Youngster with a phobia! Help!

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Ernie2001

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Hello I'm a but new to this so bare with me! I have a 4, nearly 5 yo tb x who was badly injured as a yearly on barbed wire. It affected his hind leg (left) and he allows me to pick his feet but anything else he freaks!

Typically that leg has a white sock and with the weather has a touch of mud fever. He is in every night so he is not constantly in mud and its only really the gateway area in the field that is bad. However I would like to treat it before it gets any worse :rolleyes: which he doesn't agree with!

He has had a jaw operation, sarcoid treatment and his leg injury in his very short life so he can smell a vet a mile away and will get very aggressive if provoked by one! :eek:

Has anyone else had a horse with a real phobia of having a certain area touched? He will kick but never aims at me but the opposite direction, I think he's just trying to get away rather than injure any one, in every other way he fab, we broke him ourselves and he's turning out to be cracking just wish he would let me touch that leg :( thanks in advance for any advice.
 
I've had success with similar problems using clicker training. It helps to establish positive associations and makes it a more pleasant experience for the horse. Have a google for info, but essentially you teach the horse to associate the 'click' with a treat (rosehips are a healthy tasty option for this). Then start very slowly - touch the foot, click and treat if he is calm. Keep doing that, then work your way up very slowly to what you need to achieve.

Google for Karen Pryor, she's very good on horse clicker training info.
 
A rescue horse I rehabilitated used to be terrified to have anything below the knees touched.

My suggestion would be to just randomly run your hand down the leg very non-chalantly as far as he will calmly let you go. Then go a little farther while pretending like you don't care a bit about actually getting to the bottom of the leg. It's really all in your attitude - just push the boundaries by a tiny bit each day. When he realizes you don't care if he's afraid but you are also not going to push past his comfort zone too much you will be able to start desensitizing him.

Patience, I am sorry to say, is the best thing for this. Go down a teeny bit farther every day and soon you should be able to comfortable do anything down there. Depending on his temperament it could take longer or shorter but it's not something that you'll be able to find a quick fix for.
 
Thanks he is just so suspicious, if you look at his leg for too long he gets paranoid! I have tried the stick idea but he hates it even if you are as gentle and quiet as possible :(
 
For our WB with ear twitching issues we had things on end of sticks. We went up to a certain point and stopped when she tensed but kept the pressure there until she relaxed and then took it away. Stop at the same point until she didn't react at all then up the pressure by moving closer to her ears. It takes time and and repeating everyday.
 
slightlyconfused said:
For our WB with ear twitching issues we had things on end of sticks. We went up to a certain point and stopped when she tensed but kept the pressure there until she relaxed and then took it away. Stop at the same point until she didn't react at all then up the pressure by moving closer to her ears. It takes time and and repeating everyday.
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^^ this. The reward is taking the pressure away as the horse relaxes. It has taken me 6 months to touch and pick up the hinds on a yearling who had a fright before he came to me. (I struggled to touch him any where). It was time consuming, frustrating and took forever, but eventually it worked. I used a walking stick with a big soft glove padded and taped on to the crook end of the stick with vetwrap.

My boy was petrified, did lots of nervous gulping and kicked like stink. I did the front end first, stroking him with the hand until he relaxed and then I removed the hand (no titbits at all), I did not go to the hinds until he would allow me to handle the front end without a fuss at all. I started at his hip and worked downward, everytime he kicked the hand off I put it back on, eventually he accepted it and started to lick, chew and lower his head.

At Christmas the farrier was able to trim his feet and handle him all over. He is still work in progress but he is learning.
 
Ernie2001 said:
Thanks he is just so suspicious, if you look at his leg for too long he gets paranoid! I have tried the stick idea but he hates it even if you are as gentle and quiet as possible :(
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My youngster was like this when I got him and he got sore legs in the first winter but I think it was due to the introduction of hay. He was very paranoid about me even lookimg at hie legs, there was no way I could get near them! I did get the vet out as I was worried as he was obviously uncomfortable as his legs were a bit swollen and oozing yellow scabs. The vet actually said to leave them alone and prescribed some painkillers to make him mroe comfortable. He did say if we could, to hose his legs to wash off/loosen the scabs but, other than that, as they weren't infected just leave them.

