3.5t layout preferences

[Green Bean]

As the title suggests, I have a preference in layout based on my horse's needs (anxious in confined spaces). I am struggling to understand the dominance of stallion layout interiors where there is no 'bar' at the horse's chest and a triangular wheel well covering right at the front of the the horse's front legs.
My box is open to the back from my horse's chest onwards, so no separation of the horse area to the back. Now I can understand the separation between horse and back being attractive so you don't have hay flying around (again not an issue for me as horse is too nervous to eat in the box, and yes, I have received professional help with this) but cannot understand the 'obsession' with stallion layouts. Hoping someone can enlighten me.
PS - realised this is a very real thing after joining 2 FB groups for 3.5t boxes for sale

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

They don't make many boxes with a bar at the chest now because horses have been known to go over them especially if they face the rear where the back door is.

As for the rest I have no idea.

 

[Abacus]

I've had both types. When I bought it the stallion layout seemed attractive because of the separation and tidiness, also the apparent safety of them being unable to go over a beast bar (although I have never had this happen). I used it for one outing, my horse travelled terribly, and somehow cut the front of his face badly - I think he must have fallen forwards without a bar to protect him. Sold it, would never go back. I have a great lorry now with a high breast bar and V grills, they would put a horse off trying to go over them - but isn't as claustrophobic as a wall in front of their face. And don't get me started on floors that aren't flat because of the wheel arches. If yours works for you, just keep at it!

 

[dottylottie]

my preference would be a half “box” in front of them so the grooms area is completely separate, but they still have a half wall to brace themselves on in the event of an accident.

i wouldn’t want one with a breast bar, for fear of them trying to go over it.

 

[Tiddlypom]

The ‘obsession’ with stallion layouts, as you put it, is to do with safety.

IME horses travel well in the stallion layout and there is nowhere for the horse to get hooked up on if it messes about. It is what I would have if I was buying.

In contrast, if a horse jumps a breast bar it can be a fire brigade job to release the horse.

 

[Squeak]

As TP said, the stallion layouts prevent horses from jumping over the half wall/ breast bar. When you have a full wall/ stallion set up then the wall dividing the horse area to the grooms area is further back and so the wheel arches end up in the horse area. There are several ways of concealing them and one of the safest ways of doing it is the triangular cones you've mentioned as they prevent the horses from climbing on them or catching themselves on corners.

 

[ycbm]

I've seen a 3.5t where the horse came out of the back door as the van was traveling along the road. I would never travel a horse in a 3.5t without a full wall.
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[Polos Mum]

As above, the full wall is far less about messy hay and more about safety. In the stallion layout there is much less for the little darlings to get stick on / in / over etc. Horses have an ability to self harm at a level unknown in any other species.
One very well know reputable builder told me you could only travel them in a box with a breast bar if you put a harness on them and strap them down !! That sounded like major hassle.

If you go and stand in them, the stallion interior has much more room that I was expecting. My horse stands with his bum at the back (up against the reinforced bit behind the driver) and has miles of room in front of him.

I'm sure they each have preferences but having them somewhere they can't climb out of seemed a priority to me

 

[MissTyc]

My preference (put money where mouth is by having it built) is a full wall between horse and back door/tack area, but also a collapsible breast bar as my horse like to brace chest on bar and swing their heads for balance. I pretty much only ever travel one, so they can stand at whatever angle they prefer as I tend to lock in the partition as a "wedge" for max space. Never had a horse that liked being partitioned into a straight line, although they will tolerate it on the odd occasion they travel together.

My super solid perfect traveller gelding went over the breast bar in a previous 3.5t. I'll never really know why and he jumped back into his spot when I screamed at him, so it ended well but gave me enough of a fright to really think about what he, and others, needed to be comfortable during travel even in times of distress or stress. That same gelding HATES stallion boxes. Yes, he is technically safe, but he sweats up and paws the ground and kicks the front wall and/or wheel arch if there isone, whereas in my box with breast bar he stands and eats and doesn't sweat up.

 

[MereChristmas]

I have heard of these incidences locally
..a horse going partly over the breast bar and getting stuck
…a horse hurting it’s nose and neck by falling into the stallion wall when the driver had to do an emergency stop. I think there was some kind of rebound. There was no breast bar

The cone shapes quite often are over the wheel arches and are in shorter length vehicles. Some of these have an angle cut across the ramp too.

If I was able to have a new 3.5 horsebox I would have a full length one with a stallion wall with door, a breast bar and an emergency exit at the rear. This makes the ‘living’ very small but it would carry all I need.
I believe there are some already made to this design.

