Another fatal dog attack

I shall probably be shot down for this. Does anyone watch the Dog House? I do any generally enjoy it as for the most part it is nice viewing to see rescues find lovely new homes. However from time to time I feel a little uneasy at the choices of dog offered to prospective new owners, despite the shelters very best of intentions and one assumes extensive experience with rehoming.

Last night was a prime example, a gorgeous Malinois that had come into the shelter (as a stray I believe but not certain on that) The poor thing was obviously very, very stressed and did need a good bit of careful handling by a handler described as experienced with the breed. Of course I am not an expert on the breed, but even to my inexperienced eye this dog was not going to be suitable for many private homes at all. Personally I thought rehoming consideration would have to be restricted to the most experienced owners that had extensive history owning the breed and catering to its high demands for action, exercise both physical and mental and the capacity to very quickly realise when the dog was getting seriously ramped up and needing firm guidance to be helped to lower the stress threshold for dog and handler.

The couple they offered the dog to had what looked like a cross breed German shepherd and claimed to have enough experience with the breed and no qualms with taking on another shepherd. When the meet and greet was started it became evident very quickly that the would be new owners where entirely out of their depth and terrified when the dog immediately took a dislike to the man and said so quite forcefully! Luckily they turned the dog down instantly and the staff did not try and encourage them to give it a go, as I have seen happen before.

I only just caught the end but I 'think' the dog had eventually been rehomed to some sort of Malinois rescue centre that looked like the dogs were given extensive work outs and challenges to give them some quality of life, even if not in a private home. Thank goodness for that at least.

The point of this ramble is, IMHO if even a very reputable facility like Wood Green can get it so horribly wrong from time to time, no small wonder that many dogs end up being rehomed into entirely unsuitable environments with very often, very inexperienced owners via all the other less high profile rescue centres. I think we owe it to the dogs to be as responsible and realistic as we possibly can when rehoming, and in an ideal world all homes would have to pass some sort of extensive test proving their know how and suitability to the dog being offered. Obviously that can't ever happen, but it isn't just private rehoming is the issue, not sure what the answer is really. My sympathy is with both those injured or killed when it goes wrong, but also for those poor dogs who have been failed by us too, time and time again. 😢
 
Mrs Jingle said:
I shall probably be shot down for this. Does anyone watch the Dog House? I do any generally enjoy it as for the most part it is nice viewing to see rescues find lovely new homes. However from time to time I feel a little uneasy at the choices of dog offered to prospective new owners, despite the shelters very best of intentions and one assumes extensive experience with rehoming.

Last night was a prime example, a gorgeous Malinois that had come into the shelter (as a stray I believe but not certain on that) The poor thing was obviously very, very stressed and did need a good bit of careful handling by a handler described as experienced with the breed. Of course I am not an expert on the breed, but even to my inexperienced eye this dog was not going to be suitable for many private homes at all. Personally I thought rehoming consideration would have to be restricted to the most experienced owners that had extensive history owning the breed and catering to its high demands for action, exercise both physical and mental and the capacity to very quickly realise when the dog was getting seriously ramped up and needing firm guidance to be helped to lower the stress threshold for dog and handler.

The couple they offered the dog to had what looked like a cross breed German shepherd and claimed to have enough experience with the breed and no qualms with taking on another shepherd. When the meet and greet was started it became evident very quickly that the would be new owners where entirely out of their depth and terrified when the dog immediately took a dislike to the man and said so quite forcefully! Luckily they turned the dog down instantly and the staff did not try and encourage them to give it a go, as I have seen happen before.

I only just caught the end but I 'think' the dog had eventually been rehomed to some sort of Malinois rescue centre that looked like the dogs were given extensive work outs and challenges to give them some quality of life, even if not in a private home. Thank goodness for that at least.

