Any horse snobs who can’t ride?

I teach, I see this so often, people who need a Golf but want a Ferrari, I'm sure its possible for it to work out well, but I've never seen it personally. What I have seen is people become scared and fins every reason not to ride, and horses become confused and distressed.

I believe the only way to do successful horse shopping is to be brutally honest with yourself. Dont indulge in the fantasy of gliding about on your equine supernodel, think about day to day life, ask the realistic questions and be totally honest with yourself about the answers. I'd start by asking yourself if you'd be happy to ride the horse alone on a freezing cold January day with a gale blowing, then ask if you want the horse to be the same to ride after ten days off because life got in the way and you didnt have time to ride etc.

Both you and the horse deserve a happy outcome, and in my experience this is best achieved with honesty.
 
Birker2020 said:
It's hard when you have been lucky enough to have owned beautiful quality WB's all your life and been complimented on them whenever you've been out and about competing

Then you suddenly realise you'd probably be better off with something less elegant and something like a rock steady Eddie because you lack the confidence of the old you or you're too long in the tooth to spend hours in A&E waiting for an xray!

I guess that might sound snobby to some but it's not intended, it's just personal preference.

I'm beginning to come round to the idea of an ID or a cob type but it's going to have to be right for my purpose l, not too heavy and not too behind the leg because that would bore me to tears. Been there and done that and having a unsuitable horse which is lazy, boring and too quiet can be as detrimental to me as something that is too sharp or off the leg.

You'll find something but you might need to widen your options. I can't compromise on height or age but I can possibly compromise on colour or breed to an extent and have started to do so.

I've considered both the piebald (too expensive) and the grey (worried about cresty neck) but I know my preference will always be for the third type. I would probably suit the second horse much better even though I really don't want a grey for so many reasons.
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Actually some cobs can be very sharp.When I went to try my mare I had seen for sale at the same place this very pretty beautifully marked cob mare.She was a stunner.I mentioned her to the dealer and she said that "Yes she was lovely but she was also very sharp".
 
Birker2020 said:
It's hard when you have been lucky enough to have owned beautiful quality WB's all your life and been complimented on them whenever you've been out and about competing

Then you suddenly realise you'd probably be better off with something less elegant and something like a rock steady Eddie because you lack the confidence of the old you or you're too long in the tooth to spend hours in A&E waiting for an xray!

I guess that might sound snobby to some but it's not intended, it's just personal preference.

I'm beginning to come round to the idea of an ID or a cob type but it's going to have to be right for my purpose l, not too heavy and not too behind the leg because that would bore me to tears. Been there and done that and having a unsuitable horse which is lazy, boring and too quiet can be as detrimental to me as something that is too sharp or off the leg.

You'll find something but you might need to widen your options. I can't compromise on height or age but I can possibly compromise on colour or breed to an extent and have started to do so.

I've considered both the piebald (too expensive) and the grey (worried about cresty neck) but I know my preference will always be for the third type. I would probably suit the second horse much better even though I really don't want a grey for so many reasons.
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I have been looking with you in mind and saw the coloured one and thought he might suit, I discounted the grey as you said you wouldn’t have one but he looks like a good type for you. I know you are not looking at the moment but good be luck when you do , there must be the one out there for you that isn’t grey 🙂
 
I think we can all be guilty at wanting or even buying the horse we would like to ride, rather than the one that we can ride now. I've done it. After a break of a few years (children - another thread!) I bought a 5 year old which I thought I was going to go on where I had left off riding 10 years before (I had been riding a bit in between). Mistake!!

What I should have bought was a 12 year old schoolmaster type that could look after ME, and take me round. Unfortunately there was no one around to actually say to me "don't buy that, go for something else." She was a nice horse and I learnt a lot (lots!) but she wasn't really right. for the time and probably altered the course of my life in a negative way - no injuries or anything, just choices.
 
