A little annoyed

[Hannah1Pie]

Yesterday i took my horse into this local show and did a few classes which i was happy with but one of my classes made me a tad angry, it was the ridden hunter class and all we were asked to do was a walk,trot,canter and extended canter.

We had a fair few in our class and then i went up and i was so proud of my boy, we did a perfect forward going walk and trot, i did a change of rein on the diagonal and then a figure of eight in canter followed by and extended canter down the long side which i then pulled back to a steady twenty metre circle in canter and another in trot up the other end

I thought we did so well.

Then this other girl went up with her youngster, as soon as she got out there her horse wouldnt stand still infront of the judge she then went off and did the slowest of walks and went straight up into trot from there, it was all a little muddled tbh her horses head was throwing about in the air and her hands were on her knees trying to pull him back down, she did a few changes of rein and twenty metres in trot and then attempted a canter but couldnt get the right leg so she she left it and finished her routine.

i dont get it

When we were being placed the judge called out the people for 1st and second and then called out this girl on the youngster giving her third place and gave me 4th... she couldnt even get a canter and my routine included everything the judge asked and the judge even told me how well i completed my routine... i was a little dissapointed but more baffled at how this girl came third when both me and others in my class had completed our routines and yet still come after this girl

 

[Hannah1Pie]

The '

i dont get it' was sposed to be at the end of the post not sure how i put it there

 

[louisevictoria]

unfortunately that is the pitfalls of showing

I had the same thing a few weeks ago doing a WH class

 

[skewbaldpony]

that's what gets me with showing - probably find the judge's stallion sired the 3rd placed horse - or her husband is the girl's godfather. I can't stand it either, which is such a shame, as I love the notion of showing ... I was only thinking about good old fashioned hunter types the other day, and day dreaming about my youthful showing days!

 

[SillySausage]

[ QUOTE ]
that's what gets me with showing - probably find the judge's stallion sired the 3rd placed horse - or her husband is the girl's godfather. I can't stand it either, which is such a shame, as I love the notion of showing ... I was only thinking about good old fashioned hunter types the other day, and day dreaming about my youthful showing days!

[/ QUOTE ]

Lol! How true... perhaps it was the judge's secret lovechild

 

[Hannah1Pie]

Its that sort of thing that has put me of showing its like before i went to a dressage with my mate and i was on my cob and she was on her big 17.1 slender horse and i watched hers and coz her horse is young he got in the ring and was spooking at everything and over bending and got the wrong canter lead and well you get the idea, even she came out saying how bad it was and how many faults she had (shes 30 years old and has all her BHS's and stuff) so shes gonna know wat shes talkin about.

Then i went in on my boy did a nice test well paced but got the wrong leg once but corrected myself immediately and i got like 50% which is terrible for me and she got 71% i mean what the hell was with that, and then the big shocker is that as my mum was walking past the judg she was telling her friend how she only realli like the pretty slender horse ...SERIOUSLY... its like all judges are cob phobic or something lol

 

[Hannah1Pie]

[Lol! How true... perhaps it was the judge's secret lovechild

[/ QUOTE ]

Haha yeah lol maybe

 

[TinselRider]

Thats the reason I don't do showing (or dressage for that matter!) atleast showjumping if you hit a pole YOU HIT A POLE wether you are riding a slimlined thoroughbred or a bulky cob job!

 

[skewbaldpony]

that's what my daughter says! she is so sick of being 'beaten' at PC by the master's daughter, and anyone else with a posh lorry and the right surname, she refused to take part in anything that involves any potential for nepotism!

 

[Hannah1Pie]

Yeah think im heading that way tbh, its getting rediculous and along with that the amount of judges that have said to me... dont you think its about time to sell up and get a bigger better horse...WHATS WRONG WITH MY COB

... competeing to me is sposed to be a bit of fun i didnt buy my horse to do it, its just a little extra in having him, i love him to bits and hes with me for life now no matter what people say

 

[abracadabra]

theres nothing wrong with your cob, the people with hang ups about the size and type of horse you choose to ride...well maybe theyre compensating for something, you know, like they say about men and flashy sports cars

 

[skewbaldpony]

Small horse envy, had their rocking horses taken off them too young?

