Yard owners taking hay out of my stable after I've left

[boomchakawowi]

Default Livery yard owners taking hay out of my horses stable after I've
Hi guys, I moved to a livery yard approx 4 months ago and was told it was ad lib hay, after a week they told me that they were going to reduce tims hay as the grass was so good, recently as the weathers got colder I've started giving him a full Haynet per night, just your average sized Haynet, I also asked them if this was ok to do so and they said yes, I asked again if it was still ad lib hay and they said yes, I started to get a bad vibe off them regarding me taking the hay so decided to set up a camera and it showed them going into my stable and taking pretty much all of my horses hay out of his stable..... I know this is a breach in my contract with them too, I've handed my notice in and move in 2 weeks which will be 2 weeks less than the months notice, I've offered to pay for the stabling etc but I'm so so so angry I don't know the best way to deal with this as they also have £150 deposit of mine too

 

[Enfys]

Use the deposit to pay your notice, or part of it, I'd pay my months notice and clear as you are doing, asap.

Did you tell them why you are leaving?

 

[quirky]

Is it legal to covertly set up cctv?
I should keep the fact you have done that under your hat in case they get shirty about it.

Although it may sting, sometimes it's worth a financial hit to get your horse to a better place.

 

[Shay]

No - it isn't illegal to set up covert CCTV. But the footage can't be used in any legal proceedings - which is why we have the "warning you are on CCTV" type signs.

Clearly you need to move though.

 

[quirky]

Having looked into it, I would say the op is more thank likely on dodgy ground regarding the cctv. Signage is a must.
I would still err on the side of caution and not tell them you have them on film. You may want to look into the data protection act if you plan on telling them. Make sure you have all your ducks in a row!

 

[ycbm]

No - it isn't illegal to set up covert CCTV. But the footage can't be used in any legal proceedings - which is why we have the "warning you are on CCTV" type signs.

Clearly you need to move though.

This can't be right. Covert cctv footage has been used on several occasions to prosecute care home staff and is constantly being used by police for motoring offences. And in any case, what are they going to do, sue her? Unlikely, what would they gain, an appalling reputation and the loss of their business.

What despicable people. OP, watch your horse for ulcer symptoms and if you need your horse scoped or treated, send them the bill and tell them why.

 

[JillA]

Have you asked them why? As in you have noticed his hay is going etc but keep the CCTV thing under wraps (until they have lied through their teeth and then hit them with it).

 

[Princess16]

I agree with YCBM what s more damaging for them? trying to sue you for using CCTV or their reputation if you make it public. Get out quickly I say and tell them the £150 they owe you can be taken off the final amount you owe.

 

[kc100]

As others have said, let them keep the £150 but that will contribute towards the 2 weeks you should be paying for as part of the notice period. You contractually will have to pay your notice period, so you need to pay the full 4 weeks - but there is no reason why the £150 cant go towards that.

Dont mention the CCTV, they could start being awkward about that so best to keep that quiet.

Sometimes I'm glad I'm on DIY.....at least I have full control of my horses care and am not relying on crazy livery yard staff & owners to look after him!

Good luck with the move OP, hope the next yard is better!

 

[Goldenstar]

I think you need to pay you notice as well so I would just go and delight in telling everybody you meet for the next six months why .

 

[Firefly9410]

The contract is void. They broke it by removing the hay which is supposed to be ad lib. How much is livery per week? If it is £150 or less tell them to take two weeks money from that. I would only be paying the two weeks you are there not a whole month. Whatever you choose to do I imagine they will try to keep any deposit owed to you. They seem the type, they have already proven they lie. I am glad you have found somewhere better for your horse.

 

[Micropony]

As Shay says, covert cctv is not illegal but also not admissible in court unless the right authorities are in place under (I think) RIPA. OP is not intending to use cctv to prosecute so that is irrelevant, and if she wanted to tell YO how she knows what's been going on that won't open her up to being sued or similar.

