Would you use Totilas and why?

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Richard Davidson said on BBC that he was speaking to Edward Gal about Totilas and that as a 6 year old when he went to try him he got off him quickly and went to get his stable rider, as he was hot with big movement (many top riders will not risk being injured on a young horse). He is also not an easy horse in the stable, that was also the comment made on TV by Richard Davidson.

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Thats really interesting - thanks
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In essense then when he does stand as a breeding stallion, he could produce a lot of very hot, very difficult foals who will never actually be very trainable as the majority of riders will not be able to stay on them long enough to train them!

So a little like Jazz, for those breeding for themselves Totilas may be a no no (unless a very good rider indeed) but may be very good if wishing to sell the foal. On the other hand he may pass on a very quiet disposition - who knows!
 
i am trying to get my head around how anyone can possibly call Totilas "stuffy in front"... are we talking about the same horse and using the same language?!
he is the absolute antithesis of stuffy, he is ridiculously over-extravagant if anything, in a Ministry of Funny Walks kind of way. (if you don't know Monty Python stuff, that will mean nothing to you, sorry!)
i'd have to see him in the flesh, and i would LOVE to see a vid of him loose in a field, or trotting up in hand, to see how he moves without a rider.
 
I think the same thing about disposition can be said about almost any stallion....there are a LOT of hot tempered stallions in competition and the list is long! In SJ alone there is Cornet Obolensky (VERY HOT and throws it!), Arko, then there is Grafenstolz, Jaguar Mail, even King of Diamonds, who was INCREDIBLY hot tempered!!! So a hot temperament will not necessarily deter people.
 
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CAN he jump?
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I'd put money on it - as they say - the only difference between what you want for top class jumping and what you want for top class dressage is the level of submissiveness (dressage horse must be more submissive and do as YOU say - whereas a SJ must be able to think a bit more for himself and get you both out of trouble!
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Kerelli, in a way he is the John Cleese of the horse world!

And i'd LOVE to see him jump too PF
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haha yes, isn't he just! i bet he could jump the flipping moon, anything that athletic will have a good jump surely? just wondering what he'd do with his legs in the air is cracking me up though!
if he's been rollkur'd though, would he have the initiative to jump? genuine question, i know he's not likely to leave the floor cos he's so valuable!
 
The not being easy in the stable would deter me far more than the hotness, because if you chose a really calm sort of mare that could disappear, but if he's nasty in the box (and I'm only guessing) that seems to pass down more than anything else.
There was a well known TB stallion years ago that passed on his unpleasant stable manners to all his youngstock, such a shame but in the end his breeder had him pts once she realised what was happening.
Having watched that vid a few times, I think I'd simply choose a sweet natured calm mare and take my chances!
 
I've heard he's a "handful" in the stable
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Yes, I'd use him, but would like to use Gribaldi first as he has always been my fav stallion ever. Which I'm hoping to do next year with my DWB mare, as I think they'll be a great match
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I sat and watched the stressage the other day only because it preceded the the sj (and there was no eventing on)

and I said to the telly "I wish that had a set of balls"

quickly followed by "even if it did I couldn't afford the stud fee"
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I think he is dish-delish

He's not a stallion though is he? I thought the commentator said he was a gelding, and only 9 isnt he? I thought he said he has a fab temperament and watch how the rider can drop the reins at the end of the test?

I thought he was beautiful.

I love him a little bit
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I wouldn't use him as I wouldn't want a dressage horse.
I also don't like his front leg action, although it would be interesting to see how he moves naturally. I don't like the exaggerated movement on any horse, it looks too much like hackney horses for me.
Having said all that, he is a dream of a horse & I especially like his attitude, he seem to try his heart out & genuinely enjoy his job. I also like his frame, for a modern warmblood he looks lovely & deep, be nice to see him stood up tho' I'm only going on the video.
 
I'd use him on about 10 mares if I bred dressage horses!! I'm a jumping fan all the way, but he looks the real deal to me. I've watched him on you tube several times and not any other dressage horses. Enough said.

Stuffy in front?????? Lmao
 
My colleague watched him in the warm up at Windsor, and when he started trotting he most certainly DIDNT move extravagantly. It has been trained in, that said, he must have the confo/ability in him to do it!!

