Advice on returning a dog

[pinky1401]

Hi

I need some advice, we have had a dog for three weeks. He isn't what we were told he was. I can't walk him happily as he shows aggression to other dogs, chases cows etc. He is a part trained gundog and we wanted a part trained dog as we have a small child who has to be in a buggy when I walk the dog so it needed to be well behaved on the lead and off - it isn't. Therefore he isn't suited to us and we are returning him. We paid serious money for him and have been told that we won't get any back as now the dog isn't the same as when they sold him to us. While he has been with us he actually attacked another dog.

I'm really sad about this and frustrated we aren't rich and have spent nearly £1,000 on this dog so far. Do I have any leg to stand on or are they right?

S x

 

[galaxy]

You have bought an adult dog that has been professionally trained? Were you told and was it advertised as good on the lead and with other dogs? Have you changed any of it's routine/feed/amount of time exercised that could be causing this behviour?

 

[lexiedhb]

I think after three weeks you are expecting an awful lot of a dog trained or not. It will need time to settle, learn what YOU want from it, and learn to respect you- NO dog IMO will come to you and behave impeccably immediately.

 

[echodomino]

3wks isn't giving the dog much of a chance, it won't have even settled in yet. It's probably wondering why it's whole life has suddenly changed which may have a contributing factor in it's behaviour.

 

[pinky1401]

we changed its food onto an equivalent gradually. It was advertised as being the perfect dog. Brought up on a farm, good in every aspect and it is apart from when walking past other dogs or cows/horses. We have had dogs in the past so we made sure he knew his position in the pack etc etc. He is perfect in the home.

 

[blackcob]

Was this a private sale? Advertised online, in a newspaper etc.?

You, like me, and many others, have found that people often lie in order to get rid of a problem dog. In addition, the dog's behaviour may reflect that fact that he is very unsettled - it's a lot to ask of a dog to behave perfectly after only three weeks in a new home with new handlers. He has absolutely no idea of what you require of him, only that everything around him has suddenly changed and that you are probably shouting and losing your patience with him a lot, leaving him even more unsettled.

The fact that you have to walk him with a child in a buggy concerns me, I don't see how that could ever result in enough exercise for a working gundog, and taking in a completely unknown dog with such a small child in the house was very foolish.

A reputable rescue would have been able to provide you with a dog temperament tested with other dogs, children, cats, assessed in various situations and quite often with a full life history, matched exactly to your family's requirements, and would provide you with a guarantee to take the dog back in any circumstance even years from now. I've never known an adoption fee to be over £200 and it's usually significantly less.

No idea about legal recourse now, sorry, just throught I'd point the other bits out.

 

[pinky1401]

I know three weeks isn't a long time but surely that isn't a good enough reason to actually attack another dog?

 

[Sue C]

Hi
Is it breeder or trainer? Did you get any paperwork with the dog stateing how it behaved?

As it could be a case of your word against theirs and then you have not got a leg to stand on, unless there advert states it.

If it attacked another dog, I would not trust it with children.

I rescued both my dogs for one for 150.00 and I could not wish for better dogs with children, other dogs, horses etc.

Good luck

 

[pinky1401]

Hi
He was trained as a gun dog but they wanted a family home for him as he didn't really want to do the job. I have a three wheeler off road buggy and we go for two hour walks - he gets lots of exercise.

 

[galaxy]

we changed its food onto an equivalent gradually. It was advertised as being the perfect dog. Brought up on a farm, good in every aspect and it is apart from when walking past other dogs or cows/horses. We have had dogs in the past so we made sure he knew his position in the pack etc etc. He is perfect in the home.

Change him back onto the feed he was on? What feed have you put him on? If it's not a high quality one then they can cause behavioural problems.

If the dog was brought up on a farm are you giving the dog enough equivalent exercise?

 

[echodomino]

I know three weeks isn't a long time but surely that isn't a good enough reason to actually attack another dog?

Without knowing what the situation was that's a hard one to comment on, but should imagine if he's feeling insecure it may be. And it doesn't make him a bad dog, I have one who doesn't get on with most other dogs and she's a fabulous dog.

ETA: What is he?

 

[BBH]

This poor dog is not a chattel, he has been with you three weeks give him more time to settle and some training if required. You can't even really know him in this time.

I don't think my rescue girl was as described, I was told she was 4 and I think she is nearer 2. I didn't think she was lead trained but I discovered she has been trained to walk on the left. She had accidents in the home having being told she was house trained. I paid £200 adoption fee.

Would I send her back absolutely not.

As soon as she came through my door she was my responsibility to turn into the I dog I want.

FWIW I don't think you'll get your money back and based on your post I think you should be prepared to spend the time to help a dog integrate properly.

 

[blackcob]

The fact that you're talking about pack theory also concerns me, it's complete bull.

