yesterday's news

J

JM07

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was terrible, tragic, dispicable, dreadful....it shouldn't happen/how did it happen..ETC..


i for one am NOT condoning the behaviour of MR. J. Grey
HERE, BUT......

as "horse lovers", "horse owners", can we honestly, hand on heart, say that we are TOTALLY ignorant of the goings on of "dealers" like Mr. Grey????..........

Southall Market, for all it's wrongs, DID have a service...it scooped up "rubbish"..the dregs of the horse/pony market which went, 85% of the time, to the abattoir...

it seems to me, that, unfortunately Mr Grey has exploited the void that Southall has left behind..

it does in no way detract from the fact that the RSPCA has, in the way ONLY the RSPCA knows why, failed to come up with the goods..ie 3 yrs of complaints that have been swept aside..

WHY..WHY...WHY should/could a "charity" a big and well known as the RSPCA just FAIL these animals?

i have, today, sent an email to the RSPCA regards to this fiasco, asking for an explanation....

i am YET to receive a reply

another thing that really strikes me is this...


30+ equines DEAD.......

i'm sorry but..........the stench from that must have been and still would be over the past few months extremely pungent..ANYONE passing by, beit walking/hacking/driving MUST of smelt it...WHY ON EARTH DIDN'T SOMEONE COMPLAIN TO ENVIROIMENT HEALTH???????


IT BEGGERS BELIEF.........................
 
Difficult to know how to comment. Having not been back in horses very long the dealing / market / pikey side is outside my experience - sorry I guess I've just ended up in the "fluffy" end of the game.

I doubt whether anyone local would have been able to tell the stench of rotting animal from what they would no doubt class as the stench expected from a settlement such as there seems to have been at Spindels Farm. I also gather from comments locally (to me) about complaints made to Environmental Health that they are not too good about maintaining the confidentiality of the complainant. One gathers that anyone complaining about Mr Grey would have bitten off quite a lot more than they wanted to chew.

As for the RSPCA - it has been said for years that they are failing in what most practical animal lovers see as their duty.
 
I was trying to think of a response but I wouldn't be articulate
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I agree with you. But how far can a person go to save a horse (or a hundred)?
We often see posts on here about neglected horses, and what should one do..
Apart from calling daily the bodies mentioned, most are told to keep an eye on the situation.
Short of opening the gate and letting them out and then calling for help..... I don't know...
Having been there, I have found the media works better than anything...

I totally agree about the dead bodies, find it hard to see how it could not have been noticed
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I think there are currently too many unknowns to comment properly on what has happened. Yes there were 30 or so dead horses, we don't know how long some of them had been dead, and they may well have gone beyond the smelly stage.

The pain that so many people are feeling at the news is totally understandable, but I for one, want to know more before i form an opinion on who has failed, and when.

To cast blame for not doing anything on local residents for not idenfiying any smell as being that of dead and dying horses is possibly a little unfair, i imagine they were as shocked at what has been found as anybody else
 
Well said, its all disgusting

Jaime Gray - DISGUSTING
RSPCA - DISGUSTING
Anyone who knew but did not do their best to do something about this - DISGUSTING
Police Force - DISGUSTING
The people breeding/trading in/eating these otherwise useless horses - DISGUSTING
 
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Well said, its all disgusting

Jaime Gray - DISGUSTING
RSPCA - DISGUSTING
Anyone who knew but did not do their best to do something about this - DISGUSTING
Police Force - DISGUSTING
The people breeding/trading in/eating these otherwise useless horses - DISGUSTING

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WHOA, hold on a minute..i didnt say ANYTHING about horses/ponies going for meat is DISGUSTING...
In fact, i have taken ponies/horses of my own to an Abattoir..it's the way that its done that needs to be addressed...
 
Not sure whether I should reply or not but here goes.

I have never been to a horse sales and never will. I have never bought from a dealer and never will and likewise I will never sell at a sales or to a dealer (whatever their reputation). That way I never need to see what goes on and in some small way will always protect my own horses from what "might happen", so you could call that ignorant but I really don't want to see what goes on.

I totally agree that the RSPCA should have done something a lot sooner & have to take a lot of the blame for this horrific incident - even if only to make sure the prosecution of this monster ends in a hefty prison sentence. I don't know what powers they have. Every time I've ever rang the RSPCA about something I've got "well it's not ideal but.........." I've rang the ILPH for the last 3 years about a local person & the condition of this persons horses - they visit her, they advise her but 3 years on her horses still look the same to me. She shouldn't have these horses, but in their opinion she's not ill treating them, neglecting them - so what do they call neglect?

But I will say and I know this is not politically correct (& I don't care) but my guess is Mr Grey is a pikey & they do seem to be above the law (rightly or wrongly). God if the police can't touch him, what hope has an animal welfare organisation got. I am sure he's been approached by ordinary people that he's intimidated beyond belief.