 

[Mithras]

But it was a hunter class, not a riding or dressage test. So I guess the judges thought her horse was more of a hunter type than yours and, obviously being a youngster, let him off with making mistakes?

 

[alsxx]

Thats showing for you I'm afraid! Last year I took my youngster to her first ever show, just the RC summer show to do the young horse class. There were about 11 or 12 in the class, we walked and trotted round, judge pulled 6 into line for individual show and then told the rest of us that she only had rosettes to 6th place and that we could all leave!!!

 

[skewbaldpony]

[ QUOTE ]
But it was a hunter class, not a riding or dressage test. So I guess the judges thought her horse was more of a hunter type than yours and, obviously being a youngster, let him off with making mistakes?

[/ QUOTE ]

Now that is a point, and one I should have spotted, had I not become so jaded about showing!
Realistically, your cob should be in a cob class?
However, it still wouldn't have helped him if the judge's god daughter had been in the same cob class. Possibly even if she was on an arab.

 

[TGM]

Showing is about conformation, action and type, as well as manners and performance. If you enter a cob in a hunter class, I'm afraid you have to accept the risk that a horse of true hunter type will be placed above you even if it does not perform as well.

If you want to be judge on performance only, then perhaps something like a dressage test is a better option for you.

 

[abracadabra]

[/ QUOTE ]

Now that is a point, and one I should have spotted, had I not become so jaded about showing!


[/ QUOTE ]

haha, ditto here

 

[skewbaldpony]

[ QUOTE ]

If you want to be judge on performance only, then perhaps something like a dressage test is a better option for you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Did you see the last olympics ?!

The notion of dressage being judged on performance only is endearing, but also very very funny.

Only showjumping remains objective in actual performance, and even that is up to its neck in mutual back scratching until the start bell goes!

 

[AmyMay]

That's showing for you.

Smile and put it down to experience.

 

[RunToEarth]

[ QUOTE ]
Showing is about conformation, action and type, as well as manners and performance. If you enter a cob in a hunter class, I'm afraid you have to accept the risk that a horse of true hunter type will be placed above you even if it does not perform as well.

If you want to be judge on performance only, then perhaps something like a dressage test is a better option for you.

[/ QUOTE ]
Completely agree with this. You enter the showing ring knowing your horse is to be judged on this, so whether you think he was the best in the class is really rather here nor there.
It does annoy me when people slag off the showing world because it really isn't that corrupt.

 

[TGM]

I meant that if the OP didn't want her horse's conformation and type taken into account but just his flatwork display, then dressage is a better bet than showing. I'm afraid that dressage is by nature subjective, as all judges will have slightly different views and priorities - perhaps one day they will be able to score it by video analysis!

I'm glad my comments amused you though - I like to spead a little joy on Monday mornings!

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
WHATS WRONG WITH MY COB

[/ QUOTE ]
Ah, just read this.

Thee is nothing wrong with your cob - however, a 'hunter' he aint.

So you need to be looking at entering him in different classes - as you'll never do well in hunter classes.

 

[skewbaldpony]

[ QUOTE ]
You enter the showing ring knowing your horse is to be judged on this, so whether you think he was the best in the class is really rather here nor there.
It does annoy me when people slag off the showing world because it really isn't that corrupt.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't have broad enough experience to say that you are wrong about that, you may be right about some of it, indeed you may well be a good deal more familiar with a good deal more of it than I, but the bit I've bumped into is as corrupt as all get out!

I think maybe, the little shows are the worst - maybe when you get up the tree a bit, it improves. But at the local level, it's damn near impossible for the judge not to know someone, be related to them, or owe them a favour. And it shows. (ha!)

I do agree though, that I'd missed the main thing - a cob's not going to do best in a hunter class, even if the judge is a saint.

