A sad tale

chaps89

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Another thing to consider... I know of a lot of people sending the German breeds (GSD/Rott/Dobe/Box) to Germany for training and titling (you can't show in a lot of classes/win certain accolades in Europe without a working title, and the judge has to have XYZ affiliations, it's built into their system there, which I think is great).

It's a bit of an in house joke that these amazing trainers manage to achieve in weeks and months what the rest of us take years to do, and we look in the workbooks and see scores in the high 90s for dogs that weren't interested in food or a ball when they left.
There's also the issue of dogs arriving back and appearing as if they had never been out of a kennel/you give them a command in German or English and they look at you blankly.
These are not dogs that are going to eat you.

Also I have never, ever, ever heard of a mixed breed being sent to Germany for personal protection training. Or a pure bred for that matter. It makes no sense.
So, at risk of sounding thick/ignorant, how do they do it?
 

CorvusCorax

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. Long before you train a dog to hold or 'bite', you will have a 100% leave in place if you are doing it properly and it will always be a game. When people only train the flashy guardy bits but miss out the basic obedience training it gets dangerous. My best dog, who I would have loved to work in schutzhund/IPO or similar was the steadiest, best natured, as safe as any dog could ever be who would have loved the training but sadly, his legs weren't good enough. He was the only one of my 11 (to date) rotts that I would even have contemplated training to that level. All except one of the others were
.
I'm not saying you are, but in case anyone reading conflates the two issues (personal protection and sport/breeding assessments) in Schutzhund/was IPO now IP/IGP you can't go forward to do any of it unless the dog has passed the BH (traffic safe companion dog test).
The dog must be able to be scanned for a microchip/walk through a group of people and touched by the judge before it can start the trial.
If the dog DQs in obedience, it cannot proceed to protection. If it DQs in protection for lack of control, all points are lost for tracking and obedience. In fact if it DQs in any phase.
If the dog doesn't react after three commands (recall, let go of dumbbell, let go of sleeve etc) it's DQ.
At big competitions the dog must undergo a rigorous vet check.
They **cannot** be aggressive to humans and in obedience two dogs report in together and one works while the other stays in a down. So no dog aggression either.
The dog can be DQd at any time before it gets it's workbook back.

When I assess dogs I do pretty much the second part of the BH or condensed ZAP WT character evaluation (which has more environmental elements) with no heeling pattern/down stay.
 
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Tiddlypom

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On the news just now, little boy has been named, a number of dogs have been seized and one euthanized, breed confirmed to be Cane Corso, one man has been arrested
Yes, and the police have referred themselves on as they had previously been called to dog related incidents at that address :(.

'GMP said it was looking at previous incidents involving dogs at the home, close to the M62 motorway, and had referred itself to the Independent Office for Police Conduct "due to previous contact".'

Rochdale dog attack: Man arrested after boy, 3, dies https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-61481535

I'm not alone in thinking that the Cane Corso is a banned breed, but apparently it's not?
 

stangs

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The two mastiff breeds that are banned here are the Tosa Inu and the Fila Brasileiro. Cane Corsos and Presa Canarios aren't, though the Cane Corso is significantly more popular than the later. There's been litter after litter of them on preloved even since before the pandemic, many from dubious breeders.
 

palo1

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or people shouting could have wound the dog up more.
Shouting is a sure fire way to wind up my terrier!! He has no aggression whatsoever but shouting or if my children are play fighting excites him hugely. I think aggressive shouting is probably potentially a dangerous thing to do with an unknown dog in a dodgy situation though it can be hard to avoid. Grim.
 

Amymay

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Seems there’s been trouble at the same address before when a passing walker was bitten by two TMs. I’ve seen the injury photo and it’s horrific.
It would seem from a post made on the ITVnews post on fb, that the previous resident of the property had bred Cane Corso’s, but had left them behind when fleeing an abusive relationship. Their fb profile shows at least two adults (male and a breeding bitch), plus puppies for sale.
 

maisie06

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Poor kid and poor dog - what a sad situation. You seem to get rescues who rehome to anyone or rehome to no one... did you see some of the comments, especially the one saying all pet ownership should be banned .... WTF?
 

Winters100

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Tragic, but the outcome could have been even worse. I used to help run a small dog foundation in Europe, and we were extremely careful about this sort of thing. A dog with these issues would have been PTS rather than rehomed. Now this may sound harsh, but you have to consider that, whatever you write in the contract, you have no idea what will happen to the dog once it leaves your hands. Stipulating 'must always be muzzled in public' or 'not to be around children' is just not good enough, because you cannot enforce this. There are thousands of non-aggressive dogs who need homes, and I just find it foolish that the charity sent this dog off to be a pet. No matter where you live you cannot exclude the possibility that a dog may come into contact with children, or that it may get loose from the leash.
 
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