For instance on our local news last night was a huge report on hare coursing in Lincolnshire, it's been illegal for some time now (I'm not debating at all hunting) but these coursers (excuse spelling if that's wrong) were openly saying, we will course, we don't care if we're caught, no-one can touch us, prosecutions fall down, etc, etc. Basically, everyone is scared of these people and I think a lot of what's happened is down to this one reason. That's my own personal opinion.
 
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Well said, its all disgusting

Jaime Gray - DISGUSTING
RSPCA - DISGUSTING
Anyone who knew but did not do their best to do something about this - DISGUSTING
Police Force - DISGUSTING
The people breeding/trading in/eating these otherwise useless horses - DISGUSTING

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I agree.
frown.gif
 
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Not sure whether I should reply or not but here goes.

I have never been to a horse sales and never will. I have never bought from a dealer and never will and likewise I will never sell at a sales or to a dealer (whatever their reputation). That way I never need to see what goes on and in some small way will always protect my own horses from what "might happen", so you could call that ignorant but I really don't want to see what goes on.

I totally agree that the RSPCA should have done something a lot sooner & have to take a lot of the blame for this horrific incident - even if only to make sure the prosecution of this monster ends in a hefty prison sentence. I don't know what powers they have. Every time I've ever rang the RSPCA about something I've got "well it's not ideal but.........." I've rang the ILPH for the last 3 years about a local person & the condition of this persons horses - they visit her, they advise her but 3 years on her horses still look the same to me. She shouldn't have these horses, but in their opinion she's not ill treating them, neglecting them - so what do they call neglect?

But I will say and I know this is not politically correct (& I don't care) but my guess is Mr Grey is a pikey & they do seem to be above the law (rightly or wrongly). God if the police can't touch him, what hope has an animal welfare organisation got. I am sure he's been approached by ordinary people that he's intimidated beyond belief.

For instance on our local news last night was a huge report on hare coursing in Lincolnshire, it's been illegal for some time now (I'm not debating at all hunting) but these coursers (excuse spelling if that's wrong) were openly saying, we will course, we don't care if we're caught, no-one can touch us, prosecutions fall down, etc, etc. Basically, everyone is scared of these people and I think a lot of what's happened is down to this one reason. That's my own personal opinion.

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i go to sales, i buy and sell at sales...i'm NOT a "pikey"....but if a few horse/pony owners took off their "rose-coloured" specs, then they would actually SEE what CRAP went through sales...

and believe me, its serious CRAP!!!!

it's OK for 35% of the horse/pony owning public to take the moral high ground on the subject of " o, i'd NEVER buy/sell at a sale"...but get a grip here..GO to a sale, SEE wat happens, THEN make a judgement.....not ALL sales are "BAD".....
 
I wasn't saying you were a pikey for going to the sales.

I was saying probably Mr Grey is a pikey and that's why up to now he's been able to get away with what he's doing and that people are scared to approach him.

I choose not to go near the sales, exactly so I can't see what crap goes through them

I'm sure there are decent sales, they just don't interest me. There are plenty of horses in the mags etc, I've never felt the need to go to a sales and like I said I'd pity all the sad cases & come home with 100s that I can't possibly keep.
 
and i doubt you will get one......the RSPCA ia nothing but a political lobbying organization, as for the new animal wlfare act, well that has bombed dismally........
you are right about southall, yes it did get rid of the dregs, this has been my argument for years, at least if the meatman gets them they go quickly...speculation is that this guy exports for meat, but i can't see them getting into that state if that were true, i think something far more fishy is going on there.....will p.m you...
 
believe me, nijinsky, you wouldnt touch 30% of them with a bargepole....

the best place, and only place is the abattoir...
 
Just got on here and seen your post JM, and agree wholeheartedly.

OH and myself were watching coverage this morning, and we both commented on how many 'close neighbours' were out in front of the TV cameras, getting their five minutes of fame, while doing their hand wringing, and saying that they had no idea what had been going on.

Anyone who has ever had reason to come into contact with an animal that has been dead for a few days, will know that the rancid rotten stench travels an unbelievable distance. The smell is truly stomach churning.

I am actually really struggling to get my head around all this. The thought of those horses suffering a painful slow death, unloved, with not even a kind word or a comforting pat during their final miserable days, is absolutely heartbreaking.

It is totally incomprehensible that this could happen...
 
Exactly.

Never having been to a sales, I wouldn't have a clue how it all works, friends often go & tell me stories & I know I just couldn't stomach the sights. The images would stay with me for ages, that's just the way I am, so I'm better just steering clear.

Why are they allowed to sell such sorry states then? Aren't sales governed, who turns the blind eye? Really showing my ignorance now aren't I.

Actually my mare was sold as a 2 year old by her breeder at the Malvern Sales (I think Malvern - is that right?), well, she was bred in York so I suppose whatever sales is near there, she was sold through Sport Horse section. I didn't get her until she was 5.
 
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Yes there were 30 or so dead horses, we don't know how long some of them had been dead, and they may well have gone beyond the smelly stage.



