutted that this has happened to me twice in two years and that the horse I bought to replace my retired mare is now, barring miracles going to be a second field ornament. But if I had him PTS it would be purely for selfish reasons and I really couldn't do it. If I could then yes, I would be hard.
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Wagtail,

Despite us disagreeing on this thread and on others about similar subjects I am in your position right now. I have two retired horses at livery and as a result cannot afford a riding horse. Hey ho that's the way the cookie crumbles and I choose and am happy to keep my 'useless' expensive pets despite desperately missing riding. However, I am very aware that if there is any drop in my income, keeping them will become impossible and to me, PTS is the only responsible alternative. IF they were in work/ridable they could be sold (very last resort) or loaned to ease the financial burden...no longer an option.

I have seen the treatment that people get on the average yard when they pts an animal that isn't obviously on its last legs and through all the judgy pants, nastiness and bitching that goes on I never once seen any of those people step forward and offer to take that animal on - it's always that somebody else should do something! Maybe I'm a little touchy on the subject because of this?
 
I have a horse, 11yrs old, fit and healthy. He is a fabulous little competition horse, just can be a total **** on the ground. If he is handled competently, he will stay within the boundaries of politeness - most of the time. I have been trying to sell/loan him for almost five years, having had him since he was four. He has been away, come back, been away again, and is currently back. There seems to be a distinct lack of what I call "proper" horsemen about. I am now in the position where I am about to lose my grazing, and cannot afford livery costs. I love this boy to bits, and it is so frustrating because he can be brilliant. However, if I couldn't keep him, and finding a new home is proving pretty impossible, I would seriously consider having him put down. There is no way I would risk him going somewhere where he couldn't be handled, and ending up abused or neglected. It would break my heart, either way.
 
dunkley said:
I have a horse, 11yrs old, fit and healthy. He is a fabulous little competition horse, just can be a total **** on the ground. If he is handled competently, he will stay within the boundaries of politeness - most of the time. I have been trying to sell/loan him for almost five years, having had him since he was four. He has been away, come back, been away again, and is currently back. There seems to be a distinct lack of what I call "proper" horsemen about. I am now in the position where I am about to lose my grazing, and cannot afford livery costs. I love this boy to bits, and it is so frustrating because he can be brilliant. However, if I couldn't keep him, and finding a new home is proving pretty impossible, I would seriously consider having him put down. There is no way I would risk him going somewhere where he couldn't be handled, and ending up abused or neglected. It would break my heart, either way.
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I have one of these. What made my mind up about his future if I couldn't keep him was when Spindles Farm came to light. There is no way in hell I'm going to take a risk that any animal who was my responsibility could end up somewhere like that.
 
tinpot said:
as to AMYMAY and ENFYS and FLOCK i have alredy said that the horse had nothing wrong with she was just not a plod along what the woman needs and may i also add. she is a very good friend of mine for many years and its just i disagree with what has happened and just wanted some views.
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Very good friend.:eek: Lucky, lucky her. Did you say all this to her face to face then?
 
The thing is, none of us here actually know why the horse was PTS. What the OP said sounds like (hurtful) gossip to me.

My aunt has just had her lovely 12 year old dog PTS. He looked totally healthy, but he had cancer that would have killed him painfully. There's no saying the mare didn't have something like that going on.
 
meandmyself said:
The thing is, none of us here actually know why the horse was PTS. What the OP said sounds like (hurtful) gossip to me.

My aunt has just had her lovely 12 year old dog PTS. He looked totally healthy, but he had cancer that would have killed him painfully. There's no saying the mare didn't have something like that going on.
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Agreed. I'm sorry, OP, but it's rather hard to believe what you say. You post about "what a woman at yard done" but then tell us she's your "very good friend".

Am I being cynical by saying those two statements don't seem to add up?
 
FionaM12 said:
Agreed. I'm sorry, OP, but it's rather hard to believe what you say. You post about "what a woman at yard done" but then tell us she's your "very good friend".

Am I being cynical by saying those two statements don't seem to add up?
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Nope! I think it would be very interesting to get the other person on here and get her side of he story.
 
I really hate getting involved in these sorts of posts.

Making a decision to put a horses down is never on a whim. The pain, worry and anxiety is like nothing else. You only ever get to see the exterior of an owner's thoughts and very rarely see how the decision has been made.

