Would you use this farrier?

[Delta99]

Have been having a few problems with my farrier. Have used him for quite a few years and it's only in the last 12 months or so things started to go wrong.
This is a flat footed TB whose feet improved initially. Then the apprentice did him a few times and we ended up with bruised soles and in the end had to put on heartbar shoes (no clips).
worked well but no real improvement.
Now this!

Apprentice again, but have told farrier I don't want the apprentice doing my horses! Shoes too big as well, I think.
Am seriously tempted to stop the cheque and report him to the farriers council.
However, am struggling to find another farrier in my area, the only ones who come out this way are not much better than this!
What do I do??

<a href="http://s672.photobucket.com/albums/vv87/sammyslug/?action=view&current=Henrysfeeta020609.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i672.photobucket.com/albums/vv87/sammyslug/Henrysfeeta020609.jpg" border="0" alt="feet2"></a>

 

[Delta99]

oops, try the photos again!

 

[horseback09]

NO!

 

[KatB]

Actually, thats not too bad shoeing IMHO. They are flat, but there is a fair amount of heel support with the shoes. What are they like looking at the sole (when you pick the foot up?) Are they quite wide webbed shoes?

 

[Ezme]

Hopefully TheFarrier will be online later to cast an expert eye but they look pretty poor to me!

 

[BSJAlove]

i would class that as bad shoeing. the toe is over the front too much. if your not happy move to a different one

 

[silverbreeze]

No, I wouldn't be very happy if my horses feet looked like that but didn't see them before.
I had a farrier who always used to send his apprentices; whilst I appreciate they have go to learn I didn't get the option, he was never there 'teaching' them and I most certainly didn't get a discount for their time!!! I chose to move on from this blacksmith.
Is there noone near you that can recommend a bs and have a look at their horses feet?

 

[Molineux]

NO!!! However are you using Farrier Supp for your horse?

 

[KatB]

Just out of interest guys, why would you class these feet as particularly badly shod?

BSJAlove, actually the toe isnt over the front too much, its because the farrier has pulled the toe back to bring the breakover point back which will actually help the horse...

 

[f_s_]

I think the feet don't look too good, but that wouldn't necessarily be the farrier's fault. It looks like poor hoof, probably a bit crumbly and not particularly strong.

Do you feed a supplement to improve the hoof?

The shoeing does look like it is giving support but I can't comment on the actual size etc. Hopefully, a farrier on here will give you advice.

 

[kick_On]

If your unhappy with this shoes GO back to your farrier, and discuss. As IMHO they don't look that bad BUT i don't what work load your horse is etc.... and they way to get best shoe and treatment for horse is both your and farrier working together

And is your horse on any supplements or any other treatment???

If you don't get good response go to farrier website and get another farrier

Hopefully HHO some farrier will log on give you advise via pm

 

[martlin]

[ QUOTE ]
Just out of interest guys, why would you class these feet as particularly badly shod?

BSJAlove, actually the toe isnt over the front too much, its because the farrier has pulled the toe back to bring the breakover point back which will actually help the horse...

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think they are very badly shod, actually the current job looks to be doing good out of bad situation, however the OP says they have been using this farrier for quite a while, so I would expect the feet to be a bit better than that.

OP - I would start with ringing your farrier and discussing the use of apprentices. Tell him you are not happy for the apprentice to shoe your horse and if the farrier is not prepared to come and deal with your horse in person you will be taking your custom elsewhere.

 

[LadyRascasse]

no i would except that type of work but i would be talking to my farrier asking what can be done to help his feet. sorry its a 2 way thing

 

[Baileyhoss]

My tbx has flat feet and weak heels so he is shod big at the back like this to support the heels,.

He also has quarter clips so that over the next 6 weeks, the growth in the toes in particular doesn't pull the shoe forward away from supporting the heel, the toe is balanced and will grow a little over the front of the shoe and wear naturally as they break over.

Doesn't actually look that bad to me, so i'll watch comments with interest as my lad is shod similarly,

 

[Nailed]

i cant see the pics on my phone so cant help.. lou x

 

[KatB]

[ QUOTE ]
however the OP says they have been using this farrier for quite a while, so I would expect the feet to be a bit better than that

[/ QUOTE ]

So how would you expect them to be looking?!

 

[Shazzababs]

They don't look too bad, but its obvious from all of the old nail holes that your horses feet don't grow very much at all. I think that's making things look worse as you can see your farrier has had trouble findling places to locate the nails (hence they are not in a nice straight line.