 

[Anna Clara]

Mine went over the breast bar despite having a full wall so nowhere to go. I’m now travelling without a bar or partition and he’s so much happier. I only ever travel one so that’s fine. I might reconfigure it to get a sort of partition 3/4 of the way across so I can have the ramp down but something closed that I can slip in and out of

 

[Tiddlypom]

If there is to be a breast bar, it must be able to be collapsed from the outside if the horse does get hooked up on it. You don’t want to be in the box by a stressed horse trying to free it.

 

[MissTyc]

If I was able to have a new 3.5 horsebox I would have a full length one with a stallion wall with door, a breast bar and an emergency exit at the rear. This makes the ‘living’ very small but it would carry all I need.
I believe there are some already made to this design.

That's what I did with mine

 

[millitiger]

I recently changed from a 7.5 to 3.5 ton box.

Initially I wanted one built as I was adamant I didn't want a stallion box, which they all seem to be.
I did want a full wall but I wanted a breast bar for my horse to lean on, as I couldn't work out how he would brace without one.

I now have a stallion box and it's super!
Way more room than my 7.5t for the horse (would recommend a box with the sliding partition), more head height and he travels BEAUTIFULLY in it.

This is the layout of mine, sleeper cabin in the Luton, accessed through the cab and then nearly the whole back is for the horses, no living to speak of. Which you really can't have if you have 17hh+ horses like me.

 

[nikkimariet]

I would never travel without a full separation between the horse and any living area personally. If you’ve a tricky traveller the stallion layout is great I imagine.

Mine has covered tack lockers, headboard and a full partition but not quite as closed off as the stallion layout. My tack lockers are on the side and externally accessed. The living is a seat with storage and full height wardrobe. I also have a locker in the horse area which makes use of part of the chassis space.

 

[Mari]

As the title suggests, I have a preference in layout based on my horse's needs (anxious in confined spaces). I am struggling to understand the dominance of stallion layout interiors where there is no 'bar' at the horse's chest and a triangular wheel well covering right at the front of the the horse's front legs.
My box is open to the back from my horse's chest onwards, so no separation of the horse area to the back. Now I can understand the separation between horse and back being attractive so you don't have hay flying around (again not an issue for me as horse is too nervous to eat in the box, and yes, I have received professional help with this) but cannot understand the 'obsession' with stallion layouts. Hoping someone can enlighten me.
PS - realised this is a very real thing after joining 2 FB groups for 3.5t boxes for sale

I'm like you. Now looking for my 3rd 3.5 horsebox. My first was built by Staffordshire horse boxes . I loved it, no stallion partition & not solid to floor / no wall between horse / groom area / plenty of storage / full width ramp with up & over “lid”. I only sold it because I broke my wrist & found the lack of power steering hard to manage. Had my second horsebox built by someone local to me (now retired) but same spec as first one. Am now looking for an automatic as I have arthritis affecting my left elbow so find changing gear hard. (Also I have an automatic car & love it). I’m happy to buy the van & have Staffordshire build me a box but I can’t find a suitable chassis. (Neither can they).
I have found out that if the wheel arch is in / or partly in the horse area then it’s not a LWB chassis.

 

[Mari]

Horses for courses. My 3 very different horses are all brilliant travellers & very calm & well behaved. I only travel one at a time in my very basic, no frills 3.5. Go everywhere on my own & have never had a problem in over 20 years.

 

[Identityincrisis]

I have found out that if the wheel arch is in / or partly in the horse area then it’s not a LWB chassis.

That’s not the case, mine is LWB (I sourced the van myself) but as it is a stallion wall it does have a small amount of cone-age over the wheel arches

 

[ycbm]

That’s not the case, mine is LWB (I sourced the van myself) but as it is a stallion wall it does have a small amount of cone-age over the wheel arches

Mine was the same.

I don't understand the problem with the wheel arches, the covers never bothered mine.
.

 

[ycbm]

This is the layout of mine, sleeper cabin in the Luton, accessed through the cab and then nearly the whole back is for the horses, no living to speak of. Which you really can't have if you have 17hh+ horses like me.

There is room for living to sleep one on the back if you have a LWB van. I used to travel a 17 hand horse with a full wall and the living had both room for a stretcher bed from side to side and 18 inches of floor space to stand up and move around in.
.

 

[Time for Tea]

That's what I did with mine

Mine is also like this, my breast bars are like those in Ifor Williams trailers, ie there are two of them. In fact I have taken them out as the ponies seem happier without them.

 

[Time for Tea]

That’s not the case, mine is LWB (I sourced the van myself) but as it is a stallion wall it does have a small amount of cone-age over the wheel arches

Mine is also LWB, and has a small covered wheel arch in horse area, it’s no problem

 

[millitiger]

There is room for living to sleep one on the back if you have a LWB van. I used to travel a 17 hand horse with a full wall and the living had both room for a stretcher bed from side to side and 18 inches of floor space to stand up and move around in.
.

