ycbm
Overwhelmed
Thank you for that, we need to know experiences like this for balance.
Airowear Body Protectors V Point 2 Air Vests
- Thread starter Piglet
- Start date
Thank you for that, we need to know experiences like this for balance.
milliepops
Wears headscarf aggressively
My understanding of the new BE rules is that you can no longer get back on and continue now anyway, if you fall you are eliminated. The point about foam replacement still stands tho
ycbm
Overwhelmed
Testing by BE from 2015 is very interesting.
ycbm
Overwhelmed
Do you mean these people? They have a very interesting and informative page about air jackets here:
http://www.medequestrian.co.uk/rider-safety/safety/air-vests/
It covers why the rider above broke her spine, something which would not have been prevented in a BP of caused by shear forces.
I have googled and cannot find your 94% statistic anywhere, can you please point me to it?
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iknowmyvalue
Well-Known Member
Having had an awful rotational fall in an air jacket and BP combo, I wouldn't go XC in anything else now. Air jacket deployed exactly as it was meant to. I managed to walk away almost completely unscathed, the paramedics said I was very lucky as I could easily have been seriously injured/killed. I just had some stiffness and bruising, most of the bruising from where I got caught by horses legs on the way down. I honestly think that I would have had much more serious injuries without the air jacket, and have always felt more protected and less battered/bruised when I've fallen off with it and without it.
ycbm
Overwhelmed
IKMV, this is why I keep asking PD if he's ever fallen off in one. I'm not sure that it's really possible to appreciate how well they work in a nasty fall until you have felt it.
I'm glad you walked away safely, that sounds horrendous.
I'm glad you walked away safely, that sounds horrendous.
iknowmyvalue
Well-Known Member
I agree, I really didn't appreciate it until the first time I fell off in mine! Ive fallen off in it a few different times and I've always felt it helps. I can't speak for using an air jacket on its own, I've done it but never come off.
Thank you, I really shouldn't have walked away from it so unhurt. Sadly my horse was not so lucky and didn't walk away
ester
Not slacking multitasking
My understanding of the new BE rules is that you can no longer get back on and continue now anyway, if you fall you are eliminated. The point about foam replacement still stands tho
good point, knew about that, not yet inserted in brain!
ester
Not slacking multitasking
what was the result for the BP ycbm?
Rowreach
Adjusting my sails
"There is no doubt that more riders are wearing air vests in eventing (41% of all fallers wore an air vest in 2010/2011 BE season, this figure rose to 47% of all fallers in 2011/2012; air vests deployed in 94% of these falls – courtesy of BE)"
ycbm
Overwhelmed
Result is for BP and the decrease in risk of 14% is from adding an air jacket to BP.
Shame they didn't test air jacket alone but it was BE, so why should they, I guess.
ycbm
Overwhelmed
Thanks.
So, reasons for an air bag not deploying:
Rider forgot to attach it (tick, done that)
Rider landed on feet and horse was small enough that bag did not go off (tick, on a 17 hander, too)
Rider has stupidly used a cheap canister designed for something else like a paintball gun, with a thicker seal (seen this, it broke the trigger casing).
Those would probably account for most of the six percent.
Then there is:
Rider forgot to replace canister after previous triggering (tick, what a dork!)
And the rest would be the 'so rare no-one has it on film' :
Horse and rider fell and rider didn't come off the horse.
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Rowreach
Adjusting my sails
As someone who wishes she'd worn her air jacket when riding in the arena (and not just hacking her mega spooky horse), and who then had one of the worst falls of her rather long riding career, I would happily in future run the risk of the thing not going off in favour of the probability that it will.
FWIW every time I've fallen off in a BP I've ended up with a whiplash injury, because there's no neck protection with them.
FWIW every time I've fallen off in a BP I've ended up with a whiplash injury, because there's no neck protection with them.
Piglet
Well-Known Member
Oh yikes, I seem to have started a mega debate!! ����. I defo appreciate all the pros and cons of the BP v Air Jacket, having had a very fall with punctured lungs, cracked ribs etc etc, I am under the impression that the Air Jacket would have protected me, I will be going for the Air Jacket every time I get on a horse, even for showing and dressage. Once again thanks for the personal opinions ����
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Study this very carefully OTs P2 does not inflate until the horse moves away. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baUJFtu-Gys
however im sure you will say thats not the case so watch very carefully how he doubles in size as the horse triggers the mechanism.
