A very hard decision ahead

[LaurenBay]

Those of you who follow my threads will know that I have a retired 13YO mare due to bad Hock arthritis. She lives out 24/7 and has enjoyed a year and half of retirement being treated like a queen!

For those of you who don't know, Ruby was diagnosed with hock arthritis at 11YO, her behaviour was the give away that something was wrong and was quite dangerous at times, we have tried 2 lots of steroid injections, A Tildren drip and a trip to Rossdales Newmarket for an operation to hopefully fuse the bones. Unfortunately none of the above worked and she was not happy to be ridden so was retired in May 2017.

Over the last 2 weeks she has been acting a bit erratic (spooks at everything and gallops around in loops) she also looked stiff. I tried giving her a small feed and giving her some buteless, this had no effect. Vet came on Friday who agreed Ruby was lame in walk and trot (even before the flexions which she obviously trotted up worse when flexed) myself and vet (who's opinion I really do value) had a chat about what to do going forward. Vet mentioned it could possibly be something else, but with a Horse who isn't insured and has arthritis like hers that its not worth while doing investigations, after all any injury will either require box rest (I don't have a stable but she absolutely can't be stabled as the arthritis is too bad) or field rest, and shes already out and still lame.

So we discussed the option of long term bute or steroid injections, neither will be a miracle cure but can obviously help manage the pain. I decided against the steroid injections due to the laminitis risk (I can't take her off the grass) so I am left with bute. I am giving her 2 sachets a day for a week and then 1 sachet a day for a week and then access. Obviously I don't want to keep her on 2 sachets a day for the rest of her life (bearing in mind she is only 13) and I still can't guarantee she will be pain free. I also don't think she will cope to well with the winter (vet has agreed that if bute isn't very effective, Ruby could very well struggle when its colder and damp)

The expense of a bute a day, probably is doable, but can I justify it when she is essentially a field ornament.

I hope no one thinks I am selfish, I love this Horse. Shes my first Horse and has taught me so much and been by my side through some really tough times. My head says one thing and my heart says another.

I really do not know what to do and my head is all over the place.

 

[JFTDWS]

The expense of bute is one thing - the long term effects of it will not be pleasant for the horse. I don't think it's at all selfish to consider the practical implications of your situation - it would be more selfish to allow your heart overrule your head. If you think her quality of life is slipping, the decision to let her go is a sound one - and that's something you and your vet are best placed to judge.

 

[be positive]

Having read your other recent threads I think it is unsurprising your head is all over the place and I would suggest you give her a few weeks on bute and take your time to decide, you know what the right decision is and should not feel selfish having her pts but equally don't feel bad giving yourself a little longer to accept it especially with all you have going on, waiting a few weeks free of pain will do her no harm and will allow you to come to terms with it, making the phone call can be the hardest part so if and when you have to do so maybe let someone else make that call for you.

 

[Cortez]

I think you know what is best. I have just let one of my older horses go, he was happy and sound, but the winter would not have been easy for him.

 

[ester]

Neither decision is wrong at this point. Personally I'd give her the two weeks of bute and then decide how I wanted to proceed.

 

[TheOldTrout]

Having read your other recent threads I think it is unsurprising your head is all over the place and I would suggest you give her a few weeks on bute and take your time to decide, you know what the right decision is and should not feel selfish having her pts but equally don't feel bad giving yourself a little longer to accept it especially with all you have going on, waiting a few weeks free of pain will do her no harm and will allow you to come to terms with it, making the phone call can be the hardest part so if and when you have to do so maybe let someone else make that call for you.

This. You're having a horrendous time at the moment, give Ruby a few weeks pain free so you can come to terms with what's happening and spoil her rotten to give yourself some good memories.

 

[Polos Mum]

I think you know what is best. I have just let one of my older horses go, he was happy and sound, but the winter would not have been easy for him.

I have also just done this - no rush to make a decision but if you made a tough decision - remember it's tough on you - not on her. Her pain will be over so you are doing her the one final kindness that she deserves.

 

[SEL]

Having read your other recent threads I think it is unsurprising your head is all over the place and I would suggest you give her a few weeks on bute and take your time to decide, you know what the right decision is and should not feel selfish having her pts but equally don't feel bad giving yourself a little longer to accept it especially with all you have going on, waiting a few weeks free of pain will do her no harm and will allow you to come to terms with it, making the phone call can be the hardest part so if and when you have to do so maybe let someone else make that call for you.

Also thought this ^^^ when I read your posts.

Plus if she doesn't look better on bute then you'll absolutely know its something else and that will guide you and your vet.