I have have had exactly the same happen to me, OP, when my big horse was woefully underweight. Was spending a fortune on hard feed (that was being pinched and given to YM's horses), hay was being pinched from his stable, and I had called the vet out to look into what I assumed must be an underlying problem when one of the other liveries told me what was going on. Like you, were both out of there PDQ, best thing we ever did!

Hope it all works out for you in your new place.

 

[JulesRules]

What Firefly said. They broke the contract so it is void. Don't pay any notice.

Do you have Cctv evidence of just one occasion? If I were you I would try to get evidence of a pattern. Refuse to pay notice when you leave and of they get funny tell them you have evidence and basically say if you are allowed to leave quietly no more will be said

 

[boomchakawowi]

Default Livery yard owners taking hay out of my horses stable after I've
Hi guys, I moved to a livery yard approx 4 months ago and was told it was ad lib hay, after a week they told me that they were going to reduce tims hay as the grass was so good, recently as the weathers got colder I've started giving him a full Haynet per night, just your average sized Haynet, I also asked them if this was ok to do so and they said yes, I asked again if it was still ad lib hay and they said yes, I started to get a bad vibe off them regarding me taking the hay so decided to set up a camera and it showed them going into my stable and taking pretty much all of my horses hay out of his stable..... I know this is a breach in my contract with them too, I've handed my notice in and move in 2 weeks which will be 2 weeks less than the months notice, I've offered to pay for the stabling etc but I'm so so so angry I don't know the best way to deal with this as they also have £150 deposit of mine too

This was on a assisted DIY, and I would say I set up the camera to see what my horse done at night, I know they only rent this yard so I'm going to contact their landlord too

 

[cobgoblin]

If you've handed in your notice, have they asked why you are leaving? Or do they assume that you have found out? Does anyone else at the yard have similar suspicions?
I can't see the problem in letting them know that you have seen them remove hay on the cctv. The cctv could have been there for any number of reasons, even just for the fun of seeing what your horse gets up to during the night, or watching for colic. What possible objection could they have to that?
If the deposit covers your last two weeks of notice, then I would tell them to keep it and leave it at that. If more than two weeks then I would just make up the extra for the four weeks. As others have said, they will probably keep your deposit anyway, so it may as well go towards your notice.
Really, a great deal depends on whether you just want to get out in the easiest and quickest way and then tell everyone or if you want to take matters further.

If it were me, I would confront them. I don't like sneaky people.

 

[9tails]

Good Lord, what effers. Have you paid the full month's livery plus the deposit? If not, don't pay any more and tell them to take the two weeks from your deposit. If they kick off, tell them you have evidence of the hay removal and will make it public on Facebook.

 

[paddy555]

I would explain the CCTV by saying you had concerns about your horse's health as it hadn't seemed right some mornings so you set it up to see what the horse was up to. Then you were amazed to find them going into the stable and stealing hay that you had paid for in your livery. Your horse went without hay some nights and therefore they owe you back the cost of hay you have paid for.

Number one is to get your horse off the yard and all your possessions. After that I would stop paying anything give up on the deposit and if they say anything suggest they sue. I would be beyond furious but number one priority is the horse's safety. Having got the horse out then I would let rip in no uncertain terms. If you set up the CCTV to study your horse's behaviour is there any reason why you can't show it to other people? You didn't ask the YO's to be part of the film show.

 

[OWLIE185]

All depends what is in your contract.

 

[paddy]

Horrified by what they're doing but in response to some of the posts above, a contract is not void because someone is in breach of contract. If you're looking to bring a contract to an end due to breach, I suggest you seek legal advice from someone who has actually seen the contract and is qualified to give legal advice. If you terminate when you're not entitled to, you could find yourself in something called repudiatory breach and liable to them for damages, which would be irritating.

 

[Elsbells]

Same as what's already been said, but I'd be getting my horse far, far away from them before I said anything about hay theft.

It's not unusual for yard owners/managers to feel they can use whatever is sitting on their yard or to see a reason for complaint from the owners.