I adopted a dog from rescue back in June, he was fully assessed and I was told he was great with other dogs, a fact I was able to see for myself when I went to visit him and try him with lots of other dogs including my own. Within a couple of days of being home he was lunging and howling at passing dogs, behaviour that would look very aggressive to a bystander. In fact he was just very unsettled and not sure how to react to strange dogs on new turf, especially ones that approached him boldly and got right in his face. Six weeks of careful socialisation and focus work later he was 100% improved. He just needed time to settle, regain his confidence and find some confidence in me.

Sue C - dogs know the difference between dogs and children, the fact that it's bitten a dog does not mean it will be dangerous towards humans.

That said, it worries me that coming from a working farm situation into a family with kids means that the dog might not be having adequate exercise and stimulation. It's in this kind of situation that dogs do bite - a bored, understimulated, hyperactive dog, an unpredictable child allowed to get in the dog's space, climb all over it, grab its toys...

 

[Dobiegirl]

Hi
Is it breeder or trainer? Did you get any paperwork with the dog stateing how it behaved?

As it could be a case of your word against theirs and then you have not got a leg to stand on, unless there advert states it.

If it attacked another dog, I would not trust it with children.

I rescued both my dogs for one for 150.00 and I could not wish for better dogs with children, other dogs, horses etc.

Good luck

Dog aggression does not equate people aggression that is a common fallacy and has no basis in fact.

OP was this dog advertised and if so can you tell us what the advert said. Also the incident with the other dog was it off lead/on lead, what are you feeding it,what sex,what breed and is it neutered/spayed etc.

I agree with the others in that 3wks is no time at all for a dog to settle into a new home.

 

[pinky1401]

it was advertised by a breeder said he was great with kids, dogs, animals etc looking for a family home. He is a lab.

I can assure you he gets plenty of exercise an hour in the morning, two in the afternoon and throwing the ball for him in between.

 

[pinky1401]

he attacked a yellow lab bitch.

 

[pinky1401]

forgot he is castrated.

The reason we bought him was he was already part trained so in theory we could hit the ground running. I think you are right we arne't the right family for him hence why he is going back!

 

[Hedwards]

Have you consulted a trainer since you've had the dog? - maybe this would be a sensible option before sending him back - get a professionals opinion on the issues you're having/how to deal with them. When i took Suzy on (a rescue) it took a good 3-4 months before I really got to know her - and initially she would lunge/growl etc at other dogs. 3 weeks really isnt very long to build up trust between you and the dog.

 

[echodomino]

forgot he is castrated.

The reason we bought him was he was already part trained so in theory we could hit the ground running. I think you are right we arne't the right family for him hence why he is going back!

Why can't you give him a bit more time and some training instead of giving up on him? He's trained for gundog work not for living in a family environment, if that's not what he's used to it's going to take time to settle into your routine. Did you go and meet him before deciding to have him? That would have given you an idea as what he's like. You say he's perfect in the home why not give him a chance to make him just as good out of it?

 

[pinky1401]

We've been to a trainer she has seen us three times and told me that he needs a lot of time and money investing in him. Wrongly or rightly I dont' have time and money to train a dog. I have time to keep on top of an already part trained dog but I don't have. She says she thinks that it may be the fact he has been so dominated in the past that makes him the way he is now with us. We are the boss of him but we don't dominate him 24/7.

 

[lochpearl]

can I ask why you want a dog?

 

[pinky1401]

I love dogs and thought a dog would be a great addition to our family. As well as being a friend and a pet it would teach my daughter to care and be gentle and loving to a living breathing creature. She could bond with it and have a great friend as well as us all benefiting from having a great family pet.

The trouble I have is that I have to walk the dog twice a day on my own with my daughter in her buggy. She is 20 months old and sits at about the height of the dogs face. If anything more happened when we were out walking and she got caught in the middle of it I could never live with myself. Yes we did visit the dog before we brought him home. I was told he would be perfect off and on the lead but he seems to have developed a tiny unpredictable streak which shows up when we are out and about walking.

Now maybe I am an idiot and naieve and foolish (whatever else you want to call me) but I bought this dog in good faith and with the breeder being totally aware of what we wanted. Yes maybe three weeks isn't long enough but I can't risk my daughter in the hope that maybe with training and time he might (or might not) stop doing it.

So there we go I might be a prat but I didn't mean any harm and genuinely thought that we would all have a great future together.

Lochpearl - I don't think questions like that are helpful to anyone.

 

[blackcob]

I think it was quite an astute question, actually - if you don't have the time and money to train a dog, by your own admission, then a dog is not for you. The qualities you are looking for in a pet for your daughter would be more equally met by a pair of rabbits, guinea pigs or fancy rats at the moment. The dog can wait until she is old enough to take part in long walks and have some input into the dog's care and training.

 

[echodomino]

How about walking him in a muzzle until you've got on top of him?