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But they would have been at the smelly stage at some point, and unlike one horse being left to decompose, there were 30 horses.
Presuming that they didn't all die at once, that would mean that the smell would have been there at varying degrees, for some considerable time...
frown.gif
 
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Just got on here and seen your post JM, and agree wholeheartedly.

OH and myself were watching coverage this morning, and we both commented on how many 'close neighbours' were out in front of the TV cameras, getting their five minutes of fame, while doing their hand wringing, and saying that they had no idea what had been going on.

Anyone who has ever had reason to come into contact with an animal that has been dead for a few days, will know that the rancid rotten stench travels an unbelievable distance. The smell is truly stomach churning.

I am actually really struggling to get my head around all this. The thought of those horses suffering a painful slow death, unloved, with not even a kind word or a comforting pat during their final miserable days, is absolutely heartbreaking.

It is totally incomprehensible that this could happen...

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cant get my head round it all TBH Dubbs...if he wasfattening these ani,mals for the meat market, then he was, IMO, doing a real pisspoor job of it.
 
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Yes there were 30 or so dead horses, we don't know how long some of them had been dead, and they may well have gone beyond the smelly stage.



[/ QUOTE ]
But they would have been at the smelly stage at some point, and unlike one horse being left to decompose, there were 30 horses.
Presuming that they didn't all die at once, that would mean that the smell would have been there at varying degrees, for some considerable time...
frown.gif


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exactly...havin had a pony's head in an ashbin out the back yard..(dont ask!!) for 3 days, the smell was bearable!!

i cannot and will not accept that the good old members of the public "just didnt notice the smell"...bollox, did they...
 
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cant get my head round it all TBH Dubbs...if he wasfattening these animals for the meat market, then he was, IMO, doing a real pisspoor job of it.

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Coincidentally I've just posted about that!! There IS a market for horsemeat here and the horses are properly fattened up, not left until they're skin and bone, because they're sold by weight. So WHAT JG's intention was by starving his horses totally eludes me...
 
Unfortunately, there will always be 'nasty numpty's' who think they can treat animals in this way.
Weve all seen the types at auctions and the like- its written all over their face, the dregs of the horse world!

Ive met many types of horse people throughout my life-numpties who feel bravado at being able to 'boss' a horse physically, or put it in their place-such big people!
confused.gif


There is so much going on that we don't know or even hear about. To be honest not enough people are prepared/or can do anything about it. Its all down to legislation and the authorities. No-one should be above the law, the rspca need to get some balls!
 
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cant get my head round it all TBH Dubbs...if he wasfattening these ani,mals for the meat market, then he was, IMO, doing a real pisspoor job of it.

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The majority of his stock was probably aquired for a few pounds - he wouldn't need to feed them up to make a profit on them...
 
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WHOA, hold on a minute..i didnt say ANYTHING about horses/ponies going for meat is DISGUSTING...
In fact, i have taken ponies/horses of my own to an Abattoir..it's the way that its done that needs to be addressed...

[/ QUOTE ]

The crap you mention that goes through these sales is bred for them. Thats whats bl**dy wrong. For there to be nothing stopping these scumbags making a living from trading horses to feed Italians is wrong. These horses should not exist in the first place, they are never going to be anything other than meat. We should not need a service for disposing of the rubbish - breeding standards must be imposed so that there is no rubbish.
 
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[ QUOTE ]
Yes there were 30 or so dead horses, we don't know how long some of them had been dead, and they may well have gone beyond the smelly stage.



[/ QUOTE ]
But they would have been at the smelly stage at some point, and unlike one horse being left to decompose, there were 30 horses.
Presuming that they didn't all die at once, that would mean that the smell would have been there at varying degrees, for some considerable time...
frown.gif


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Where have I heard that before.. actually I know, we've just been watching band of brothers (WW2 drama) and the episode where they find the concentration camps. Totally different scale but featured a lot of the local apathy and general look the other way attitude that featured at the time, the absolvement of responsibility.
I think all this is only just starting to sink in. Can't bear to think about what those poor horses went though
 
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30+ equines DEAD.......

i'm sorry but..........the stench from that must have been and still would be over the past few months extremely pungent..ANYONE passing by, beit walking/hacking/driving MUST of smelt it...WHY ON EARTH DIDN'T SOMEONE COMPLAIN TO ENVIROIMENT HEALTH???????


IT BEGGERS BELIEF.........................

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I have read a lot of stuff about this over the last couple of days so forgive me if I am a little vague about where I read this, the old memory is not what it was,
BUT,
someone on a forum (may have even been this one) said they often rode past this farm and it always stank. It has also been said that the farm had been reported on numerous occasions, specifically re. the stink yet still this horrible man was left to get on with starving these horses.
I have also read that this man and his family are abusive and aggressive, and I can't blame members of the public for not wanting to get into a confrontation with them. They were probably scared, and hoped that 'the authorities' would act if they reported it.
 
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