WWYD

TheChestnutThing

TheChestnutThing

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So there is always that one person at a yard...

We have someone at our yard who has a fantastic horse that will basically do anything and everything and never say no.
The horse is not sound, owner has had it pointed out numerous times and says it's fine/normal.
Saddle does not fit - again pointed out and told it's fine
Horse is jumped constantly - we are on day 10 now of jumping every day - and not just one or two fences, a lesson here, and arena hire there, massive fences in the pitch black, grids...
Horse never ever had physio/body work or anything of the sort either

It has reached the stage where it is being discussed amongst the liveries and I personally think it's a welfare issue now. By welfare I don't mean RSPCA welfare, I mean someone needs to step in and explain and help the horse welfare (if that makes sense).

WWYD - say something or let the horse break and they find out the hard way?

I cannot stand to watch it (by watch I mean see it occasionally/know it's happening).
 
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Wherever you may look there are horses that may be treated in a way that is not acceptable in someone's view. Levels of soundness is an opinion unless a vet is involved. Work levels are opinions, many will criticise a hunter doing 2 x5 hour days a week, or a riding school horse doing 5 hours a day x 6 days a week for instance. We all have differing thoughts.

The only person with control over the horse you are mentioning is the yard owner if it is at livery. If they find the care unacceptable notice could be served. It is nothing to do with other liveries or any other 3rd parties.
 
Unfortunately it provably isn't at a point where a welfare organisation would intervene, as they tend to focus on the basic needs of the animal, which presumably are being met.

IME an instructor is often more instrumental in effecting change by pointing out unsoundness or poor saddle fit, or an unreasonable training regime. Does the owner use one?

From personal experience as a YO, I am pretty friendly with both of our visiting instructors, and often have a quiet word with them if I think something is wrong. Not to bitch or gossip, but so that they can be aware while teaching and help me in pointing out something that looks wrong, if they agree. I see things they don't as they aren't always here, but they are being paid by the person to help with the horse's work, so are sometimes in a better position to say it. I will of course also give my opinion re soundness and so on, but I can't say that I am a pro in this regard and they can ignore me, I can only try and persuade them to call a vet / saddle fitter / etc.

I'm pretty lucky with my liveries, who all care massively so it's not a common problem. We did have one case of an extremely large lady with a fairly finely built horse with a bad back. It's terribly difficult to give an opinion of what might be wrong in this situation, as you can imagine. Her instructor felt the same.
 
It is a child or an adult? - any one around them that they might listen to that you could speak to?

Who has spoken to them about the soundness / saddle / lack of a day off - were you there and do you know how clearly it was put to them.

Some people believe they have "said something" while others just wouldn't pick up on subtle hints.

"I like my horse to have a variety of exercise and one day off a week - don't you" type comments sound clear to the speaker but could easily be misunderstood.

An adult spoken to calmly and directly might well engage in a sensible discussion - maybe there's a reason for all these things the rest of the yard isn't aware of - unlikely but you never know.

If it's a kid, then I'd find a away to speak to their parents.
 
Assuming you are seeing lameness, would it help to offer to trot the horse up and ask the owner if he/she can see what you see? Quietly ask if they can feel that unsoundness when ridden. Offer to trot your horse out too, for comparison. Is this a fairly novice owner who doesn't want to lose face by admitting they can't see the unsoundness, or just a head in the sand attitude?
 
As a fellow livery your hands are pretty much tide. YO would be my first port of call.

If she is having lessons then an instructor should pick it up if the lameness is obvious.

How long has the horse been on your yard?

How long has the lameness been noticed? when the owner says its 'normal' has anyone asked what that means? She may be fully aware of it.

10 days on the trot jumping isn't for everyone but an hour of working over fences in a 24 hour period is not world ending in it's own right.

Is the owner/rider aiming for a competition and working on improving things for that? have they noticed a drop in performance (potentially due to the unseen lameness) and trying to fix it?

Is your opinion has the saddle become ill fitting recently or is it an on going thing? if so, what time scale?

As for physio and body work - not everyone see's that as essential. It's personal preference I'm afraid.

Sorry, but to be able to answer your question I'd like to know more detail in order to answer correctly.
 
YO has tried to discuss it with them but they just aren't interested. The owner's close friend even pointed out the lameness and saddle fit (i was in the arena standing within ear shot when it happened), and they were poo poo'ed.

Horse is out competing most weekends, even comes back from shows and lessons fully tacked up.

They have noticed a drop in performance and blamed it on the horses feeding.

Regardless the horse is incredibly unhappy. You can see it in it's face, eyes and it's mannerisms. It's starting to shut down in itself.

I hate seeing animals like this, I work as an equine and canine bodyworker and it really breaks me.
 
It’s not your place to do anything. As hard as it is just ignore them. (I’ve been there by the way!).

It is up to the YO/YM - in their shoes the livery would be given an ultimatum’I expect XYZ or you can have a months notice to leave’. But you cannot enforce that approach on the YM/YO either.
 
sounds like the poor horse is being failed in so many ways! It would be nice if the instructors and competition venues took some accountability and stopped her from riding if the horse is lame!

I think there are some people who shouldn't have horses and makes me so sad to think the poor thing is suffering! I wish it would over react rather than shut down as these types people don't tend to take action when horses shut down
 
angel7 said:
Just ask the person why they are riding a lame horse and what are they going to do about it?
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I think I would have to speak up to have an easy conscience on the horses behalf. I am totally non confrontational, but I would have a good hard think about how to approach it and say it. It may be humour (gosh you and your horse look exhausted, even criminals get a day off) sarcasm ( your horse must at be a hero to manage with such a rubbish saddle fit) planting an idea that might embarrass them (everyone was saying at the show you shouldn’t be competing with a lame horse and next time you will be eliminated).
Don’t expect them to welcome your intervention, but just to start the thought process!
 
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