about to buy my first horse...how to make an offer without offending vendors?

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icyfreya

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Some of you may have read my thread a while back 'buying an 18 year old horse' - Well it looks like im about to buy him! Have found a fab livery yard, got my space etc, going shopping for all my bits & bobs next week. Have been back 3 times, first time tried him in the school, second time took him out on a hack, third time had a lesson. (He has behaved impeccably each time) Then I had him vetted (which he passed really well, including the notorious flexion tests! :D )

However there are a few issues which are causing concern to me and my mum:

He isn't in great condition, infact you can see his ribs (not badly, but still hasn't got nearly enough weight on him for this time of year), and is lacking in topline (almost to the extent of a ewe neck). I'm prepared to put in the schooling/hill work/feed etc to get him back into condition, and at the mo he is out 24/7, not really being fed anything (occasional handful of alfa a but nothing else), and he's tbxwb, so not surprised. He hasn't been wormed in 6 months :confused: which could also indicate to the lacking in condition.

He isn't 'completely perfect/viceless' as described in ad, he is a bit spooky out hacking alone, and with jumping, he isn't a schoolmaster, in fact he needs an experienced rider, as he gets very fast, and is also spooky, and runs out/refuses unless rider is 200% confident.

He needs his teeth doing, needs his vaccs, and needs a new set of shoes next week. The 'all tack and rugs' he comes with includes tack, but only 2 rugs, both of which are ripped/need replacing. (all extra £££s)

And to top it off, he is 18 (vendors haven't come back to me whether he's just turned 18 or is nearly 19) - asking price is £1,700, which tbh I feel is too much, considering the vetting was £144, then got to add teeth, vaccs, worming, farrier straight away, replacing rugs, and then all the work that's got to go into getting him back into condition.

So...how do I make an offer to the vendors without offending them? When we mentioned to them he seemed a little underweight & lacking in topline, the owner said she really hadn't noticed/couldn't tell. Personally, I feel he is worth between £1400 - £1500, but I don't vendors to feel mucked around, especially after we've tried him so many times!

He is a really gorgeous boy, and I think the right horse for me, I feel I have a great connection with him, and not bothered about the jumping as he can do flying changes/lateral work/counter canter etc so good dressage. And he is safe - doesn't buck/bolt/rear/bite/kick etc, really easy to do on the ground. Stood patiently the whole time for the vet, even got pooed on by a bird in the middle of it without batting an eyelid. So what do I do?

Any advice really really appreciated, sorry for this essay :) chocolate brownies and ice cream for anyone who got to the end x
 
When I buy mine I make the offer and depending on whether that is accepted I then book the vetting, I think that you may have done things the wrong way round, and they will expect that you are paying the full amount.

Also you should have left a deposit when you made the offer and it is accepted, then book the vetting!
 
I'm glad that you've found a good horse, although a few of the things you said started alarm bells in my head! Especially the fact he is an older boy now and he hasn;t got much weight on, it might be hard to get it back on. Also, I would 100% not be paying that much for him, even if he is lovely. I can tell you really really want him, have you looked at other horses too? But to be fair, alot of the ponies that we get in, come with no tack, no rugs, no shoes, underweight, green and not been wormed, but at the same time we get the ponies cheap so it kinda evens out. This is a tough one!
 
I don't think what you are thinking of offering is wildly offensive anyway, more offensive that you've said he's in poor condition!!

Just say to them that you really like him but die to his age you'd like to offer them £1400, then you can start negotiations.

TBH though it's only £300 quid! Shouldn't be a big issue on either side.
 
The last couple of horses we have sold have been priced EXTREMELY reasonably for the current market and were an apslolute bargain, gorgeous horse, stunning blood lines the works.
Both times weve had people offering £500 below asking price. We were willing to drop £200ish but £500 was insulting!!

I dont think , for what you are describing, you are being unreasonable, although i have to say, he is massively over priced even at the reduced price, no matter how lovely he is. Sorry!
 
If he really is the right horse for you and he passed the Vetting, don't lose him for the sake of a couple of hundred pounds. It's a drop in the ocean of the expence of horse ownership. ;)

I've known too many people who've bought the wrong horse and have lost thousands, plus their confidence and a couple have had bad injuries too.
 
Glad it sounds like you've found the horse you are searching for.

From your description, although he sounds lovely...he also sounds like alot of older horses out there that are selling for £1000 or even less - especially as winter is now coming. Though of course does depend what the saddle is worth and also, although you say you need to ride him strong, you didn't say whether he has a competition record. A proven horse is worth more.

However I think that the seller would probably accept £1500 because people have a thing about nice round numbers and tend to always advertise a few hundred over in order to get the round number. The fact that you've had him vetted though, won't be in your favour, as you know he is a healthy horse and commiting to a vetting can often mean that you are willing to pay the asking price.

Sorry if i am not much help. You can always try low and see what they think - if you really want him and they are offended you can quickly offer the asking price. How long has he been on the market and for the same price?