Don't judge. Try to understand. If you decide to call anyone, call her and ask if she needs any support.
 
cbmcts said:
Wagtail,

Despite us disagreeing on this thread and on others about similar subjects I am in your position right now. I have two retired horses at livery and as a result cannot afford a riding horse. Hey ho that's the way the cookie crumbles and I choose and am happy to keep my 'useless' expensive pets despite desperately missing riding. However, I am very aware that if there is any drop in my income, keeping them will become impossible and to me, PTS is the only responsible alternative. IF they were in work/ridable they could be sold (very last resort) or loaned to ease the financial burden...no longer an option.

I have seen the treatment that people get on the average yard when they pts an animal that isn't obviously on its last legs and through all the judgy pants, nastiness and bitching that goes on I never once seen any of those people step forward and offer to take that animal on - it's always that somebody else should do something! Maybe I'm a little touchy on the subject because of this?
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Then your situation is COMPLETELY different from the lady described in the OP. I too would have my retired horses PTS if I could no longer afford them and could not rehome them with someone I trusted 100%.

I don't think anyone is critisising people who have horses PTS for their own good. The example given is a horse that is fit and healthy and by the sound of it would make an ideal teenager's riding club horse. The woman was not competent enough to ride it and so rather than bothering to find it a new home just eliminiated the problem by having the horse disposed of. Also, it is not the first time she has done this.

Now none of us know all the facts when ANYONE posts ANYTHING. Therefore we have to take it at face value when discussing it until proved otherwise.
 
Wagtail - where on earth in this thread has anything been said that would make you come to the conclusion that this horse would have been an "ideal teenagers rioding club horse", because I'm damned if I can see it.
On the basis of the facts given we have no idea whether this was a novice owner who couldn't face up to her own lack of ability or an extremely experienced horse woman who recognised that the horse had come to the end of the road.
We have no idea whether Tinpot is the sort of owner who thinks a horse should be phoning the Vet itself before it is put down or whether the owner is a callous bitch who regards a horse in the same way as a kleenex.
We have no idea whether the other horse pts was a healthy 5yo or was pts as a result of a broken leg/ragwort poisoning/twisted gut etc etc.
Even if we feel we have the right to judge the owner we simply do not have the facts to be able to do so.
FWIW I would be loath to sell a 20yo - I've been to markets a & seen oldies there and wanted to wallop the owners for not taking responsibility for their end. Loaning isn't always practical - if you don't have your own land you may not be able to take them back in an emergency. I shouldn't think a month goes by on this forum without a tale of how someone has had to go & fetch back a mistreated loan horse back there & then.
 
Wagtail said:
The woman was not competent enough to ride it and so rather than bothering to find it a new home just eliminiated the problem by having the horse disposed of. Also, it is not the first time she has done this.

Now none of us know all the facts when ANYONE posts ANYTHING. Therefore we have to take it at face value when discussing it until proved otherwise.
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I take your point that we generally accept the facts as presented, Wagtail. I suggest in this case most of us find it hard to imagine anyone could be so callous as to dispose of her horse as she can't be bothered to home it, so we wonder is there more to it.

Also the OP only says "it's not the first she's pts this year" but doesn't say why the other one was. It could have been unavoidable.

IF it's true that this person did as you suggest above, I'm sure everyone in this thread would be horrified.
 
hairycob said:
Wagtail - where on earth in this thread has anything been said that would make you come to the conclusion that this horse would have been an "ideal teenagers rioding club horse", because I'm damned if I can see it.
On the basis of the facts given we have no idea whether this was a novice owner who couldn't face up to her own lack of ability or an extremely experienced horse woman who recognised that the horse had come to the end of the road.
We have no idea whether Tinpot is the sort of owner who thinks a horse should be phoning the Vet itself before it is put down or whether the owner is a callous bitch who regards a horse in the same way as a kleenex.
We have no idea whether the other horse pts was a healthy 5yo or was pts as a result of a broken leg/ragwort poisoning/twisted gut etc etc.
Even if we feel we have the right to judge the owner we simply do not have the facts to be able to do so.
FWIW I would be loath to sell a 20yo - I've been to markets a & seen oldies there and wanted to wallop the owners for not taking responsibility for their end. Loaning isn't always practical - if you don't have your own land you may not be able to take them back in an emergency. I shouldn't think a month goes by on this forum without a tale of how someone has had to go & fetch back a mistreated loan horse back there & then.
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Well said!!
 