It healed up on its own once his body has got used to the hay - the vet basically said the change in diet can cause this type of reaction and as the weight of the horse is on their legs (obviously), the way the 'toxins' escape the system are out through the legs.

I did make sure I continued to pick his legs up to pick his feet out but, although we manage to get the odd bit of cream on on occasion, other than that as it was making him more paranoid we just let him be and just checked they weren't getting worse. He has white legs too and all 4 were affected but the backs were worse. I don't know if it is something to do with white legs/pink skin. My other horse suffers dermatitis on his white leg.

My youngster has not suffered with his legs the last two winters though.
 
Groom with a nice soft brush, & on that leg stick well within the area he is happy with, even if that's above the stifle. Move further down the leg half an inch at a time, always ensuring you move back into the safe area before he moves himself. And continue to do so for however many weeks or months it takes to be able to handle his entire leg without him bothering. Also use your hands. Until mudrash cleared up though I would entirely avoid that area cos its no doubt sensitive. And I would hang up a swede while I did the leg stuff so that he has positive associations with that leg being touched, rather than negative.
Short term, I'd probably just launch alum salts disolved in water from a safe distance at his leg every eve, then put baby oil in an empty spray bottle & cover leg from out of range. If possible get someone else to do it so he doesn't associate you with messing with his leg.
 
Littlelegs said:
Groom with a nice soft brush, & on that leg stick well within the area he is happy with, even if that's above the stifle. Move further down the leg half an inch at a time, always ensuring you move back into the safe area before he moves himself. And continue to do so for however many weeks or months it takes to be able to handle his entire leg without him bothering. Also use your hands. Until mudrash cleared up though I would entirely avoid that area cos its no doubt sensitive. And I would hang up a swede while I did the leg stuff so that he has positive associations with that leg being touched, rather than negative.
Short term, I'd probably just launch alum salts disolved in water from a safe distance at his leg every eve, then put baby oil in an empty spray bottle & cover leg from out of range. If possible get someone else to do it so he doesn't associate you with messing with his leg.
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The first bit makes sense to me, but the second does not. Surely throwing water and oil from a distance is only going to make the horse even more space defensive. Every one to their own, but if I was in the Op's position and needing to dress the leg I would sedate using acp for as many days as needed to address the problem. Then when the soreness has gone move onto getting the horse to accept being handled.

Pain association is strong in us and horses, my lad had 2 septic feet together back in the summer and even now he has an opinion when I pick his feet up.
 
I do see your point aa, but I've always found if a horse has major issues with something, acp just makes them react worse. And from what op says, getting vet out to sedate iv could be just as stressful. I agree its not ideal, but short term might work if other methods haven't. Of course long term there are far better ways, but if the leg gets worse, the horse will have good reason to continue to be defensive if it gets painful. And because its at a distance although it won't help his relationship with op, he won't necessarily associate it with that leg. I suppose it comes down to which is the priority short term.
I also should have said to spray the oil on next morning when legs are dry, before turning out, rather than as a wierd combination.
Just another idea, but if he'll let you pick out feet could you pick up foot & put it down again into the bucket to wash it? Then next morning cover your hand in green oils before picking out feet so it ends up on his leg? Doesn't have to be green oils but that's reasonably thick & will stick to your hand & will probably do more good than just vaseline if any other handling is out of the question at the moment.
 
I agree Littlelegs, there are times when it would help if they realised we are helping them !!

My lad soon learnt to clear off if I walked towards him carrying anything ! My little tack tray with the poultices and duct tape was the sworn enemy.

He is still barn/small paddock resting due to his ongoing injury, and his feet are soft, having a look was greeted with horror this evening, after all he is only 19, I am sure he will grow up soon. He has a patch of heat - oh joy.
 
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