Anybody else against small pony jumping?

they stay on because they are good effective riders.
a large percentage of showjumping ponies will NOT take you round if you sit there doing bugger all.

Im not against small pony jumping at all. We all have our faults, these little children competing at the highest level are fantastic riders.
 
What makes you think they don't have training? Is it an area you work in? Seems rather a large generalisation! I thought we had some sort of 'future stars' type thing that gave those who show exeptional promise acess to more training with top trainers? Beyond that it really is up to the individual (as it is at every level of every equestrian sport). Often the top ponies aren't owned by the rider or their parents, I should imagine if the rider was so terrible then the owners would choose someone else to ride their rather valuable and talented pony?
I must say I struggle to see your problem with this?
 
Kenzo said:
I think it more down to rider attitude rather than age/ability and what tracks there jumping or how good the pony is, the majority of young riders (that are purely into show jumping) think differently at that age than they do when there a bit older, its all part of growing up, being more mature, so when they move onto horses there is still quite a bit of carelessness/slopping riding that needs mopping up. By the time your big and strong enough to move up to horses, you think more maturely about what your doing, focus more on the training rather than just purely on the winning.
Click to expand...

Yeahh I see your point and I think some riders also start maturing in their final years of juniors which could be why the standard gradually gets better rather than the fact the younger riders don't get training.

Perhaps I'm looking at it from the wrong perspective
 
Clearly you also need to look at the Pony European results over the years. Team GBR results are the envy of all the other countries competing. All these riders came through the small pony ranks. Agree with other posts, these ponies are not easy to ride. Would you come down to a 1.20 oxer on a 128cm pony bucking all the way or pulling your arms out of the sockets.
 
I do actually agree with OP to a degree.

we go to HOYS every year and every year we go shopping when there are kids jumping classes on as the huge majority of them ride very poorly.

When you look at the huge amount of junior riders who have bags of money and don't progress on as seniors is it all down to the riders finding boys etc or perhaps is it that they haven't gained the level of feel/skill which inveriably is needed more with horses?

perhaps there should be more style rounds for juniors as well as the usual classes to try and encourage more correct riding?
 
glosgirl said:
What makes you think they don't have training? Is it an area you work in? Seems rather a large generalisation! I thought we had some sort of 'future stars' type thing that gave those who show exeptional promise acess to more training with top trainers? Beyond that it really is up to the individual (as it is at every level of every equestrian sport). Often the top ponies aren't owned by the rider or their parents, I should imagine if the rider was so terrible then the owners would choose someone else to ride their rather valuable and talented pony?
I must say I struggle to see your problem with this?
Click to expand...

I'm not saying they all don't have training the ones who do are very good.

What I'm saying is the ones who don't it shows, but as you said its up to the individual to get training I really think there should be more programmes for these riders as the future star schemes are only available to very few riders.

I'm not having a go at pony jumping as done properlly is very good stepping stones for young riders etc but I think there should be more available training to the riders who don't get it
 
millitiger said:
perhaps there should be more style rounds for juniors as well as the usual classes to try and encourage more correct riding?
Click to expand...

This! I have family in America and it seems all the junior riders focus alot on these style classes. I watched a documentary once where a whole lot of clear rounds didn't go through in favour of 4 faulters who had ridden really well.

Not that I can comment on anyone's riding since I can't ride for toffee! :D
 
millitiger said:
I do actually agree with OP to a degree.

we go to HOYS every year and every year we go shopping when there are kids jumping classes on as the huge majority of them ride very poorly.

When you look at the huge amount of junior riders who have bags of money and don't progress on as seniors is it all down to the riders finding boys etc or perhaps is it that they haven't gained the level of feel/skill which inveriably is needed more with horses?

perhaps there should be more style rounds for juniors as well as the usual classes to try and encourage more correct riding?
Click to expand...

Yes this is what I'm getting to, if the children won not only on speed and faults but also got judged on how well they rode like equitation I think we would have a much cleaner sport!

It was hard to get my point across as everyone is having a go
 
Cuffey said:
Training is available through Junior Academy
I would expect but do not know for sure that the ones who progress will make full use of this system but no doubt some will have family members coaching them

http://www.britishshowjumping.co.uk/training/Junior-Academy
Click to expand...

I did this when I was in juniors the sessions were brilliant!