 

[skewbaldpony]

[ QUOTE ]
I meant that if the OP didn't want her horse's conformation and type taken into account but just his flatwork display, then dressage is a better bet than showing. I'm afraid that dressage is by nature subjective, as all judges will have slightly different views and priorities - perhaps one day they will be able to score it by video analysis!

I'm glad my comments amused you though - I like to spead a little joy on Monday mornings!

[/ QUOTE ]

Good, smile and the world smiles with you, that's what I say!

If only it were only down to views and priorities though... rather than downright favouritism!

 

[TGM]

[ QUOTE ]
If only it were only down to views and priorities though... rather than downright favouritism!

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't comment on favouritism in top level dressage, but I must say at RC and PC level in this area, we have found the judging to be mostly fair. Sometimes we find some judges prefer our pony's way of going to others, but never have we felt that daughter and pony have been marked down due to favouritism or other competitors knowing the judges. Likewise, my daughter is often placed highly in dressage, but has no connection to the judges whatsoever! I also have written for quite a few dressage judges and have found them all of them to be fair, committed and unbiased.

Perhaps, it is different at top level where more money and egos are involved, but I have no personal experience of that, so not for me to comment!

 

[Mavis Cluttergusset]

From my (admittedly limited to one employer and her connections) experience of top level judges/producers, its a lot to do with who's sat on it as opposed to what it looks like.

 

[Hannah1Pie]

I do understand that if the horse looks like a good hunter and has the confirmations and so on then it would have been ok but this horse was 14.2hh slender didnt have the best confirmation, i have seen hunter classes and i go to the big shows and watch them and i have never seen a horse like the this one in one of those, and my cob is all clipped up and hes not a bog standard cob, a little while ago i did post a picture of him on here asking what breed everyone thought he was and so many people looked at his build and have said he looks like hes got ID in him and so on, weither thats true or not i dont know but hes not one of these massive chunky fury cobs that you see, and they dont have a cob class any more. I did ask my instructor and the people on my yard if they thought i should enter him into the hunter and they said i should.

 

[Mithras]

Why don't you show him in a cob class, instead of a hunter class?

Showing can be about who you know. BUT I am not an exceptional judge of a horse, yet I can pick out the first and second in most hunter and riding horse classes at most shows without much difficulty, and I bet most of us are the same. There are usually one or two animals that just stand out. Its the marketplace for the breeding world, at a higher level, after all.

Showing is surely about a combination of trueness to type, conformation, presence and way of going, in that order?

 

[Kenzo]

Oh the joys of the showring, I wouldn't even bother worring about it, so don't take it personally.

I do quite a bit of judging and I can say that sometimes I'm surprised what gets brought into the championship ring at the end of the day from the other rings, in fact it's quite scary and you usually find out after wards that like others have said, either its a horse they have bred, used etc or they know the owners, or it just looks good, or they want a judging appointment, or the secretaries daughter, local livery yard etc etc...and so forth, which is why shows should make sure there judge is not from the same area, which is why you pay them to travel the distance as well as there time.

I had don't like to say it but half of local showing is in my view is total a waste of time and money because the judges are doing people favours, its a farse! rather than knowing what they are looking for and judging the horse and the rider on that particular day.

 

[latottwirl]

I find that a lot of people who don't get placed immediately look for another reason - I have been to so many shows where people come out the ring with a 3rd, and just because they didn't get 2nd, the judge is corrupt/knows the rider/is sleeping with the riders father.

I'm afraid you went showing and it is the judges OPINION on the day - if you can't accept the judges opinion then you shouldn't be showing. We've all been to shows where we are unplaced for seemingly no reason, and you just have to say "Oh well, judge didn't like my horse, won't go under her again" rather than leaping on the judges for being corrupt. From what you are saying your horse sounds like a cob, and if it is a cob then no matter what it is not a hunter and a hunter type (and this can just mean a finer horse with a 'prettier' head, something that looks more like a hunter) so most judges will not place you. Fair enough to go into the class because there is nothing else to do, but you cannot moan if you don't get placed above the hunter type horses.

I hate people saying how crap showing is and how bent the judges are when there is more often than not a proper reason for you being placed where you were.