Am i being messed around?

[[131452]]

I have come across so much money grabbing and absolutely ridiculous prices, most dealers are absolutely out to make a quick buck. I've yet to see a sound one even on a 7 grand budget! I dont mind buying 7 grand for a quality horse but when the horse can just about walk and stop and has never even ridden a circle and they want 5K for it and it is 14 years old...
That is just disgusting.

 

[MuffettMischief]

...ok. Best of luck in your search

 

[Michen]

I think your posts may indicate why the dealer doesn’t want to sell to you.

 

[[131452]]

I think your posts may indicate why the dealer doesn’t want to sell to you.

Meaning?

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

I have to say my sympathy has edged sideways in favour of the seller as the thread has progressed. To be frank, if I was selling a horse and read your posts, and one has to assume those posts do give a fair indication of your attitude to both private and commercial sellers.....well I would be seeing red warning flags telling me not to deal with you.

You would not be viewing a horse I had for sale. We hardly mention troublesome buyer's and how best to avoid them do we, but they do exist and for various reasons they aren't all totally innocent naive lambs to the slaughter. A good few of them can be just as difficult and vexing as any dodgy seller !

I am not saying this necessarily s you OP - but you do rather come across the more you post, as marching into a seller, declaring loudly and repeatedly nobody is going to get one over on you etc. etc...your reputation and huge experience for knowing every dodgy trick in the book that they MUST have heard of takes no nonsense etc etc. etc....already an atmosphere of distrust and ready for a fight has been established before you even view the horse, and nope I would not be dealing sorry.

 

[Gingerwitch]

Mrs jingle you have made a very eloquent post,

 

[[131452]]

Well having been sold a very sick horse that had to be PTS age 5, can you blame me for making bloody sure that doesn't happen again?
And the fact that apart from one horse all I've been shown has been lame , some more obviously than others?

 

[[131452]]

Surely if you have nothing to hide you don't mind me bringing my own vet for the vetting?
Yes I have learned a lot since i was sold the sick horse, yes I've read a lot about how dodgy dealers act to avoid liability. And now I've caught two in a lie so far.
So can you blame me for wanting to take every precaution that I don't go through the utter hell that was last year?
If that is the reason why she won't sell to me clearly she has something to hide.
She clearly doesn't need my money then.

 

[[131452]]

oh and BTW the Irish x mare i had vetted last week that was found to be lame in 3 legs.
Still for sale and shown to clients, no mention of vetting failure, price tag is still 7 grand, and client was encouraged not to bother with a vetting.
This is someone who I thought was quite professional. But also hides behind the "im not a dealer I'm an agent " scam.

If anyone is going to view a 9 year old IDx mare in the Bristol area, message me and I'll let you have the details so save you buying a lame horse.

 

[Gingerwitch]

You are coming across as a very bitter person from your post s in here, so I dread to think what face book shows you as.

I don't agree with selling lame horses but one of mine was jumping on Thursday and was crippled on Friday - vet job - bruised sole but if you have a high media profile and are a bit abrasive then I think you may have an answer as to why local dealer's are avoiding you.

 

[Chinchilla]

SS I think the point they are trying to make is the way you come across suggests if anything goes wrong you will pin it on the seller; of course in some cases this is completely reasonable, some people do indeed sell broken animals, but sometimes, horses just break, or sellers are not aware, and nobody is at fault.

Maybe this isn't the case in reality, but it's how you are presenting yourself here imho and people may want to avoid the potential hassle when it comes to selling. If you wish to avoid hassle yourself of being turned down definitely check the privacy of all your social media - iirc Facebook has an option on your profile where you can view it as seen from the public eye (ie not yourself/someone of your friends' list) which it might be worth doing.

There is a degree of cynicism needed in both buying and selling but the operative word there is reasonable, and yes I know I sound nasty saying this.

 

[[131452]]

You are coming across as a very bitter person from your post s in here, so I dread to think what face book shows you as.

I don't agree with selling lame horses but one of mine was jumping on Thursday and was crippled on Friday - vet job - bruised sole but if you have a high media profile and are a bit abrasive then I think you may have an answer as to why local dealer's are avoiding you.

Wouldn't you be upset if you were sold a sick animal and you spent thousands trying to fix it and in the end it had to be PTS age 5? This combined with the rest of the shit last year and I'm just done with it all. And all I see is dealers behaving like bloody estate agents, selling horses on the phone like commodities, selling lame and sick animals , zero regard for their welfare.
I'm not bitter. I'm incredibly saddened for the poor horses

 

[[131452]]

SS I think the point they are trying to make is the way you come across suggests if anything goes wrong you will pin it on the seller; of course in some cases this is completely reasonable, some people do indeed sell broken animals, but sometimes, horses just break, or sellers are not aware, and nobody is at fault.

Maybe this isn't the case in reality, but it's how you are presenting yourself here imho and people may want to avoid the potential hassle when it comes to selling. If you wish to avoid hassle yourself of being turned down definitely check the privacy of all your social media - iirc Facebook has an option on your profile where you can view it as seen from the public eye (ie not yourself/someone of your friends' list) which it might be worth doing.