The point of this ramble is, IMHO if even a very reputable facility like Wood Green can get it so horribly wrong from time to time, no small wonder that many dogs end up being rehomed into entirely unsuitable environments with very often, very inexperienced owners via all the other less high profile rescue centres. I think we owe it to the dogs to be as responsible and realistic as we possibly can when rehoming, and in an ideal world all homes would have to pass some sort of extensive test proving their know how and suitability to the dog being offered. Obviously that can't ever happen, but it isn't just private rehoming is the issue, not sure what the answer is really. My sympathy is with both those injured or killed when it goes wrong, but also for those poor dogs who have been failed by us too, time and time again. 😢
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I watched that and was surprised when the couple were offered the Mali . Yes their dog ( looked Dutch Shepherd cross or similar ) was a rescue but she was super friendly nothing like that Mali . I’m actually glad he did have a pop at the guy so quickly as I was worried they might take it home . It was a lovely looking dog , had a foreign microchip . Hopefully the breed rescue will place it carefully, I’m quite surprised Wood Green didn’t offer him to the police .
 
nutjob said:
This dog attack story doesn't make sense to me. The younger dogs were separated from the older dog and so were not allegedly involved in the attack. A dog fight broke out, (which must have been the 2 younger dogs), which the girl tried to intervene in, then the older dog attacked and killed the girl?

I'm just not getting this and find it disturbing.
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To be fair the bit about her breaking up a dog fight and getting stuck in the middle was just a comment made by a supposed family member, it may not be correct as her dad didn’t mention it in his interview. It was just said that the lurcher was found upstairs with the girl and acting aggressively, and the 2 younger dogs were downstairs in the property (didn’t say if they were separated or shut away, just not found near the girl).
 
Mrs Jingle said:
I shall probably be shot down for this. Does anyone watch the Dog House? I do any generally enjoy it as for the most part it is nice viewing to see rescues find lovely new homes. However from time to time I feel a little uneasy at the choices of dog offered to prospective new owners, despite the shelters very best of intentions and one assumes extensive experience with rehoming.

Last night was a prime example, a gorgeous Malinois that had come into the shelter (as a stray I believe but not certain on that) The poor thing was obviously very, very stressed and did need a good bit of careful handling by a handler described as experienced with the breed. Of course I am not an expert on the breed, but even to my inexperienced eye this dog was not going to be suitable for many private homes at all. Personally I thought rehoming consideration would have to be restricted to the most experienced owners that had extensive history owning the breed and catering to its high demands for action, exercise both physical and mental and the capacity to very quickly realise when the dog was getting seriously ramped up and needing firm guidance to be helped to lower the stress threshold for dog and handler.

The couple they offered the dog to had what looked like a cross breed German shepherd and claimed to have enough experience with the breed and no qualms with taking on another shepherd. When the meet and greet was started it became evident very quickly that the would be new owners where entirely out of their depth and terrified when the dog immediately took a dislike to the man and said so quite forcefully! Luckily they turned the dog down instantly and the staff did not try and encourage them to give it a go, as I have seen happen before.

I only just caught the end but I 'think' the dog had eventually been rehomed to some sort of Malinois rescue centre that looked like the dogs were given extensive work outs and challenges to give them some quality of life, even if not in a private home. Thank goodness for that at least.

The point of this ramble is, IMHO if even a very reputable facility like Wood Green can get it so horribly wrong from time to time, no small wonder that many dogs end up being rehomed into entirely unsuitable environments with very often, very inexperienced owners via all the other less high profile rescue centres. I think we owe it to the dogs to be as responsible and realistic as we possibly can when rehoming, and in an ideal world all homes would have to pass some sort of extensive test proving their know how and suitability to the dog being offered. Obviously that can't ever happen, but it isn't just private rehoming is the issue, not sure what the answer is really. My sympathy is with both those injured or killed when it goes wrong, but also for those poor dogs who have been failed by us too, time and time again. 😢
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Our local Wood Green who I re homed from has a lot of volunteers and some seem to have very little experience of real world dogs. The two people who I met who were employed by them were more pragmatic, but while they are trying to raise funds from a public that has perhaps the idea that love will train a dog they have an image to maintain.
I have only once seen a Malinois up close, and OMG the size of it, made my RottiX look tiny. I have never had any fear of dogs, even the normal guard breeds but unless it had a job to do I wouldn't want one
 