My little draft bounces around happily on a danilon a day so I know its arthritis and whilst it can be managed on danilon then that's fine. When he gets less bouncy then it'll be time to consider options too.

 

[flying_high]

Also thought this ^^^ when I read your posts.

Plus if she doesn't look better on bute then you'll absolutely know its something else and that will guide you and your vet.

My little draft bounces around happily on a danilon a day so I know its arthritis and whilst it can be managed on danilon then that's fine. When he gets less bouncy then it'll be time to consider options too.

IMO if Ruby doesn't dramatically improve on Bute, it doesn't mean it is not arthritis. It could be arthritis that isn't manageable by sustainable levels of bute. Not all arthritic horses come 100% sound on bute.

 

[LaurenBay]

Thanks all.

The problem with Ruby is she doesn't deal with pain well at all. Instead of slowing down with the arthritis her approach is to run from the pain and act erratic. But then I think is she running because shes happy, or running from the pain. Its harder to tell now she is living out as she doesn't get handled that much so I don't see her being so reactive as what she used to do. Although I have noticed her being much more sprightly and spooky recently (the same time I noticed her looking lame too)

I just don't want her to suffer through the winter, I dread to think of her laying down and not being able to get herself up but I am also too scared of making that decision too early. But then I try to tell myself better a day too early then a day too late.

 

[ester]

I think to a certain extent you have to go with your gut about what you know about them. The vet thought F was pretty good (for his age- I found this bit unsatisfactory ) and he wasn't worse on flexion and to take him off the bute we had started but then he just wasn't his usual self and that is hard for any occasionally visiting vet to see. He has been much more like himself (naughty!) on the bute and he has had two for short periods. I'm actually hopeful he might be better in the winter as the ground has softened up but I'm also prepared to make a decision quite quickly if he deteriorates.

Oh he also isn't having any issues rolling, or getting up, if he did I might be doing it differently.

 

[Cortez]

My reasoning is, let them go when they are feeling good, not when they are miserable and frightened, unable to get up or move .

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I agree 'better a week too soon, than a day too late' but I can't see any harm in giving her bute for a couple of weeks to see how she responds to it. The side effects are much exaggerated for most horse but many don't like the taste. You could also try magnetic leg wraps, I have had good results with them on one horse, although less so with others.
Possibly your decision will be weather related, we are having an exceptionally dry autumn so far but it is bound to get wet before long.

You are having an exceptionally difficult time atm, so don't rush into a decision just yet, is my advice.

 

[Hollychops]

You will know when the time is right. Do what is right for her and not for you. It is the last kind thing you can do for her. Its not an easy decision, but she wont know that you have made that decision or think badly of you for doing it.
I had to make a similar decision for my mare, and it took me 2 weeks to even mention it to my OH i felt that bad about it, but it was the right one to make.

 

[paddy555]

i have a 20yo with hock problems retired on 1 sachet of bute per day. We started on 2 etc but quickly got down to 1. It makes a tremendous difference to him. I have tried stopping it but you can see the difference between bute and not bute. He is very comfortable and I am not at all concerned about long term bute. I think old age or bute eventually not working will kill him long before side effects from long term bute. Try her for a couple of months on bute and see how she goes. She may surprise you. You can always have a horse PTS very very quickly if needed.

 

[wills_91]

I have recently had my 11 year old mare pts under similar circumstances. They live for the moment and have no concept of tomorrow. Given your recent circumstances I would be inclined to give her a few weeks on bute to allow yourself some time to gather your head as you have a lot going on at the moment.

The time between making the decision and the day of her passing - 5 days - were undoubtly some of the hardest in my life. I ended up taking time off work as I was kept bursting into tears. I felt terrible and was worried I had made the wrong decision. But from the second I said goodbye and then returned to see her at peace I felt like a huge weight had been lifted. Sometimes the best decisions are the hardest and if you do decide that her time here is done I don't think anyone will judge you for that. She has had good innings with you and 18 months of happy retirement. Hugs x

 

[Goldenstar]

In your situation I would keep her on Bute and get your head round it and let her go before the weather gets too bad .

 

[ycbm]

I am also too scared of making that decision too early. But then I try to tell myself better a day too early then a day too late.

Too early for who? She won't know, or care.

 

[LaurenBay]

Too early for who? She won't know, or care.

I think I am just worried about the guilt I might feel after. But then again I could feel a sense of relief once its over.

 

[Cortez]

I think I am just worried about the guilt I might feel after. But then again I could feel a sense of relief once its over.

