Would you use a stallion like this?

[jcwh]

Just to turn it around in the original post, Would you breed from a mare that:
is not graded with no competition history as she isn't even broken in / backed due to injury sustained as filly.
gentle and very pretty, and homozygous tobiano.
nice bloodlines though, well bred??

There always seems to be a big debate regarding using unproven stallions, so why use an unproven mare??!!

(sorry if hijacking )

not at all, you make a good point, plus mares are supposed to be 70% of the foal no? hmmm food for thought.

i was just wondering, why so many people have used said stallion.

That is not a hypothetical statement

hi magic. i really don't want to go to internet war with you on whether this stallion or stallions are hypothetical or not. please respect that this stallion doesn't exist. as to other stallions that may fit this description, well, they just fit, nothing more.
i'm sure if i describe a horse, there will be many that fit said description.
that statement was meant to be interpreted as: "many people use stallions like this." ie. breeding for color/pedigree alone.
if this explanation doesn't satisfy you, then i'm sorry for making such a statement, however please rest assured said stallion is hypothetical.

 

[magic104]

That is fine jcwh, just remember you were the one that had a go at me questioning your post, I defended myself as you have done.

 

[prosoup]

Just to turn it around in the original post, Would you breed from a mare that:
is not graded with no competition history as she isn't even broken in / backed due to injury sustained as filly.
gentle and very pretty, and homozygous tobiano.
nice bloodlines though, well bred??

to be fair, a mare can only have one foal a year (or two if scanning isn't done properly) whereas a stallion can have potentially hundreds. the people breeding a foal or two from their ungraded mares cannot do as much "damage" as people breeding from unapproved stallions.

the people who buy foals from these hypothetical ungraded homozygous mares are the victims though, if they are led to believe that the breeder is as scrupulous as one who presents all of their mares for approval in accordance with studbook rules. even an injured mare can be presented before a grading panel.

 

[TBB]

In Ireland Master Imp (a TB bred to breed sport horses) didnt have a competition record and was fully approved. Cavalier Royale had a competition record but did not pass the inspection for approval (he passed the Vet) and was made Supplementary 1 (Now known as Not Approved 1) he was elevated to approved status when his progeny proved so successful. So if you used him originally you would have got a good animal that probably made you money by a sire that was not approved.

 

[millbrook26]

wow!!
things sure get heated on here!!
everyone breeds for a different reason to keep ,to sell, to repalce ect<<.
i know of few stallions that are UNGRADED but produce trainable temps, stunning conformation, have full pedigree,. i personaly think colour is a bonus but many breed for this too and its something you will never stop . i feel it depends on the person... as long as they are happy with the results its there choice. again personaly for me it depends on my mares pedigree and if im looking to sell or keep, certain bloodlines are more appleing than others for the market today. as far as the mares go we have one that never competed, not graded, good bloodlines and produced stunning foals one whom will soon be graded and stand at stud. i also think EVERYONE IS ALLOWED OPION but remember this is a forum for advice not to be rude on !!

 

[magic104]

"stud. i also think EVERYONE IS ALLOWED OPION but remember this is a forum for advice not to be rude on !! :"

Except who has been rude?? Quote "Oh for pity sake jcwh, why do it if it is directed at someone one here?" Is far from rude it is a question and "why do it IF" is not stating a fact but again questioning the poster because a stallion owner had asked the question as it so resembled their own horse. This stallion owner has in the past had critisim aimed at them through the back door, on top of the twin post that probably was just a fairy tale.

 

[htobago]

ah! i'm not looking at all! i was just wondering, why so many people have used said stallion.
people say "we dont breed for color, this one's got great lineage!" but i mean, he's not graded for ***'s sake.
and he's booked quite a lot if i may add.
he's not graded because of injury sustained as colt.

Sorry jcwh, but these really don't look like statements about a 'hypothetical' stallion! If you really did mean this hypothetically, OK, but surely you can see why people assumed you were referring to a real stallion?

On the subject of ungraded stallions generally, it is perhaps worth mentioning that not all breed societies have gradings. Arabs, for example. Arab breeders will look at a stallion's show record, pedigree, confo, etc. - plus his offspring and their show records, etc. If a stallion and his offspring have achieved high scores and won major championships under a variety of different judges, this has the same value as grading.

 

[jcwh]

HTobago, i totally see why people assumed and everything, but after that, i had made clarifications in later posts.

"please respect that this stallion doesn't exist. as to other stallions that may fit this description, well, they just fit, nothing more.
i'm sure if i describe a horse, there will be many that fit said description.
that statement was meant to be interpreted as: "many people use stallions like this." ie. breeding for color/pedigree alone.
if this explanation doesn't satisfy you, then i'm sorry for making such a statement, however please rest assured said stallion is hypothetical."

i wrote it in a very neutral tone, and i apologised for my statements which caused misunderstandings. is there anything more i can do? after this, if people want to continue believing that the stallion exists, or anything else, i'm not sure there's anything else i can do about that.