I made that mistake when I bought my last horse, I was 55 and she was a warmblood cross who was very sparky , just the type I liked. Unfortunately I didn’t realise I wasn’t as brave or as good a rider in later life, she really scared me and I considered selling her after 6 months but then had an attachment to her and worried she would be passed around , so I kept her but didn’t have as much fun as each ride was a challenge. I lost her to cushings when she was 25, I had owned her for 15 years and am pleased I didn’t sell . If I was to buy again it would be a smaller horse/pony not a gypsy cob, that was non spooky but I couldn’t have something that needed a lot of pushing on, has to be forward going… I’m now 78 and have given up due to medical condition but mentally I would love another
 
marmalade76 said:
Have you actually ridden any Irish Draughts? I rode one as a teen when I was used to TBs, Warmbloods and whizzy ponies, he was huge, well over 17h but was so light on his feet, jumped beautifully and was forward and responsive. The one I owned later went like a steam train, super jump, had successfully team chased before I bought him (though admittedly he was 1/4 TB) and more recently I've borrowed one to hack & hunt, again, forward with a great jump. They're basically sports horses in a chunkier body and the ones I've ridden are the absolute opposite of behind the leg.
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Exactly. I think some people think IDs are just big cobs. They are not!
 
eahotson said:
Back in the day I used to go to a tracking centre.There was this ugly little coloured cob that I never wanted to ride.I was reluctantly persuaded to try him.Within 10 minutes I was smitten and to me he was the best looking horse ever.
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Right!
I was working at a yard once and told I had to start hacking out a horse who had been off injured but was ready to get going again. The guy went and got it in from the field as Id never seen it and it was "The bay gelding" in a field of bays
He got it in and tied it up on the yard, I was horrified and embarrassed to be going out on the roads on such a filthy "ugly" hairy looking horse. FF a few years and he was mine, I actually used to look at him and just be blown away by how incredibly handsome he was 🤣 He was just beautiful and I was so proud of him.
 
splashgirl45 said:
I couldn’t have something that needed a lot of pushing on, has to be forward going… I’m now 78 and have given up due to medical condition but mentally I would love another
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I am sorry you have had to stop riding. I am over 80 and I ride a non spooky ID mare who does (or used to) need a touch of the leg at every stride to keep going. It is a safety thing I think for novice hackers, the horse they are riding will stop unless pushed on.

But one can teach a horse not to need leg. I told her I wasnt going to use leg every stride in trot. I repeatedly said trot on and, if she slowed down, I waved my crop away from her shoulder, so she could see it. She needs leg on every stride in canter too and I have kept it like that. I canter out a lot on my own and I need a horse that will stop cantering when I want her to.

I agree that horses change according to their rider. Present share responds so like my old share that I sometimes call her by the wrong name.
 
Behind the leg and ploddy.That may well have described my little mare.She is a heavy weight and was only 4 when I bought her.They are not naturally the most athletic and she was very green and unfit.It has taken time (and money!) to find a trainer to really help.She needed to be fitter and her schooling improving.We are on our way.She is getting more off the leg and her canter work is improving a lot.I have learned a lot about young horses.She is very sensible and will never be sharp but that is fine with me as it is what I wanted.I am told she is very saleable.There is more to schooling than teaching horses how to piaffe and passage,
 
I think it's worth considering if you want a horse that looks flashy, or is sharp and athletic to ride- you can have a great time with an improved native/native X tb or Arab, but they don't look as 'posh' as a wb type. To extend the car metaphor from above, they're the hot hatches of the horse world, you can have a lot of fun with them, they're quick and manoeuvreable but at the end of the day they are also practical and relatively cheap to run.
If you want the looks more than the nature, you definitely want to look for a horse currently doing what you will be doing, or ensure you have the £££ to pay someone else to keep them in hard work, as a lot of horses bred for dressage etc will need a lot of work and schooling to stay sane and manageable.
 