There is a degree of cynicism needed in both buying and selling but the operative word there is reasonable, and yes I know I sound nasty saying this.

I blame the seller and the idiot vet for the dead 5 year old. I blame the seller and myself for the events that lead to me breaking my back. I blame the evil witch who knowingly caused the accident that killed my old horse. But I mostly blame myself for being so trusting.
Only two days ago a dealer tried to get me on a horse that was bucking. Knowing that I'm nervous and have broken my back.
How do these people sleep at night?
Probably very well with all the money they're making right now!

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

Wouldn't you be upset if you were sold a sick animal and you spent thousands trying to fix it and in the end it had to be PTS age 5? This combined with the rest of the shit last year and I'm just done with it all. And all I see is dealers behaving like bloody estate agents, selling horses on the phone like commodities, selling lame and sick animals , zero regard for their welfare.
I'm not bitter. I'm incredibly saddened for the poor horses

It sounds like you've had a really awful experience and I'm sure no-one could blame you for feeling upset by that situation. I guess the thing is if you're bringing that upset and frustration (even unconsciously) with you in to each new encounter, this might be what sellers/dealers are picking up on and may make them wary to work with you.

I know very little about buying horses and all I do know has been learned on this forum - to me it sounds incredibly risky so the safeguards you take with vetting etc are important, again I don't think people would blame you for being cautious and seeking out the relevant information to help you make the right purchase. The other thing is that many have been noticing how bonkers the market is currently so when you say the dealer 'doesn't need your money' that could well be true.

I hope you find what you are looking for soon but it does sounds very tricky out there just now. Perhaps something will come along in the coming months when the market settles.

 

[MuffettMischief]

I have to agree with the above. As a seller, We have to try and vet buyers as much as possible too. From your posts it would worry me that if the horse even so much as twitched an ear, you would cause problems. Now...that may be incorrect, not how you intend to come across at all and you may be a perfectly good buyer BUT it is not how you sound. I totally get it, it sounds like you’ve had a crap time but not everyone is out to stitch you up. It works both ways with trust it really does. I hope you find your new best friend soon

 

[sport horse]

You headed the thread 'Am I being messed around'? No you are not, the dealer has made it quite clear they do not want to sell to you. They do not have to sell to you any more than you have to buy from them. Just get the message and look elsewhere. Just be very careful that in your bitterness you do not scare off too many sellers. Remember they 'do not have to sell to you'.

 

[[131452]]

No need to be nasty!

 

[MuffettMischief]

I don’t think anyone has been nasty?

 

[[131452]]

It sounds like you've had a really awful experience and I'm sure no-one could blame you for feeling upset by that situation. I guess the thing is if you're bringing that upset and frustration (even unconsciously) with you in to each new encounter, this might be what sellers/dealers are picking up on and may make them wary to work with you.

I know very little about buying horses and all I do know has been learned on this forum - to me it sounds incredibly risky so the safeguards you take with vetting etc are important, again I don't think people would blame you for being cautious and seeking out the relevant information to help you make the right purchase. The other thing is that many have been noticing how bonkers the market is currently so when you say the dealer 'doesn't need your money' that could well be true.

I hope you find what you are looking for soon but it does sounds very tricky out there just now. Perhaps something will come along in the coming months when the market settles.

Honestly, looking for a horse is so stressful! And it's so upsetting seeing horses treated like commodities, lame horses passed around, no welfare concerns in mind and horses sold over the phone to whoever pays first.
This last week has really taken a lot out of me.
If tomorrow's viewing isn't any good I think I will take a break from it. I just can't handle much more of this.

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

Honestly, looking for a horse is so stressful! And it's so upsetting seeing horses treated like commodities, lame horses passed around, no welfare concerns in mind and horses sold over the phone to whoever pays first.
This last week has really taken a lot out of me.
If tomorrow's viewing isn't any good I think I will take a break from it. I just can't handle much more of this.

It does sound like a real minefield! I can imagine it being particularly difficult given what you went through with your previous horse. A break from searching might not hurt - I can understand it being stressful as it's a big purchase but if the stress is overriding the excitement/joy of it then stepping back for a bit could help.

 

[Cortez]

You do understand that horses regularly get sick, go lame, have to be put down at young ages, and it isn't necessarily anyone's fault, don't you? It's just life, and no matter how marvelous you are at detecting nefarious dealings, sometimes things go wrong. Dealers deal to make money, it isn't wrong to do so, it's the way it works.

I wouldn't sell you a doughnut with an attitude like you have revealed on here, and I wouldn't be messing you around either.

 

[[131452]]

You do understand that horses regularly get sick, go lame, have to be put down at young ages, and it isn't necessarily anyone's fault, don't you? It's just life, and no matter how marvelous you are at detecting nefarious dealings, sometimes things go wrong. Dealers deal to make money, it isn't wrong to do so, it's the way it works.