But they were only on in the holidays and once so I personally do not think that is enough, each session was with a different instructor so something I worked on from the previous session would not have been aknowleged in the next.

Perhaps I worded the thread badly. What I guess I should have said is the riders who don't get the training (and its obvious) should have more access to it.
 
What a complete load of TOSH.

Most of the kids jumping at the top level in their age class are cracking little riders with super ponies and good trainers.

They no doubt at times look a little hap-hazard but they are often very young and just learning thier trade.

I have seen a LOT worse riding by the adults in BSJA novice & amatuer classes !!
 
wonkey_donkey said:
What a complete load of TOSH.

Most of the kids jumping at the top level in their age class are cracking little riders with super ponies and good trainers.

They no doubt at times look a little hap-hazard but they are often very young and just learning thier trade.

I have seen a LOT worse riding by the adults in BSJA novice & amatuer classes !!
Click to expand...

Ok, yes most are brilliant and I have already said this as they have training! Its all about training!

And yes adults in seniors can look urmm interesting aswell but I doubt they get training

Like I said earlier I think I worded this thread badly as I have annoyed some people, what I should have put was, who agrees they need more training before comepting at that level?
 
Starting to see what you are getting at now. As far as access to training I tend to agree with you. Certainly when I was in ponies we also did pony club. Some of these children have no idea what the markers around the arena mean or what diagonals are. Sorry if I was slightly harsh before.
 
Hugo said:
Starting to see what you are getting at now. As far as access to training I tend to agree with you. Certainly when I was in ponies we also did pony club. Some of these children have no idea what the markers around the arena mean or what diagonals are. Sorry if I was slightly harsh before.
Click to expand...

No problem I can see how what I wrote could have come across the wrong way.

But I totally agree with what some people say about being marked on style! That would be brilliant for the sport :)
 
Just to help you out OP as you seem to be getting a bit of stick!

OP started this post partly due to a post I made on another thread.

Back in the late mid - late eighties there was a fairly local junior SJer who all of a sudden shot to the top after aquiring a new pony. Around that time my father and step-mother were BSing and saw a lecture by the said rider advertised at a show centre entitled 'How to get to HOYS without a single riding lesson' (BTW OP, we did not attend!).

Funnily enough, said rider has not made it to HOYS since parting with said pony and funnily enough, every other child who rode it also got to the top.

So it seems the girl who gloated about not having had any riding lessons only achieved the success she did because she was lucky enough to have that particular pony.
 
Kokopelli said:
Like I said earlier I think I worded this thread badly as I have annoyed some people, what I should have put was, who agrees they need more training before comepting at that level?
Click to expand...

I knew what you getting at, hence my reply, I think a lot of it is down to what yard your on and the parents.

In an ideal world, you can afford both, a good jumping pony and good regular tuition, as well as the compeiting costs but not everyone can, parents will splash out on a good pony and also on getting out and about but not always on the tuition side, after all when your kid, where the fun in that, you just want to get out there and jump.

Personally if I was the parent, if I couldnt afford everything, I'd rather folk out tution and settle for a less capable pony, but then some might argue see no point in that either....because the instructor is going to turn around and say you need a better pony, so unless you plenty money or a very patient child, your pretty much screwed! ;):D
 
I agree I would rather fork out for tuition then competition, for example this weekend I had the choice of hiring an arena with very scary showjumps for my youngster or taking my experienced boy to a show. I went for the arena :)

And thankyou marmalade :)
 
marmalade76 said:
Just to help you out OP as you seem to be getting a bit of stick!

OP started this post partly due to a post I made on another thread.

Back in the late mid - late eighties there was a fairly local junior SJer who all of a sudden shot to the top after aquiring a new pony. Around that time my father and step-mother were BSing and saw a lecture by the said rider advertised at a show centre entitled 'How to get to HOYS without a single riding lesson' (BTW OP, we did not attend!).

Funnily enough, said rider has not made it to HOYS since parting with said pony and funnily enough, every other child who rode it also got to the top.

So it seems the girl who gloated about not having had any riding lessons only achieved the success she did because she was lucky enough to have that particular pony.
Click to expand...

All the Gear, and no Idea!
 
I have to disagree on this, I'm not against it at all- when I jumped in junior 148 classes, you would see the young kids on their 128's jumping, and most of them were extremely talented, brave, gutsy riders on equally talented ponies!- even if some of the ponies were schoolmistresses/ schoolmasters they were still learning from some of the best ponies in showjumping!

