Barefoot query - hooves wearing faster than they grow

[leflynn]

Hi, I'm hoping for some advice if possible from you knowledgable lot!

OH has a lovely wondercob, who has been barefoot all his life (as far as I know), we've had him for 18 months now and is still barefoot and would like to keep it that way if possible. The only issue we are about to have again is that his hooves wear down faster than they grow especially comeing into this time of year where we do more hacking (ie 5 times a week for 1hr plus) and most of our hacking involves a lot of roadwork to get onto tracks and it seems to be this that causes them to wear down faster. He is in a lot more work now with us and since last August (when we moved yards) he has had this issue when there is more roadwork. His hooves also seem to waer slightly unlevel too but with a trim they are back to level and lovely. He does go footy when the weather is very wet but as soon as the ground dries up he is fine again and hasn't been lightly footy for more than a day or two over winter.

Grazing daily 6am till 4pm and a small holed small net of haylage overnight (not very sugary, not tested but seems better than previous yard and he doesn't pile the weight on), no hard feed or supps.

Dilemma is that hacking as about to increase it in the next 2 weeks or so when the clocks change (doing more schooling on a surface atm, only hacking max twice a week currently) and I don't want him to be limited as he needs to be fit for OH to XC/ODE/SJ/hunt rides etc so I am not sure what to do? Do I try shoes, knowing he isn't too careful when SJ with his fronts and that boots might hinder, start feeding a supplement? Changing to hay not poss as haylage only supplied by livery yard. Current thinking is a set of front boots but will they stop the hooves growing as much as they do now?

All ideas welcome, thanks

 

[claribella]

I would definitely get some hoof boots and put them on some of the time until the growth can keep up. You sound a bit like me. I ride less in the winter and so much more in the summer so the hoof growth slows right down and then it needs to realise that you are doing more in the summer and needs time to catch up. I can recommend the equine fusions. They are brilliant. We live on Dartmoor so ddo all sorts of terrain at all paces and they always stay on, she never trips, they never twist or rub. They are quite forgiving in fit too. I got mine second han from bitless and barefoot.com.

Id definitely try taking off the haylage and dputting onto hay just because some horses are sugar sensitive and even a small amount of haylage each day can really play havoc. Its worth a try.

My girl has been a little footy lately but the wet weather doesn't help and if you've no hard standing then its really hard. Id also treat for thrush because even just a small amount can play havoc with their feet. I buy the stuff from aromesse which works well. Sitting in all that wet, it wouldn't surprise me if there is some thrush in there.

Hope you manage to get things sorted.

 

[Poo Picker]

Agree with Claribella, invest in some hoofboots. Our TB cross has been barefoot for 18months his diet is good and he happily works all summer barefoot over all terrain and competes. But he always struggles a bit in the spring when ground has been wet and we are increasing his work. So we usually alternate with boots then BF until his feet catch up.

 

[leflynn]

He has been footy about 3 days this winter/spring so far, more just concerned that hoofboots might impeded any future hoof growth and whats the best course to improve hoof growth/speed?

 

[cptrayes]

If he is sound, why are you concerned that his feet are short?

 

[leflynn]

As when he does a lot of hacking/roadwork and his feet become 'short' he becomes footy

 

[CBFan]

Agree with cptrayes but boots will help the transition between different types of work if you feel he really needs them. If you don't fancy him wearing them for jumping just put them on for hacking a few times a week but also make sure he works without them - maybe do alternate days with / without boots?

 

[tallyho!]

Get boots if concerned but first, how do you know they are wearing down? It's difficult to imagine anyone could do enough work for a horses hooves to wear down to the bone. I'm not sure I've ever heard this happen. They will get shorter but that could also be that the sole is thickening and the pedal bone is actually higher in the hoof capsule that makes hooves look short.

Unless horse is lame then I would just get on with it. The hoof will match wear no matter what but it's sometimes our eyes that need time to adjust to "short" feet.

 

[Gloi]

I just boot for longer rides and then things are fine. If I don't, I end up with his hooves worn so short he starts to get footy. In an ideal world the hoof growth will match wear but it doesn't always work that way for all horses.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

One of my liveries has been bare foot to date 3 1/2 years but has gone footy recently and between the owner and vet they are shoeing in front now after she trod on a flint and caused an abscess to brew, she is now on dry poultices.