I'm not digging but my mum used to walk 5 gundogs and take me in my pushchair when I was a baby and then my brother in the pushchair and me toddling along, it can be done We've taken in dogs that haven't had anything more than a life in a kennel, no training not even toilet training, and they've been the best family dogs. Have you got anyone who can help you, i.e so you can take him out on your own?

I think it's the case most the time that you won't get all of your money back. On the couple of occasions I've had puppies back that I've bred I've only given back part or not at all, depending how old the puppy/dog is and have rehomed them without asking for anything

 

[lexiedhb]

If he does go back please do not just go get another one, if you are not prepared to give a dog more than three weeks to settle, or spend any time/money effort on training then I would question wether having a dog was right for you.

 

[AmyMay]

can I ask why you want a dog?

Bang on.

And in particular this dog. A smaller one would have been much more appropriate, by the sounds of it. (Although, maybe not given your restrictions..........).

What were the circumstances in which he 'attacked' another dog?

If you are a family presumably that means two adults in the house? Has anyone ever taken this dog off for a good old ramble without the child and the buggy? A good old fashioned proper walk?

Sounds as if the dog has come in to your home with very little thought for it's introduction, training or lifestyle.

I would try and re-home it. PM Cayla on here - she may well be able to help you.

 

[Hedwards]

We've been to a trainer she has seen us three times and told me that he needs a lot of time and money investing in him. Wrongly or rightly I dont' have time and money to train a dog. I have time to keep on top of an already part trained dog but I don't have. She says she thinks that it may be the fact he has been so dominated in the past that makes him the way he is now with us. We are the boss of him but we don't dominate him 24/7.

I think this sums it up to be honest, and I have to agree with BC, it sounds like a dog is not the right pet for you/your family at the moment. Regardless of how well trained the dog is when it gets to you, you will always need to continue training, especially in the early days, which takes up time, and based on your own admission you dont have time for this.

I completely appreciate your concerns over your daughter, and if you are so worried, I would be taking the dog back and forgetting the money, as any amount of money cannot be any factor if you are that worried about your daughter and the fact she may be at risk (regardless of my thoughts on dog agression vs people agression).

 

[lochpearl]

helpful? I wanted to know as to whether you wanted it gun trained because say your OH was into shooting or if you just wanted it 'trained' as in house trained.

I agree that you want to put your daughter first but as others have said, the dog must feel very out of sorts, new place, new owner and it's only been a short while. That said I can see that you must be disheartened by the attacking of the bitch.

I have a lot of friends that shoot and have gun dogs and although very obedient 'shooting' they are totally different in the home and on normal walks, I know a spaniel and a lab that are the best dogs on our patch, yet at home, they are unruly and run across the road and ignore the handler (often the partner at shooting). These are fabulously trained for the field but in a 'home' life aren't great. They are also very possessive and can be snappy with others on the farm.

I however am not into shooting and have a working lab (bred) but she has never been trained to work and has only been a pet. She was simple to train and she is a gem with everything and everyone. If she picks up a bird she will hold it very gently but out on the field she'd probably run away!!!

So all I'm trying to say is perhaps having say a trained working dog vs a home reared and trained dog might be where this has failed you, as it sounds really like you want a soft companion for you and your family to enjoy and exercise rather than something that has been trained to do something that you don't want to do with it?

 

[pinky1401]

I've never met so many judgemental people. I wish I hadn't posted anything. I'm not an idiot and have found some responses on here really upsetting.

I only wanted some kindly advice not everyones judgement. Believe me you can have a good old fashioned stroll with a child.

 

[pinky1401]

helpful? I wanted to know as to whether you wanted it gun trained because say your OH was into shooting or if you just wanted it 'trained' as in house trained.

I agree that you want to put your daughter first but as others have said, the dog must feel very out of sorts, new place, new owner and it's only been a short while. That said I can see that you must be disheartened by the attacking of the bitch.

I have a lot of friends that shoot and have gun dogs and although very obedient 'shooting' they are totally different in the home and on normal walks, I know a spaniel and a lab that are the best dogs on our patch, yet at home, they are unruly and run across the road and ignore the handler (often the partner at shooting). These are fabulously trained for the field but in a 'home' life aren't great. They are also very possessive and can be snappy with others on the farm.

I however am not into shooting and have a working lab (bred) but she has never been trained to work and has only been a pet. She was simple to train and she is a gem with everything and everyone. If she picks up a bird she will hold it very gently but out on the field she'd probably run away!!!

So all I'm trying to say is perhaps having say a trained working dog vs a home reared and trained dog might be where this has failed you, as it sounds really like you want a soft companion for you and your family to enjoy and exercise rather than something that has been trained to do something that you don't want to do with it?

Why didn't you write that in the first place. THank you no we didn't want a gun dog we have no interest in shooting but they told us he wanted to be a family pet not a gun dog.