I wouldn't sell you a doughnut with an attitude like you have revealed on here, and I wouldn't be messing you around either.

Yeah but videos confirm he was lame and showing neurological signs at time of purchase. As confirmed by my vet.

 

[CanteringCarrot]

Ok, but, there is some responsibility on the buyer. If you are going to spend money, and not do your due diligence, that's on you.

In an ideal world sellers would be upfront and honest, and some are. There are also some that just don't realize a horse is lame or showing signs of something. You'd be surprised how many experienced people cannot identify lameness or brush things off as that's just the way the horse is.

IME dealers usually refuse to deal with people that don't seem serious or those who are being very difficult.

It's also hard when you're selling a horse and someone is shopping above their level, but has to have the horse. They convince the seller they can handle it and will be in a good training program with a trainer. They don't do this, they get hurt, they blame the seller. But if you didn't sell them the horse and called them out on their sub-par skills, you're the bad guy. Both selling and buying can be a shit show.

I'm always skeptical of any purchase so I do my due diligence. I don't come off like an a-hole or someone just waiting to say "A-ha! Gotcha!" I come off serious and businesslike. There was one seller who wanted to start a bidding war, and I calmly stepped away. I don't have to buy from anyone just as they don't have to sell to me.

Many seemingly do not care about the animals are just looking to move them along. I get that. I've seen that. If you don't like it, don't support them.

Buying these animals is a huge risk. You cannot say that they won't maim themselves the moment they step on your property. If you're not ready for the risk or are feeling burnt out, don't buy now.

 

[MiniMilton]

Yeah but videos confirm he was lame and showing neurological signs at time of purchase. As confirmed by my vet.

Your posts are starting to get a little muddled or maybe I'm just misreading. Are you complaining that a horse that was lame at time of purchase went on and continued to be lame after purchase?

If I have read that correctly then it would indicate that perhaps you are not as good at spotting issues as you claim, and then trying to weed out any potential issues by approaching a seller with hostility.

If I were selling a horse I absolutely wouldn't sell to someone that had a hostile approach. I have been screwed over in the past, I approach any purchase with extreme caution, but never hostility. I would say the quieter you are the more you will see and hear at a viewing. Once a seller becomes wary or defensive then the lines of communication breakdown and informstion gets withheld.

I would take a break from viewing, and reassess your approach before continuing.

 

[MuffettMischief]

pretty sure I have figured out who you are on Facebook, and IF it is you I’m not surprised you are having trouble. After your rude and uncalled for response to my message about a horse, it’s no wonder. I’ve another lovely horse that would suit you down to the ground but I wouldn’t sell anything to you now. You need to try not to be so hostile because it’s putting people off! You may not be who I’m thinking of of course and if it’s not you then my apologies. Sellers totally understand buyers being cautious and wary and any decent seller will try and help you as much as they can and make you feel as comfortable as they can. Take a break for a while and a horse will probably fall in your lap when you least expect it

 

[MiniMilton]

And just a bit of friendly advice, the next time you want to view a horse, if you are very friendly, approachable and make an effort to build a rapport with the seller, you will find they tend to drop their guard and end up giving you more information than they had intended. It works really well as a approach to a sale. It doesn't mean you are a walkover, it just indicates you are a reasonable person to deal with.

I have turned down many sick and lame horses and always with a very polite and friendly but honest reason.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I don't really understand why you care what the dealer is doing. If she says she hasn't got a suitable horse for you, just look elsewhere. I assume that you have explained what you are looking for, with some clear criteria and parameters of what you would be prepared to compromise on. There would be no point in her inviting you to view and try something which does not fit your standard.

 

[Shilasdair]

Silly Servant, you are clearly very hurt regarding previous horse ownership happenings. I feel for you.

I don't think you are ready to buy another horse yet, I think you need to give yourself some time off from searching, maybe have lessons at a riding school or offer to 'share' to get your horsey fix.

There are dishonest dealers, for sure, but the ones I know are genuinely looking to match horses with humans to both their welfare. You need to be not trusting, but less distrustful.

But take a break - and start looking again when you feel less caught up in the past, perhaps?

 

[[131452]]

Thank you for all your concern but it's really not necessary. I don't approach anyone with hostility so rest easy on that.
I don't know if this dealer has an issue with me or not but given that I've caught her out lying plus the fact that I would most likely have to buy unseen or at the most on the basis of one ride and she'd probably had that horse for 24 hours, I won't be buying from her. I don't see myself buying from any dealer who operates like that and am pursuing private sales at the moment. There are a couple of decent dealers I know who won't sell like that but they tend to deal more in the sports horse space but I'm keeping an eye on their pages just in case.
Message me if you want a recommendation.

 

[MidChristmasCrisis]

Just a thought but what about approaching a dealer whom you feel you would respect and ask them to source/keep an eye out for a particular type of animal ..one you want to buy. If you can build a relationship with someone it can work very well...but may take time.