I had in my head a warmblood gelding, between 7-10 yrs old.
What I bought was a 4 yr old Highland pony mare. Honestly I have had so much fun with her over 18 years. We have done much more than I would have ever done with my first choice. Anything I ask of her she does. She's not slow or ploddy. - yesterday's stroll ended up cantering and jumping up logging paths.

You've had lots of advice and I've nothing to add to that.
 
A few years ago, I was between horses. I'd put my very smart looking ISH on sales livery and my confidence was shot. He was exactly what I'd been looking for - and what I'd had previously so I wasn't overestimating my riding ability but it didn't work out and we both lost lots of confidence so it was time to part. A friend let me ride her cob. I love a cob but this one was super ugly, with a real bucket head and a big hairy pink nose that never looked clean . I joked to another friend that I'd have to put a paper bag over his head to take him out in public. Even though I'd ridden out with my friend on him, I'd never paid attention to ho he went and expected him to be a total plod. I thought I'd be bored. Then I rode him. He jogged, he danced he wouldn't stand still - all things that would have terrified me with Charlie - and I laughed the whole time. He was just what I needed at the time, so much fun but reassuring too.

OP - I think you ned to ask yourself, is it the look of a flashy horse or the feeling of the movement you're after? I ask as I think it's possible to get the movement in another body shape. After Charlie sold and I started looking again I still had the same criteria that I had when I was looking for Charlie but I prioritised them differently. Kind and safe were my top asks - they'd been there before but I didn't value them in the same way. I found Wiggy within 2 weeks. He's a chunk and, while he has a certain amount of quality he's not a big flashy warmblood but he moves beautifully and most importantly has a heart of gold. I wasn't necessarily looking for the movement as a priority but I found it anyway. He does a lovely test at novice and before his injury we were aiming for elementary. In 2 years with Charlie, I managed 2 walk trot tests!
 
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eahotson said:
Back in the day I used to go to a tracking centre.There was this ugly little coloured cob that I never wanted to ride.I was reluctantly persuaded to try him.Within 10 minutes I was smitten and to me he was the best looking horse ever.
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I went to look at a couple of horses at a reputable dealer who we’d already bought an absolute cracker from. I tried the horses but neither gave me a feel. They then pulled out a coloured sportshorse. I said not my type or colour but got on him anyway as I was there. He was 5 and gave me such a feel, he’s now in my field at home. I always said I’d never have a coloured so what do I know!
 
Squeak said:
It's amazing what a hair cut, smart gear and going properly can do for a horse! A mediocre looking horse can be scrubbed up to look smart you just need a bit of imagination when you're viewing!

For example:

https://www.facebook.com/BurghleyHorse/posts/pfbid0amCq91dZTYdbuAxZHZUHR5Jg6KDscYSG4B8Z1tDMpdQ7UTVyJYr1RnwS7hsq8WuEl

Good luck in your searching OP, I hope you manage to find your Prince Charming.
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Was having that conversation with someone the other day. It is an art seeing what a horse in the rough may turn into, but yes a bit of a hair cut and some hoof oil adds value (unless horse is supposed to be very hairy).
 
Yeah, a lot of those well-bred and well-schooled warmbloods will be quite sharp.

Ask yourself, why you want the Ferrari? Is it to learn the PSG movements, which is sort of a future problem if you have only been riding for two years? Or just to have it (hah...like most people who own Ferraris...I doubt they use them on track....they just get to look cool sitting in city traffic)? With your budget, you could get a lovely, kind all-rounder that moves well enough, but won't blow the world away with its paces. Okay, it might not do tempis or canter half-pass, either, but with two years of riding under your belt, neither are you.

Confidence is fragile. So many people destroy theirs by overhorsing themselves. Every yard I have ever stayed on has a significant number of owners who don't ride because they bought something they shouldn't have and got scared. Like someone above said, imagine yourself alone on the yard in a gale. Would you be confident handling and riding that horse?
 