I think you start to develop a style and perfect it when you get a bit older and on to the horses!- and maybe not every rider at senior level has ridden in junior classes so you can't really blame it on that.

Yes I've always been taught that when jumping your security in the saddle is all from having a secure lower leg position- but does it really matter as long as the kids are staying on and enjoying themselves, getting clear rounds I think thats all that matters!
 
Kokopelli said:
This is also a reason so many people struggle when they move onto horses. Only 10 riders who competed ponies internationally have managed it on horses! I think this is saying something!

QUOTE]

Yes it does say something - it says that most people cannot afford to splash 40k plus on a horse when they came out of ponies.

I competed in JA classes on my ponies and had many a success at places such as Hickstead / Scope / Festival of showjumping (as it was back then!) and was very successful on my local circuit.

HOWEVER when it came to selling - i sold all 3 ponies for around 30k - money to go on horses.

I had the option of blowing all that money on ONE young riders type horse and praying that horse stayed sound / un injured / didnt jack it on me OR spending the money on 2 /3 nice novices - guess which route i took?

Novices - and i did get one to jump YR classes on before i was 21 and i did it myself, without a ready made horse.

These kids are the future of jumping - yes ponies are more forgiving than horses, but these kids need to gain there confidence on 12.2's before progressing to 13.2 and 14.2 respectively.

If there balance wasnt good they would fall off surely?
Plus ive seen much better riding and less mouth pulling by 7yr olds on 12hh ponies than i have at senior level and un affiliated.

Surely the rant should be about bad riding at ALL ages and levels and maybe not just at small pony level?
Click to expand...
 
It's a shame there are some young riders on the circuit who don't feel the need to match the talent of their massively expensive ponies (CJ's Kemosabi at a reputed £250K) by learning the proper skills to take them seamlessly onto horses.

The truly, naturally talented usually have a concern for this, as their innate ability isn't standalone - it is part of a total affinity and understanding of horses. You are not, of course, talking about those children.

It's the kick, pull and thump brigade on willing and brave little ponies who torment the older and wiser (riders and onlookers) with their thoughtless, crude and downright shameful exploitation of their mounts.

I keep out of the way now, as I can't keep a civil tongue in my head. My two always got complimented on their tactful and quiet riding. Quite simply, I'd have tanned their hides if they'd ragged their ponies round or been harsh/blamed them for their own mistakes.

Thing is, they rode correctly, the ponies went correctly and any mistakes were 99% of the time pilot error!

Except the time one pony did his own personal (unrehearsed and un coreographed) first half of a freestyle test - that was just hilarious and he was obviously just enjoying himself. Poor kid just had to ride it out and pick up the tune as soon as he regained the controls.
 
I think there are several factors in 'not succeeding' in horses after good pony career.
1) the little ponies actually do require considerable speed to get over the big jumps - it is quite difficult to switch to riding slower and you just cannot career down related distances on a horse like that...
2) it takes awful lot of commitment and hard work to carry on, with very little financial reward - the boys/girls become more interesting than the ponies, getting a proper education and a profession that will keep a roof over your head becomes a priority.
3) there aren't that many people who can afford a string of proper senior level GP horses, not everybody can get owners either;)

those are just a few, I'm sure there are many more.
 
Maybe horrible to watch, but I learnt alongtime ago that it's not good getting wound over stuff you have no control over. Best to lead by example and know you are doing the right thing.

Sure, I'll see some stuff and think 'ugh!', bad riding for example....but when I'm not in control, not point in giving myself a hernia over it! Now, blatant abuse of course, would be an entirely different kettle of fish.....
 
Tim Stockdale is rude about the pony riders. All his kids went to PC.
 
This is a sport in which money CAN buy you your five minutes of fame.

I could go out tomorrow, buy a show pony, send it to a producer, kit my kid out in the right gear, and hey presto, red rosettes....

BUT that's all it is, five minutes of success. Those who get the proper training stay in the limelight, those who don't, won't.

Getting to the top and STAYING at the top requires dedication and years of work. There's not many who can finance that in time and money.

I do think our GB level pony riders would benefit from training from top GB trainers, but this would be hard to do as they're spread all over the country.

Showjumping isn't a viable full time career for many, so education comes first.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top