I agree totally with a fii any one who has seen old horses at markets or even worse stored waiting for the meat price to be high enough to sent them to slaughter would support anyone putting their oldie down. I am still haunted by some of the awful things I saw when I was a welfare officer the worse thing was some of them would look at a woman who properly dressed and talked like someone who had loved and cared for them once with hope and I could do nothing for them I am crying now remembering it .
 
tinpot said:
she owned an aged arab totally fit aged 20 years young (PTS) because she could not ride her( Nothing to do with the horse just she was incapable lack of experiance) such a waste of a lovely horse.
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Goldenstar said:
I agree totally with a fii any one who has seen old horses at markets or even worse stored waiting for the meat price to be high enough to sent them to slaughter would support anyone putting their oldie down. I am still haunted by some of the awful things I saw when I was a welfare officer the worse thing was some of them would look at a woman who properly dressed and talked like someone who had loved and cared for them once with hope and I could do nothing for them I am crying now remembering it .
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The information we are given is that the Arab was 20 yrs,and the owner was too novicey to ride it.
So how come we jump to the conclusion that it's only other alternative is being sent to market or being loaned to someone incompetent ?
Am I the only person who knows horses and ponies of 20 yrs and older that have been sold or loaned to loving homes and continued to have a happy working life ?
There is no mention of it being a problem horse, unrideable or the owners personal circumstances being difficult.

I am appalled that in this horse's case, for so many of you, its life is so disposable. Euthanasia is the last option when all other avenues have failed, not the first.
 
horserider said:
The information we are given is that the Arab was 20 yrs,and the owner was too novicey to ride it.
So how come we jump to the conclusion that it's only other alternative is being sent to market or being loaned to someone incompetent ?
Am I the only person who knows horses and ponies of 20 yrs and older that have been sold or loaned to loving homes and continued to have a happy working life ?
There is no mention of it being a problem horse, unrideable or the owners personal circumstances being difficult.

I am appalled that in this horse's case, for so many of you, its life is so disposable. Euthanasia is the last option when all other avenues have failed, not the first.
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As i said in a previose post, yes you may well find a really good home for life, but it is a big chance to take, as quite a few members on here have found out.
I have two who are in their twenties, and if my circumstances change, i would have them pts, because if i did sell them on and then found in the future that they had been mistreated or passed from pillar too post, i wouldnt be able to live with myself!!
I know pony club ponies, lead rein, first ridden, go on, but that is usually through the small circle of the pony club, and they are famouse in their own right, and will always have a job to do.
As a few on this thread have said, pts isnt the worst that could happen to a horse.
 
SpottyTB said:
I have to agree with the few who have said "her horse, her choice".

I think until you walk in her shoes - no the real ins and outs of the situation - you cannot really pass judgement. She may have told you a complete cock and bull story but really there could be a whole different world of reason behind her decision.

I think a horse of 20 that is perhaps slightly difficult is better PTS then sold, because at least that way you can garentee it's ending, it's had a good life (with hope) and now it will go piecefully to sleep in the field rather than what COULD happen - it end up in the markets and sold to the meat man! I say could because it may end up in a lovely forever home- but who's to garentee that?

Also, I understand you are proberbly in shock and the idea of the event itself will be an upsetting one, but I think you need to look at the bigger picture- if this un exspirienced owner had tried to sell her on, she probably would have taken the first offer on her without looking into the home first!

:)
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Well said! I dont think its nice to pts a healthy 20yr old horse, but i have been to some of the low class sales and seen what goes on, theres no way i would want my old horse to end up there and in that case yes i would rather pts. My own old man is 28 has cushings and is almost blind, if i thought i couldnt keep him we would have no choice, i dont see animals as something you should throw away, but i dont like to see them spend their last days/years going from pillar to post or shoved in a field and forgotten.
 
It seems to me that there are many people on this thread simply saying that they would always try to ensure their healthy older horse had a loving permanent retirement home. With themselves or someone they completely trusted.

If they were unable to do that due to circumstances, or because the horse had health or other major issues, they wouldn't want to risk it ending its life suffering so as a last resort they might have it pts. They're wondering if that's really what happened in the case of the woman the OP describes. Giving her the benefit of the doubt.

I honestly don't think anyone here condones the casual disposal of horses or sees them as throwaway inconveniences.
 
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