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The flashy upper level horse is the goal so maybe start taking steps rather than skipping them and over reaching. Buy the slightly less flashy novice friendly schoolmaster now and let them show you the ropes. Get cracking on improving your riding and gaining experience outside of lessons. In another couple of years you might find you need a different horse to meet your goals and your first horse can move on and show the next person the ropes. It’s perfectly normal to change horses when you want to take a step up. In an ideal world I could have kept the horse who brought me around my first 90’s event, and I mean literally brought me as I hadn’t a clue, and gone up the levels with him but his special skill was novice riders with big ambitions up to 100, so when the time came that my goals went beyond that he went on to teach the next ambitious but clueless person about the game. Would he have tried for me beyond 100 … without a doubt … would it have been fair of me to ask that of him… no.
 
Lucky you having such a great budget - the dream! Maybe you could buy something you can get loads of lessons on, and maybe spend some of the budget having someone capable to school the horse, ideally before you get on, and then give you lessons. I've seen that work and the rider has grown into the horse if you like. Maybe don't buy a complete ferrari just one thats a ferrari with the right rider, hens teeth I am sure!
Then again I know a GP horse that hacks out with any rider. They do exist.
 
Have you thought of looking at some show horses? For your budget you would get a horse who is competing at the highest level of showing but will have learnt to cope with huge county shows and indoor shows - horses at that level of showing are generally very forgiving. The other plus is that they are taught to be ridden by a vast range of different riders as they are ridden by the ride judge and often some of whom are *ahem* not brilliant...

Quite often the riding horse types have warmblood breeding but may be quieter than the dressage horses you're thinking of due to their education. It is a given at the top level that they will have beautiful paces, conformation, schooling and manners.
 
I only got into owning and riding my Exmoor ponies because when I got to the age of 35 and was finally in a position to get my own "horse", and despite having a background of exercising hunters and racehorses, I felt as a new owner that what I needed was something I felt I knew I could manage and looked at native ponies, and ended up with Exmoor ponies. I have since learnt that smaller doesn't mean easier :rolleyes: , but on the other hand, I have always felt confident in handling on the ground.
 
honestly if you can afford it, i see absolutely no reason why you shouldn’t have the flash horse😂😂 you admit you need one suited to a novice! a slightly older schoolmaster is probably your best bet, good luck on your search! depending on your size, don’t discount a nice native…a welsh or connie can be plenty flashy, and yes welshies in particular can be whizzy but they can also be very level headed! or maybe a nice sports horse/part bred?
 
You haven't mentioned where you are going to keep the horse. Keeping them at home is tough as it's all on you, but if you kept one on working livery at, say, Talland, you'd be fine with the flashier horses.

Or you could convert to Western and have a flashy little quarter horse that's still sensible :D
 
Hay, shoes, feed, vets, saddles etc. cost the same whether you’ve spent 75k on the horse or not. With that in mind, why not try and buy your dream horse. It sounds like you are going into this with your eyes open, so go for it. You only live once.
 
neverexplain said:
I’ve been stuck at proposition 1 for so long, looking around 50-70k. And if pushed I am prepared to spend up a bit more (I know absolutely mad) for a bloody first horse. First horse. Somebody give me a good smack!

A few examples: tried a PSG KPWN horse who gave me my first spook and bolt (thankfully indoor school). AM Belgian warm blood that bit my middle finger unprovoked (it was totally sour) and stunning elementary trakehner that in the end was too strong for my nerves. And way too many others that ended up being a bit sharp, big flashy movers that are super light to the aids because that comes with the price tag! And I’ve obviously prefaced prior to viewings that I am novice and was very transparent of my riding level with my unbalanced riding videos. My current prospect, which I’m yet to view is 75k asking from this fancy breeder PSG level but low mileage but looks too good to be true that it can take on a novice so the sellers claimed. I just feel like giving up on proposition 1!
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Just thinking outside the box a bit.... I don't know where in the country you're based, but if your priority is dressage, are there any pro-dressage riders/trainers based near you? If so, you could ask if they're interested in leasing a schoolmaster horse, and livery and train with them at their yard?