As other posters I would consider feeding some suppliments and painting some on too to try and make the feet grow a bit more. I use Better4Hooves and cornucresine. On my TB who had real problems with crumbly hooves that didn;t grow we used to use Keratex hoof hardener.

 

[martlin]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
however the OP says they have been using this farrier for quite a while, so I would expect the feet to be a bit better than that

[/ QUOTE ]

So how would you expect them to be looking?!

[/ QUOTE ]

There is quite a bit 'carnage' around the clip area and around the heel...
I'm not sure where I would apportion the responsibility for that, but going on my farrier - I would have been told months ago to give hoof supplement and use suitable dressing to improve quality of feet.
Also, the OP says that there was no problem with the feet and now there is, so clearly they are not improving or staying the same - they are deteriorating, and I wouldn't expect that from my farrier.

I don't think I'm very good at explaining what I mean

 

[Delta99]

ok, just to compare here's a piccie of the same horse 12 months ago, before things went wrong. Nothing's changed, same farrier, same feed (did try farriers formula for 6 months but didn't see much difference), same work but still in 'normal shoes'.

 

[Flame_]

The horse has poor foot conformation and quality. I'd be happy with what the farrier's done tbh, they can't work miracles! All I'd recommend is a hoof supplement and painting the feet with something like Effol.

It might also be an idea, if feasible, to turn him away in the autumn unshod to give those feet a break from nails and to toughen them up.

 

[charlie76]

They don;t look bad to me, and with those types of shoes they toe is left longer like that to encourage the horses breakover to me correct and to stop them landing heel then toe when they put the foot down. The heel of the shoe has been left long to enable more blood circulation and encourage the heels to stay open.
I would say the farrier has done a good job on poor foot conformation.

 

[junglediva]

i think its fine.. a little proud at the back but nothing to worry about!!!

 

[charlie76]

The feet look better now, in the second pics the foot is far to upright and boxy cauing concussion.
The way he has been shod now will give the horse more chance of future soundness.

 

[KatB]

Lol! I can understand what you are saying...

HOWEVER, the horse has flat feet. That is a natural conformation defect, not caused by a farrier. It is also something that has to be managed, and is very difficult to "cure" as such... IMO the farrier is managing it by the way the horse is shod

The hoof wall does look "damamaged" but thats from the necessity of shoes, not from wrong doing of the farrier... (as you said) so....

Back to the OP and others that have said they wouldnt us ethe farrier, what do they expect to see?!

 

[Delta99]

and I paint the feet with Kevin Bacon and Keratex on soles.!
Am quite shocked to see the difference in the piccies, you wouldn't think it 's the same horse!!

 

[martlin]

[ QUOTE ]
ok, just to compare here's a piccie of the same horse 12 months ago, before things went wrong. Nothing's changed, same farrier, same feed (did try farriers formula for 6 months but didn't see much difference), same work but still in 'normal shoes'.

[/ QUOTE ]
Now that perfectly illustrates the point I was trying to make.
The last shoeing is a good job in a bad situation, but the above photo shows that the bad situation came about with that farrier.

 

[Stacie_and_Jed]

Im no expert but it looks to me that the farrier is making the most out of poor feet. I would suggest, like some others have, putting him on a farriers formula for the feet and you may see a difference.

However if you think his feet are worse because of the farriers/apprentice's work, have a chat with him before you make any rash decisions.

 

[charlie76]

Yes but the angle of the foot is better in the first pics, its just the quality of the horn that is not as good, this can be helped with a hoof product or biotin ect.

ETA my first horse had feet like in the 2nd picture, he ended up with side bone and navicular. I would have been as pleased as punch if he had got the feet like the first pics, cracks or no cracks.

 

[f_s_]

Twelve months ago the weather conditions in the UK were very different to this year. We had a wet and mild winter , followed by a wet spring/summer.

This year the ground is hard (at least in our area) even at this time of the year and we have not had the same rainfall.

All mine(despite hoof supplements) have suffered with cracking on their hoofs. This is not the fault of either me or my farrier.

Mine has advised putting the hose on the hoof to help moisturise the hoof and continue to feed supplements.

Perhaps something like this would help the hoof improve?

 

[KatB]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes but the angle of the foot is better in the first pics, its just the quality of the horn that is not as good, this can be helped with a hoof product or biotin ect.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree 100%