honetpot said:
Our local Wood Green who I re homed from has a lot of volunteers and some seem to have very little experience of real world dogs. The two people who I met who were employed by them were more pragmatic, but while they are trying to raise funds from a public that has perhaps the idea that love will train a dog they have an image to maintain.
I have only once seen a Malinois up close, and OMG the size of it, made my RottiX look tiny. I have never had any fear of dogs, even the normal guard breeds but unless it had a job to do I wouldn't want one
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Are you sure it was a Malinois? They're not generally that big.
 
Late to thread, but I have shared my bed with my now 10 year old JRT since her first night home from the breeder. Made the necessary get-ups for night time toilet training much easier, she never cried and now is an essential hot water bottle. Only problem is she SNORES for England, so earplugs often needed 🤣 😂
 
Interestingly, and this is not a suggestion of what happened with the lurcher, I am aware of a complete change of character in some canines when they were exposed to some sort of drug. Normally placid and trustworthy they became very frightening and were out of control. I do wonder when I read some of these reports. This was an incident that was unintentional and malicious
 
Completely agree re some dodgy matching going on in the doghouse, cause for shouting at the tv occasionally.
Re bed sharing, two of our small dogs sleep on the bed , they are clean and the biggest is 5 kg so unlikely to cause a fatal injury. The Siamese is more of a worry , he likes to put his face right next to mine and he has a history of random biting. In an “ affectionate “ manner. It’s impossible to not let him sleep where he wants however , because he is a Siamese .., so I just take my chances !
 
I'm Dun said:
He has a dry coat he wears if hes particularly dirty, but a good dog doesnt get filthy working, they certainly dont get covered in blood. He has lovely warm shower while I check him over, in my shower, gets dried off with a towel, gets fed a big bowl of minced raw meat and goes to my bed to rest. He has regular physio, goes swimming in a dog swimming pool, goes to starbucks where hes a firm favourite with the staff, hes recently been helping me show the local traveller kids they dont need to be scared of dogs and how compassion with animals works better than force.

Thats the beauty of such a well adjusted, nice natured dog. I can and do take him anywhere. My older boy is a medical detection dog. Pretty much trained himself and just needed a bit of shaping. Hes saved my life countless times. He wakes me up when I have hypoglycaemic episodes. As for whose idea it was? Mine initially. Young puppies need touch as much as food and water. But given the breed was in part bred to be bed warmers, I'm pretty sure they would have come up with the idea themselves.

Any more ridiculous questions and thread hijacking you want to do or have you finished airing your hangups on
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Ours are working collies plus a gundog, which regularly catch rats whenever opportunity presents. Clearly our countryside is less manicured than yours, and local vermin more red-blooded. No one has said your dog isn’t a nice, helpful one, and would be hard put to say it about any of ours. Not hang ups, but very different standards.
 
Crazy_cat_lady said:
Obviously any dog is heavily weighted around the owner actually bothering to train it properly, however these massive breeds are so strong and powerful, they are at GREATER risk of causing harm, without then adding in the risk of them being owned by someone who WANTS to look like they can cause harm

No one can drive a car without a test. So why not apply levels of tests to dog sizes which need to be passed before ownership. (Or another criteria as ive come across a couple of really horrible nippy small dogs, I think the medium breeds often seem nicer even though I am NOT a dog person)

If I ever got a dog I wouldn't even dream of having something like a bully, I don't have the experience with dogs to be able to properly train something where the consequences are far greater if something goes wrong. Plus no way could I hold one, it was alarming enough being towed by a lab when we looked after him for the day

Its not just restricted to the big powerful breeds theres multiple yappy little rats who are just allowed to do as they Please. I know one, husband was about to let my young baby touch it, when its bitten people before, I legged it across the room, baby had his hand out to it, I pushed it back on its shoulder and it went to snap at me.