Temperment wise, I'm sure that Gal recently said he was MUCH nicer in the stable than his sire, Gribaldi.

I would use him, cos he is the stamp I like and I also prefer training a hot horse!
 
i would use him on all of mine!!!
not sure i could afford to though?
WHO NEEDS TORTILAS ANYWAY WHEN WE HAVE GAN1 ADONNIS!!
 
I wouldn't use him on my mares, but only because all of the mares I am using this year are also by Gribaldi..

Other than that, I think he is well qualified as a breeding stallion, and I would consider using him on one of my non related mares if he were available at public stud.
 
Yes I would use him. He as a lovely conformation, is a good size and a workmanlike body. The way he mooched around the prize giving while Salinero and Parzival had hysterics would be enough to make me want to use him. And he has just the most beautiful canter ever and a super walk. But we'll be waiting a long time by all accounts.
 
I did not have the pleasure of seeing him 'live' only watched on TV, it was a wonderful performance to watch. I too heard comments about problems in the stable. What these were was not explained. That would worry me.

Like Hollycat I am of an age where falling off or being pushed around 'hurts'. Temperament is always high up on my list.

My husband and I visited the Hungarian National Stud at Babolna in 2004 to look at Shagya Arabs. They had a barn full of stallions. I was asked which ones I wanted to see.

Tamas Rambert the stud manager swept open one door and invited me to walk in. Seeing me hesitate to go into a stable with a strange stallion he said 'Non of our stallions bite or kick'. They were all gentle and friendly and I was hooked.

I now have three Shagyas.
 
The comment here is not very flattering!!!!
http://www.horseandcountry.tv/episode/Edward-Gal-and-Moorlands-Totilas-Record-Breaking-WDM-Kur

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There is something horrifically wrong when so many people are incapable of recognising this for what it is - false collection. Simple.

The clearest indicator is the arrhythmic manner of the paces. The irregularity is a knock-on effect of a locked back - this is also what produces those spectacular flying frontlegs. But please, watch the hindlegs; it fails, even in the extended trot, to overtrack. Watch the hindquarters; they are never lowered to take greater weight behind. This horse is not collected - he is merely bundled together. The resultant tension produces that cresty neck, those paces, that lift without selfcarriage, for which the audience cheers."
 
Without geting into another Totilas debate, if that is really the case then surely it wouldn't consistently be getting 10s from experienced international judges - the extended trots in the special at Windsor all got 8s and 9s (see H&H page 35 this week), there is no way a horse could pirouette for a 10 if it wasn't collected!! I really like the horse, if I had a mare that suited him and he was available for use in the UK, and I had the money, and didn't have my boy(!), I would definitely use him - but as always, not everyone likes the same thing!

And Keoffee - thank you - very kind of you to say!!
 
Magic, when watching the link you provided I can agree with the statement that you quoted below. In the test he is hardly ever in front of the vertical and only just tracks up in the extensions. Is this caused by tension or the use of hyperflexion? (or both)

There is a lot of hype surrounding Totilas, which is very difficult for judges to ignore. Very glad I am not a judge!

However, if you watch his GP team test at the Europeans, his extensions are great and his outline more correct. And when he Piaffes you cannot deny he is sitting! I thought that test was amazing and well deserving of the mark it got.
 
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People must also remember that this stallion is only a 9 yr old!!! The best is yet to come!

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Either that or he will be burnt out by the time he is 11
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Firstly I must say, I really like his stamp and I am not going to get into a debate about him, but I will voice my opinion.

SO

I cant understand how anyone can say he has a superb walk, his collected walk is tense and irregular in rhythm, there is very little (if any) over track in his extended walk, although he did show less tension and did lengthen the frame, but from what I saw, not his length of stride. His extended trot is all front leg action, he shows no over track in the extended trot to speak of. In fact his first extended looks more like a medium. He missed one change behind completely and jumped together on another one.

So I would have to say, I agree with the post that said he does not really work from behind.

But I would never refer to him as being stuffy in front, quite the opposite really, he is too much in front and needs more from behind. He seems to be able to remember his hind legs in the piaffe and passage (which are outstanding), but what about his extended paces.

Just my opinion.
 
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