People can and do but the horse stall is shorter than what I have in general.
I prefer to have the sleeping for 2 people in the cab and leave behind the bulkhead for the horse

 

[Polos Mum]

Mine is also like this, my breast bars are like those in Ifor Williams trailers, ie there are two of them. In fact I have taken them out as the ponies seem happier without them.

The most important thing about the IW breast bars is that you can undo them from the outside, with a simple allen key (it unscrews and drops out). Then if you have any sort of problem you can free the horse without anybody having to go into the trailer - which is safest for people and pony!

 

[Tiddlypom]

The wheel arches do not intrude or compromise the safety or the horse space as long as they are very sturdily protected

This is the make and model (Marlborough stud box) that I have hired on occasion.

 

[Tiddlypom]

The most important thing about the IW breast bars is that you can undo them from the outside, with a simple allen key (it unscrews and drops out). Then if you have any sort of problem you can free the horse without anybody having to go into the trailer - which is safest for people and pony!

Indeed - I’ve had to do this for real at the vets, when the pillock of an elderly travelling companion decided to try to leap the breast bar in our Ifor 510 . He was released within minutes with barely a scratch, with us safely outside of the trailer undoing the breast bar attachment.

The vets were highly impressed, another horse had done the same thing there earlier in the week in a horsebox and it took the fire brigade to cut him out.

 

[ycbm]

People can and do but the horse stall is shorter than what I have in general.
I prefer to have the sleeping for 2 people in the cab and leave behind the bulkhead for the horse

I don't understand this. With a LWB my horse area was long enough for an 18 hand horse and there was still 4ft of living at the back. Why would you want a horse area so much longer than the horse? The person who bought mine had a longer area in her old one, and said it gave her problems because the horse would back up and run forward just because he had room. It was a bonus for her that he couldn't do that so much, as well as it giving her room to leave her dogs in the living. I also needed the tack locker and storage space in the living.
.

 

[lme]

We have a stallion box with a full wall and easily movable partition. It has the cones over the wheel arches. All our horses travel well in it. We have travelled feral babies, huge older horses and a mare with foal at foot and never had an issue. It has a top canopy that opens upwards, which I was unsure about but now really like. There are 'soft' breast bars we could attach (chain inside plastic tube like a stable guard) but we don't use them.

 

[Boulty]

I’ve got a full wall but with a sort of “shelf” for the haynet / horses head. I think I’m part this is a compromise to give a bit more room in the tack area whilst still giving the horse space for his head (it’s a van conversion so a totally straight stallion box style design would either give you virtually no room in the back or a tiny horse area) but it does mean he has something to lean his chest on that he can’t climb all over (he’s an idiot who I wouldn’t trust in a box that was open at the back).

It does work well in terms of keeping everything tidy and giving me a smaller and so warmer space for sleeping in when I stay over places.

I did have some ventilation issues on very warm days last year though that I don’t think would have occurred if it didn’t have the full wall so am going to see about putting some extra vents and windows in before Summer.

I have previously had a box without a full wall / with a breast bar for a previous horse who was quite claustrophobic and he seemed to prefer it to hire boxes with full walls or stallion box setup buuuut he was way too well endowed in the brains department to think about climbing over.

I think the wheel arches ending up in the horse area is more a which van model you have and what kind of wheelbase. I believe the longer wheelbase models are less likely to have this issue and I think (but could be wrong) that Master / Movano is best make of van for avoiding this? Certainly the long wheelbase Movano I used to have had no wheelarches in the horse area and the Master I currently have doesn’t either. (In both cases they’re firmly in the tack area)

 

[millitiger]

I don't understand this. With a LWB my horse area was long enough for an 18 hand horse and there was still 4ft of living at the back. Why would you want a horse area so much longer than the horse? The person who bought mine had a longer area in her old one, and said it gave her problems because the horse would back up and run forward just because he had room. It was a bonus for her that he couldn't do that so much, as well as it giving her room to leave her dogs in the living. I also needed the tack locker and storage space in the living.
.

It's fine for you not to understand or agree

Mine is LWB too; if you look my bulkhead is further back than usual by about 20 inches which gives me a bench behind cab seats.
This means I can sleep 2 people easily in my lorry, rather than only 1 in the living, which is important to me.

I like having lots of room in the horse area, as I have very big horses I take out alone.
When tacking up and studding up inside the box, I like as much room around me as possible.
Mine are cross tied so I don't have any issues of them running backwards and forwards, that seems an odd thing to do anyway tbh!