Sorry blabbing on now. Best of luck - keep us posted :D
 
No way I can see a horse that old for a notice being worth a penny over a grand. U just have to be polite but firm. I usually blame limited finances and the money I will have to spend on it rather than picking specific faults.
 
As others have said, AFTER the vetting is not a good time to be making an offer. They know you have spent over £100 on the vetting - and that's money down the drain if you don't buy.

The only way you MIGHT be able to do it is if the vet referenced some problems you might not have known about - and which the seller didn't disclose. They might not be sufficient to put you off - but they could be justification in making a lower offer.
 
What would you offer for a horse of his description then? I've spoken to my instructor about the price, and she says she thinks it's reasonable because he's safe, and a good schoolmaster (but she hasn't come to see him because she's too busy)...
My mum isn't horsey at all so it's difficult to know what to do! And yes, over the last year or so i've been to see about 8, have either been pipped to the post each time, or horse has turned out unsuitable for one reason or another...
Tack (again i'm not particularly experienced in tack valuation ;) ) is nice to ride in, and looks in good condition - but he comes with a fairly forward cut gp saddle, and I want to do dressage anyway, so may sell this, and buy a dressage saddle. So if I can knock a couple of hundred off the price this would help. I also don't want to pay through the nose/way above his value because i'm not experienced in buying horses.

With competition record, he did some bsja in his passed, and has over £100 in winnings, but this wouldn't be much use to me. He went to the pc dressage champs last year, and was in the top 20. And he went to the gb sj champs in wales a few weeks ago and got 1st and 2nd place in 2 ft 6 and 2 ft 9.

Appreciate all the replies xx I will keep you posted ;)
 
I advertised mine for 5750 and had an offer of 4000.
WILDLY offensive.
not even the same two animals at that difference in price.
any way - good luck, and not sure i would spend too much on vetting, 2 stage should be enough as he is 18/19 and is for pleasure not the olympics.
goood luck though
keep us posted
 
Honestly, if he is the right horse for you and as lovely as you make him sound then I would just pay the money and not quibble.

At his age you won't sell him on, he is not an investment to be made back with schooling or whatnot.

Just enjoy the wealth of experience he has to offer and let him be your best friend for however long he has to be healthy.

£300 is not much, horses are a total money pit anyway, you need to get used to that!! :)

I really hope it works out and you love your new friend, he sounds like a star xx
 
An 18 yr old was jumping Burghley this weekend, so his age shouldnt be a factor. I wouldnt pick faults when speaking to vendor - Say you really like him and you can offer him a home for life (if you can?) or a loving home, he will be well treated and wouldnt want for anything at all. You would like to make a cash offer of £1450/1500 subject to passing the vets check. Gives you room to go up!

You can go up but you cant go down!! Ask yourself : do you love him enough to give the full asking price? if so then you know that he will be yours, if you get a little bit knocked off then thats a new rug! xx
 
We paid £2000 for a 19 year old, but he was worth it. We have had an amazing time with him and he is still going strong.

We did ask if she would drop the price due to his age, but she said no as he does everything, and he does. The best horse I have ever bought and would do it again.

Hope you get him. xx
 
As others have said, you like him and you want him. I also would not be quibbling over the price. You chose to look at him at the price advertised and have gone there 3 times!

It doesn't matter that you have spent on a vetting, that was your choice, and shoeing worming, vaccs would all be your cost anyway. They are not reasons to haggle on the price.

Yes you could probably find 10 like him for less money, but do you want to go to that trouble, when you have taken a shine to him?

I feel that you should have asked if there was any negotiation to be made on the price the first time you saw him tbh. It's not really worth irritating the seller, who may have put other buyers off, at this stage in the game!
 
Go in stupidly low. Offer 800 and see what they say. I'd expect to pay a grand. The owners are pushing there luck with that and it's probably why he's not sold yet. I bet they say yes
 
Dancing Queen said:
An 18 yr old was jumping Burghley this weekend, so his age shouldnt be a factor. I wouldnt pick faults when speaking to vendor - Say you really like him and you can offer him a home for life (if you can?) or a loving home, he will be well treated and wouldnt want for anything at all. You would like to make a cash offer of £1450/1500 subject to passing the vets check. Gives you room to go up!

You can go up but you cant go down!! Ask yourself : do you love him enough to give the full asking price? if so then you know that he will be yours, if you get a little bit knocked off then thats a new rug! xx
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But he's already been Vetted and passed!

Have been back 3 times, first time tried him in the school, second time took him out on a hack, third time had a lesson. (He has behaved impeccably each time) Then I had him vetted (which he passed really well, including the notorious flexion tests! )
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£1700 is not an expensive horse, plus a safe and sound schoolmaster is worth his weight in gold.
 
Didnt see that!
So OP what are you waiting for - Get offering.

1700 Maybe cheap to some, but to others it maybe a little expensive. Cheap/Expensive - its all relative.
 
To be honest, I don't think you should really get the horse vetted until you've made an offer and had it accepted - its the wrong way round to do it.