That's about you, though. What about her?

 

[LaurenBay]

I know she has no concept of tomorrow and I only want to do whats best for her.

 

[ester]

The thing is re. the too early we could have them all put down as 5 year olds to guarantee no suffering as they won't know any different. But for most people that is not how horse ownership works for them.

There have been times I have thought oh I should just do it now and then I won't have to worry any more but that would have been for me not for him too.

 

[Tiddlypom]

You've got to consider both yourself, who understandably is all over the place after the shock of recent events, and the horse.

If you pts now that would in no way be wrong, but the guilt of not giving her a chance to settle on the bute may come back and bite you big time later on. If you give her a couple of weeks on bute now and she's no happier, then you'll know it's time. Even if she does pick up, you may equally decide then that you simply don't have the time for her anymore as your circumstances have changed so much. Then you can make the call with a clearer head than now.

 

[paddy555]

I think I am just worried about the guilt I might feel after. But then again I could feel a sense of relief once its over.

all the questions and answers on here are based on what people think. Try asking your horse. Give her a go on bute and then ask her (not anyone else) how she is. She will soon let you know if it all gets too much and she wants out. That way no guilt on your part. You will just be doing what is best for her. Don't overthink it. Do what you can to help her and then look at the situation in front of you and see if it is working.

 

[flying_high]

I have an older, high mileage, complex, high maintenance horse. Every time I decide that there are enough warning signs, and s

The thing is re. the too early we could have them all put down as 5 year olds to guarantee no suffering as they won't know any different. But for most people that is not how horse ownership works for them.

There have been times I have thought oh I should just do it now and then I won't have to worry any more but that would have been for me not for him too.

That is the challenge and it is hard. I have 17hh 20 year old who is high mileage and needs a lot of support and very careful daily structured workload to stay in work. He needs muscle support to stay capable. He's unlikely to retire to the field as needs the muscles to be strong to support old injuries. He's getting stiffer and trips more being ridden, he's not particularly careful over slippery ground. When do I call it a day. Every time I think his time is coming, he bounces back. But I don't want to miss the point when he's struggling in the herd / in the field. Or where he falls over ridden and causes injury. I find his ups ands downs very stressful as everytime I think it is time, he seems to bounce back at the last minute. But I cant justify putting him to sleep to end the stress! In many ways he is still well and bright.

 

[LaurenBay]

She will be given the 2 weeks anyway as i'm not opposed to keeping her on a bute a day, as long as it works. I can't promise I can keep her for years and years on it and if she needs more then 1 a day then I think she must be in a great deal of discomfort and I won't do that to her

 

[JFTDWS]

She will be given the 2 weeks anyway as i'm not opposed to keeping her on a bute a day, as long as it works. I can't promise I can keep her for years and years on it and if she needs more then 1 a day then I think she must be in a great deal of discomfort and I won't do that to her

I think that's pretty sensible - when I mentioned the effects of bute earlier, I was very much talking about the long term. Personally, I wouldn't plan to keep a horse permanently on bute for years, because the toxicity profile is just too high. For a few weeks, or even months, that's an entirely different matter. If you reassess in a few months and she's coping really well - with the bute and the arthritis - and you're happy with how it's going, then that's another matter.

 

[twiggy2]

Ah Lauren, it's s##t isn't it, have a hug or ten, in my experience it's a sense of relief that accompanies the loss when you let an animal go that has had you on a roller coaster of is it time or not?
She won't know whatever you decide and you will only know once it is too late.
I would give the bute for a week and if no dramatic improvement, if she is relaxed and comfortable I would continue till she is on 1 per day and see how she is, I would only do that if I felt she had a good chance of coping with winter.
If I felt winter would be difficult for her I would give her a max of a week on 2 bute a day and call it time.

 

[Sophire]

It's so so hard Lauren, I recently decided it was time for my 9yro TB as she had a kissing spine diagnosis along with another undiagnosed forelimb lameness. She had options and was insured, but actually I decided against for numerous reasons. Do what is right for you and the horse, as others have said she will not know, and personally speaking my guilt is not too much to manage.

 

[LaurenBay]

Thanks all, she looks to the eye to be moving a bit better. Her erratic behaviour is getting worse though. She is very spooky and was rearing yesterday, she only started rearing at the beginning of all of this, that's how I knew something was wrong. She hasn't reared in about a year and half. It seems its her go to move when shes hurting. I thought she was going to flip over yesterday she went up so high.

She has been in the same field now for over a year with the same companion, he is pretty chilled and quiet and she does nothing but gallop around now and wind him up.