Still im not advocating they are a bad thing just pointing out they dont always work and certainly offer no better protection than a BP
Only put this up as you claimed the footage does not exist .
I will now ignore your petty childish not wanting to accept the facts behaviour as it gets boring and I will do as others do and let you get on with it your running out of people to argue with.
ester
Not slacking multitasking
I think they were two different statements PD. Not that footage of a combined horse/rider fall doesn't exist.
popsdosh
Well-Known Member
I probably did not delete enough . What annoys most is BE have some very good records of fence falls that go into detail and yet faced with a 6% non inflation figure there still has to be a list of assumptions as to why trotted out with the exact explanation the poster is shutting their mind to still dismissed and a very clear statement that .
'And the rest would be the 'so rare no-one has it on film' :
Horse and rider fell and rider didn't come off the horse.' That to me says nobody has that situation on film ie the air bag not deploying in a fall.( I also heard it from the rider )
6% of non inflation is the very reason their use as the only safety device has to be questioned. In an ideal world both will give the best protection ! BP does what it is designed to do and tested for 100% of the time they are used. You cannot whatever way you look at it get around the fact that on occasion an air jacket does not and thats been my sole point right the way through.
ycbm
Overwhelmed
That's very interesting PD, the jacket certainly is not fully inflated until the horse rolls off him.
Which no-one has ever disputed, and in fact if you check back my own posts you will see that I have had a fall where mine did not trigger.
Are you completely blind to the fact that it protects the neck and lower spine that a BP doesn't?
Yes, thanks for that I hadn't seen it before from that angle. It triggers after the horse is already on top of him and won't inflate properly until the weight of the horse is off him. You can, however, see in this still that the jacket is inflating while the horse is still on him, and who knows whether that pressure back against the weight of the horse saved a rib or two? What it does show is that it is very difficult to have a fall where you stay so close to the horse that the jacket does not trigger.
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popsdosh
Well-Known Member
Now can we call a truce as we both have safety at heart. Part of my gripe with the makers came off the back of that but thats another story.
Kat
Well-Known Member
Personally I think BP first and air jacket on top for the best possible protection. A BP is pretty infallible, if you put it on it will do it's job. Yes there are areas it can't protect but it does a good job of absorbing impact in ridden and non mounted situations. It is also essential for XC and in other circumstances.
An air jacket can protect some things a BP cannot but there are things it cannot do too. Ideally you would always wear both but BPs are not the most comfortable and many people do not want to wear them everytime they ride. An air jacket alone is certainly better than nothing and many people will wear them who wouldn't wear a BP so they do save injuries in that way.
Personally my BP is out of standard I will be buying a KAN first and an air jacket second
An air jacket can protect some things a BP cannot but there are things it cannot do too. Ideally you would always wear both but BPs are not the most comfortable and many people do not want to wear them everytime they ride. An air jacket alone is certainly better than nothing and many people will wear them who wouldn't wear a BP so they do save injuries in that way.
Personally my BP is out of standard I will be buying a KAN first and an air jacket second
Counterpoint
Well-Known Member
If you want one or the other I think air jackets are much better in general in terms of protection but also because they don't restrict movement. I have had 2 falls CAUSED by the restriction of supposedly well fitting body protectors. I also stopped teaching kids as most of them had such ill fitting body protectors they couldn't ride in balance (and therefore safely) accepting that they probably won't be as balanced as an experienced adult.
Body protectors prevent busing and some breaks from kicks etc but they won't prevent crush injuries or compression fractures such as collar bone, they must be fitted REALLY well so as to not impede movement (and oddly they should be tight for this reason, and also to actually function)
If you want a body protector as well, then I do think the airowear ones are the best (they are the only ones that fit my hollow back), but make sure its fitted correctly, and isn't too long (I used to use a Child's back and Adult Ladies front) which can catch on the saddle and tip you off.
Body protectors prevent busing and some breaks from kicks etc but they won't prevent crush injuries or compression fractures such as collar bone, they must be fitted REALLY well so as to not impede movement (and oddly they should be tight for this reason, and also to actually function)
If you want a body protector as well, then I do think the airowear ones are the best (they are the only ones that fit my hollow back), but make sure its fitted correctly, and isn't too long (I used to use a Child's back and Adult Ladies front) which can catch on the saddle and tip you off.