That is, unless the owner has kept the horse on the market - but I presume if you've said you want to buy the horse and have got it vetted, they will have turned down other potential purchasers on the understanding that you have agreed to buy at the asking price.

That said, you can still make an offer - but if this horse is the one you want, is it worth quibbling over for £200?

You've said that he has behaved impeccably on all three occasions that you've seen him, and honestly I wouldn't say he is overpriced - if his dressage is really good and he is good to jump too, and he's safe and will do what you want, then that's worth plenty. As for things like condition and shoeing - well those are costs you'll incur with a horse anyway. You might get some money off him, but is it worth potentially losing the horse you want or the sake of a little money?
 
The OP should have haggled the price before the vetting.

1700 Maybe cheap to some, but to others it maybe a little expensive. Cheap/Expensive - its all relative.
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I agree, but without seeing the horse myself, I cannot really comment on what i think the value of this horse is. I do know that it is sound and has been wonderful on the three occasions that the OP tried it. I just think that the OP needs to be careful to not offend the seller and therefore lose the horse.
 
CalllyH said:
Go in stupidly low. Offer 800 and see what they say. I'd expect to pay a grand. The owners are pushing there luck with that and it's probably why he's not sold yet. I bet they say yes
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I have a horse for sale - 13 not 18, and 3k not £1700.

If someone came to see him three times, said they wanted to buy him, got him vetted and then turned round and offered me less than half the asking price I would be absolutely livid. That is timewasting, pure and simple.
 
CalllyH said:
Go in stupidly low. Offer 800 and see what they say. I'd expect to pay a grand. The owners are pushing there luck with that and it's probably why he's not sold yet. I bet they say yes
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After 3 visits and a passed vetting I would tell a buyer to sod right off if they did that.

OP, it's a bit pricey but if you have your heart set on him then go ahead and buy him at the asking price - only next time remember to make an offer before you have a vetting :-)
And good luck with him x
 
I agree with Dancing Queen. If you can offer a permanent, loving home, that would sway me more as the seller, than the price.

I don't think it would be cheeky at all to offer £1400 or even less for an 18yr old. I know he's been there, done that, but I would only want to pay the asking price if he was in good condition and well looked after. If I was selling at this point in time, I would be expecting people to make offers below my asking price in this current climate and coming up to winter.

As you have had him vetted, they obviously will know you like him, so you could always say you have to give a couple of months livery up front, and if they want to sell him now, you could take him off their hands next week (if you can lol) if they drop the price?

At the end of the day, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay, whether its a horse, car, house etc.

If you think he is overpriced and they don't drop the price, then don't buy him, even if you've lost the vetting fees. At the end of the day, there are plenty of good horses for sale at that price or less, you just need to be patient and keep your eye out!!! :)
 
IMO horses dont have an intrinsic value. They are worth whatever the buyer is willing to pay. If you have found the horse that will give you some safe fun every day....whats he worth to you? you could spend £100s driving around the country looking for something else.

The owners will be expecting people to make offers, especially with his age, so make an offer. But dont lose your ideal horse for the sake of a few hundred.
 
Thankyou for all the replies, money is a bit of an issue actually as my livery do want 2 months up front, plus they want £100 for the rubber matting in the stable! And i know all the dentist/vaccs costs are part of horse ownership, but i guess it's like the difference between buying a car with a years mot & tax and one which needs one next week...it makes things more financially pressured - and they weren't up front about this at the beginning. Also think she's left the shoes as she wants me to pay for them.

The owner has said she's only got one other person interested, who wants to loan the horse, and she doesn't want to loan it. But it is a good idea to offer a cash offer and get him off their hands next week, as I think they need him gone. Think (hope) I can offer him a forever home, I can certainly offer him a good home where he'll be loved and treasured and given loads of attention! :)

In the vetting, the only thing the vet discussed with us as a problem was his condition, and he reckons it'll be 8 months of schooling and feeding to get him into good condition.

It's great to have the support of people on here! Haven't got a working camera at the mo but when I have i will upload some pics :) xx
 
Offer then 1500. If he has managed to pass a 5 stage vetting including flexion tests in poor condition then that is a good start many younger horses won't pass a flexion test.

The only warming I would say is that if he is in poor condition his behaviour may change when his condition changes and you might get a more lively sharper horse when he is in better shape.

He is sound, he has done PC championships in the not that distant past and has a BSJA record and jumped successfully recently, despite his age he is going to be worth at least £1500 including tack as if it is decent tack then that alone has to be worth £350, if you are going to be selling the saddle as you want a dressage one then perhaps make a offer for without tack?
 
icyfreya said:
Thankyou for all the replies, money is a bit of an issue actually as my livery do want 2 months up front xx
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Tell the vendor this - If they genuinely want him to go to a good home, then they will see whats on offer.

DONT feel pressured into buying/offering more than you want just because someone else is interested.

Market is slow - you have the cash waiting, you can have him as early as ???

Let us know how you get on!!

Its very exciting.
 
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