I think that's a lot more common in the US, but it would possibly de-risk the massive purchase expense a bit - and if you don't get on with the horse, it's leased rather than purchased.
 
I've got a friend who is as you describe who did just that. So far it has been a resounding success. But she keeps her horse with her trainer and bought the second horse she tried from what appears to be a very straightforward dressage horse dealer who, having met her and seen her ride, knew the type that would suit her. The horse is genuinely lovely, and very flashy.
 
neverexplain said:
I’ve been stuck at proposition 1 for so long, looking around 50-70k. And if pushed I am prepared to spend up a bit more (I know absolutely mad) for a bloody first horse. First horse. Somebody give me a good smack!

A few examples: tried a PSG KPWN horse who gave me my first spook and bolt (thankfully indoor school). AM Belgian warm blood that bit my middle finger unprovoked (it was totally sour) and stunning elementary trakehner that in the end was too strong for my nerves. And way too many others that ended up being a bit sharp, big flashy movers that are super light to the aids because that comes with the price tag! And I’ve obviously prefaced prior to viewings that I am novice and was very transparent of my riding level with my unbalanced riding videos. My current prospect, which I’m yet to view is 75k asking from this fancy breeder PSG level but low mileage but looks too good to be true that it can take on a novice so the sellers claimed. I just feel like giving up on proposition 1!
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Blimey that's one hell of a budget. Mines around 11-13k until I can save more when I'm back at work again as I've had to support myself whist not working out of the horsey fund. I need a good contingency fund though.

More money doesn't necessarily buy you a better horse, my best horse was £4.6k, Lari was 12.5k and a disaster!
 
LEC said:
You have effectively just passed your driving test and are now trying to buy an Aston. But just because you like Astons, doesn’t mean you can’t find a nice merc or BMW. You don’t have to buy a Ford or a Vauxhall.

The advice I always give people with horses is buy the horse you need now, not the horse you think you need as I see that go wrong 💯 more. You end up with a miserable horse who isn’t doing anything wrong as just being themselves and a miserable rider.
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Great analogy!
 
The only way I think it would be achievable would be with the horse based in a professional training set up, with the riding shared between you and a pro ‘keeping the wheels on’.
Breeding alone doesn’t define how difficult or ‘flash’ the horse will be. There’s some poorly moving dressage bred horses and some stunning TBxSJbreeding. There’s shit sharp cobs and ploddy behind the leg event bred horses.
I think one of the big differences is in how much the horse needs stability. I’ve had dressage bred warmbloods ride like IDs - good moving but don’t through you into the sky each step, and others that are like a bendy hypermobile hypersensitive eel and they’re almost impossible to balance on let alone school and improve unless you’re very riding fit.
I’d be tempted to get 2 horses with that budget, 1 mid level school master to enjoy right now and 1 flashier one to have based with a rider you can have lessons on but also enjoy being an owner for…!
 
Another thought, if you can buy the flashy horse place it with a competition rider and you sit on now and again under supervision. You'll get the thrill of being an owner at competitions without the pressure. Alternatively, if funds allow buy the competition horse for a pro to produce just now and a quieter allrounder for you to gain experience on with a view to selling on in a couple of years?
 
daffy44 said:
I teach, I see this so often, people who need a Golf but want a Ferrari, I'm sure its possible for it to work out well, but I've never seen it personally. What I have seen is people become scared and fins every reason not to ride, and horses become confused and distressed.

I believe the only way to do successful horse shopping is to be brutally honest with yourself. Dont indulge in the fantasy of gliding about on your equine supernodel, think about day to day life, ask the realistic questions and be totally honest with yourself about the answers. I'd start by asking yourself if you'd be happy to ride the horse alone on a freezing cold January day with a gale blowing, then ask if you want the horse to be the same to ride after ten days off because life got in the way and you didnt have time to ride etc.

Both you and the horse deserve a happy outcome, and in my experience this is best achieved with honesty.
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This is the sort of horse I want!
 
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