It definitely needs some sort of competency test, you wouldn't give a 17 year old a ferrari after passing their test and expect it to end well, with all that power and lack of experience

I feel as well, since covid, dogs have become too powerful and seem to be allowed anywhere. I went to a cafe at the weekend and there were a few dogs in there. One was a service dog, fair enough but then we had a pair of yorkie type things. It was quite a small cafe. As a non dog person, I do not want to be eating near dogs that may or may not be clean/well behaved/allowed to lick the table etc. It used to be limited to establishments such as country pubs where dogs were allowed, now they seem to be welcomed with open arms and pray Fido is left at home!

People also seem to assume everyone loves their dogs, the number of times ive been out with the pram and one is allowed to just come up and nose around, yep like im going to touch a strange dog!

These bully things also seem to be wired very very wrong, and when they snap they dont stop
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Dogs are dogs, and children are children, neither of them always do what they should or what might be expected - and occasionally the consequences will be disastrous. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together does not push their luck in this respect. Clear ground rules and supervision.
Entitled owners bringing their mutts into public eating places or food shops is becoming a post-Covid minefield for staff. Local cafe owner had a run-in with a couple over a large boisterous dog, which she banned after it entered the place and upset customers (sign said dogs could sit at the outside tables, where there was a water bowl).They returned some days later with a harness printed ‘support canine’, loudly threatened her with equalities law - claiming one has ADHD and the dog makes him feel better, altho the harnesses are easy to get printed up - she telephoned the police, they left, but overnight a load of dog-bags were chucked onto the outside tables….dodgily-wired owners as well as the dogs.
 
ester said:
only rats? I'D's likes the odd deer.
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No, they need to work livestock, not worry anything.
Prefer them to deter deer altogether - which travel miles, potentially in and out of TB areas, eat as much grass crop as possible and can be relied on to leap up or across right under the horses’ noses at the most inconvenient time.
 
Exasperated said:
Dogs are dogs, and children are children, neither of them always do what they should or what might be expected - and occasionally the consequences will be disastrous. Anyone with two brain cells to rub together does not push their luck in this respect. Clear ground rules and supervision.
Entitled owners bringing their mutts into public eating places or food shops is becoming a post-Covid minefield for staff. Local cafe owner had a run-in with a couple over a large boisterous dog, which she banned after it entered the place and upset customers (sign said dogs could sit at the outside tables, where there was a water bowl).They returned some days later with a harness printed ‘support canine’, loudly threatened her with equalities law - claiming one has ADHD and the dog makes him feel better, altho the harnesses are easy to get printed up - she telephoned the police, they left, but overnight a load of dog-bags were chucked onto the outside tables….dodgily-wired owners as well as the dogs.
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Wrong place for this but honestly! I appreciate greatly being able to take my little dog in places as I travel and live on my own. Trouble is, the majority spoil it for the minority. And the majority are so entitled.
 
Exasperated said:
Perfect? Oh no, different, and particular about where and with what I sleep.
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So am I, and my dogs don't sleep on my bed at night, but I also don't read a story about someone dying from a puncture wound to the neck from their pet dog and think 'bet it was because they let the dog on the bed'.
 
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I think it is worth considering that there are apparently over 13 million dogs in the UK. There is increasing urbanization, and more and more dogs are living in an increasingly human and constrained world. There are definitely some people who shouldn't have dogs, some dogs which are inherently unsafe who shouldn't have people, some risks that could be mitigated.

But there are also going to true accidents, and fluke events. There are going to be combinations of factors that spark unexpected behaviors in both dogs and humans. Our interpretations of body language and perceived threats won't always align. There can be such thing as just a tragic accident with a terrible and random set of circumstances.

I'm just so sad for the girl, her family, and the dogs. It's miserable all round.
 
It's completely normal for dogs to live in small apartments and flats and in highly populated cities in countries in other parts of the world (Netherlands is full of people and dogs, for example) and I don't know that this has been a huge problem in terms of dog-related fatalities.

But I do agree even 'experienced' dog owners can have little to no knowledge of dog body language and stress signals.
 
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