 

[ljohnsonsj]

I would explain the CCTV by saying you had concerns about your horse's health as it hadn't seemed right some mornings so you set it up to see what the horse was up to. Then you were amazed to find them going into the stable and stealing hay that you had paid for in your livery. Your horse went without hay some nights and therefore they owe you back the cost of hay you have paid for.

Number one is to get your horse off the yard and all your possessions. After that I would stop paying anything give up on the deposit and if they say anything suggest they sue. I would be beyond furious but number one priority is the horse's safety. Having got the horse out then I would let rip in no uncertain terms. If you set up the CCTV to study your horse's behaviour is there any reason why you can't show it to other people? You didn't ask the YO's to be part of the film show.

I agree with this regarding the CCTV. Say it was set up to record horses activity throughout the night and you was horrified to find hay being removed. I would too get your horse/possesions as good as away from the place before havng any conflict. However after finding this out I wouldn't be paying them any money! Disgusting behaviour.

 

[peaceandquiet1]

I would get out first-if they can take hay away from your horse they sound potentially nasty.If it came to it, you could always threaten to publicise your evidence-even if you don't intend to! But my instincts would be to get out asap.

 

[spotty_pony2]

This is awful - but something I have heard of before unfortunately and it seems to be not to rare an occurrence on livery yards these days. Moving to a private yard on DIY Livery was the best thing I ever did. It meant I could feed my horses exactly the way I wanted without worrying that it was being removed as soon as my back was turned!

 

[PoppyAnderson]

Agree with those saying get out first before saying anything. I wouldn't give a flying hoot about breaking any contract / notice period in these circumstances. Hand your notice in, get somewhere else set up for a fortnights time and then just tell them as you start packing up to leave. Are you in Cheshire by any chance? PM me if you'd rather.

 

[flirtygerty]

It happens with DIY as well, I rented a cottage on the yard, had three large horses, paid extra because of their size, ad lib hay was included in the price, when I left for night shift, horses being stabled early, hay was removed from the stables, it was a livery that told me what was going on, I moved the horses then gave up the cottage, yard rules changed as to what mood the ym was in, horrible yard

 

[BBP]

Government agencies and authorities can only use surveillance as evidence if it has been gathered in accordance with a RIPA authorisation, to protect people's rights under article 8 of the Human Rights Act (right to a private life). Private surveillance is a different matter, you had your own camera recording your own stable to keep an eye on the wellbeing of your horse with no intention of gathering personal and private information about others (right?!) I'd have no qualms about telling them I had done it.

 

[boomchakawowi]

Agree with those saying get out first before saying anything. I wouldn't give a flying hoot about breaking any contract / notice period in these circumstances. Hand your notice in, get somewhere else set up for a fortnights time and then just tell them as you start packing up to leave. Are you in Cheshire by any chance? PM me if you'd rather.

Lol no I'm not, I'm in Kent, I am leaving in just under 2 weeks now, I set another camera up last night too and they are taking the hay on a nightly basis

 

[boomchakawowi]

Thank you, I'm definitely going to tell them what I've got on video as I leave the premises, as for the deposit other than principle I'm not overly fussed they are going to need it after I've spread the word ....

 

[Handsome Jack]

Lol no I'm not, I'm in Kent, I am leaving in just under 2 weeks now, I set another camera up last night too and they are taking the hay on a nightly basis

Is it the same time of night each time? I would just 'turn up' and refill his net so they see that you know then the camera issues never have to come to light IF you are on dodgy ground....I would be furious with them!
We had a girl on DIY that was caught taking hay out of other peoples nets and feed out of bins as she was 'poor' and could not afford for her horse to eat! she even charged feed to someones account at the local feedstore!

 

[Princess16]

Thank you, I'm definitely going to tell them what I've got on video as I leave the premises, as for the deposit other than principle I'm not overly fussed they are going to need it after I've spread the word ....

Words fail me with that bunch of thieving gits! Hey can't you film their reaction when you tell them what you know? I'd pay money to watch their reaction lol - priceless! Good luck !