Sadly some have to revert to shoes if barefoot start to cause issues with the sole of hoof.

 

[tallyho!]

It's true, horses are not the same. Different areas, different circumstances etc I think you just have to be pragmatic and wear boots if you want to keep bf or put shoes on. Your call.

As an aside, sorry to hear about abscesses. Dealt with quite a few with my filly!! Not sure if stone related... something else perhaps. But shoes do not protect from stone bruises so you must not advertise that shoes are put back for that reason as its false. Shoes have an important purpose and I think horses who need them should have them but it does not protect the sole. Only hoof boots protect the sole...

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

But shoes do not protect from stone bruises so you must not advertise that shoes are put back for that reason as its false. Shoes have an important purpose and I think horses who need them should have them but it does not protect the sole. Only hoof boots protect the sole...

they just raise the sole up off the gravel slightly which lessens the impact of stones on the sole..

Thus weight baring is great on the shoe and frog area thus if the horse does inadvertently tread on a stone the weight of the horse is less on the sole area so less bruising.

A bare horse does have a shorter stride on many occasions than a shod one.Protecting themselves from damage

 

[ester]

bare horses do usually step off the stone quicker though so are less prone to bruising..

Can't otherwise help though OP I've taken trims down to 8 weeks but can't keep up with his growth completely doing about 20 miles a week hacking (probs half that on roads ish!)
I don't think hoofboots will impede growth - the foot is still being stimulated just not abraded at the same time. If you are happy to I would try booting a bit first and see how you get on. Is it poss that the odd day he is footy is after a particularly long ride? - this is posibly happening with my lad atm. Or he could do every other day in boots?

 

[Kat]

I currently boot for longer hacks or rough terrain but my horse is fine doing a 2hr hack on roads, she just can't do it two days running which at this time of year is the only way I can ride.....

Typically at the moment we ride bare on a surface Monday to Friday and hack bare Saturday then boot Sunday. She will do more bare when it is lighter at night and I can hack in the week.

 

[Leg_end]

As far as I see it you have a few options. Some will take dedication and commitment from you and some will be easy.

Option one
Shoe it

Option Two
Boot it

Option three
Increase the work gradually so that the hoof grows in line with work (and stimulation). During this time I wouldn't trim either - let the horse do the hard work.

I'd also add a supplement to help speed things along. Pro Earth and Forage plus do some - I am currently moving to the equivita one.

Good luck.

 

[tallyho!]

they just raise the sole up off the gravel slightly which lessens the impact of stones on the sole..

Thus weight baring is great on the shoe and frog area thus if the horse does inadvertently tread on a stone the weight of the horse is less on the sole area so less bruising.

A bare horse does have a shorter stride on many occasions than a shod one.Protecting themselves from damage

Assuming all gravel is a uniform size. In an ideal world they would be I'm sure. However, having worked on a hunt yard, sadly this is far from the truth. They got abscesses too I'm afraid to say.

If shod well, yes the frog has contact with the ground and does weight bear. I wish all horses if they were shod were allowed to have this but not many farriers I have come across will sympathetically shoe so that the frog is in contact. If your farrier does then keep him!

 

[ester]

Option 3 is great in theory but doesn't always work though Leg_end as some are limited by other factors than just feeding.

TH I do think keeping heel height and keeping frog on the ground is a bit of a physical impossibility in shod horses I just can't see how it would work, even with F's huge hind frogs!

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

I think it is essential to supplement all year round, this will improve hoof quality and growth rates.
I surprised it has hardly been mentioned.
Magnesium, pro hoof / pro balance, micronised linseed, some salt.
By chance and also by design I have always had world class farriers, and the frog does not impact on the ground, it is impossible, the shoe raises the hoof half an inch.
As there is a current problem I would buy pro hoof.
The horse will not always have level feet, if conformation is irregular, with 5 hours roadwork [tarmac], I would not expect to trim. Some farriers are keen on frog trimming even with barefoot horses.......... totally contra indicated in my opinion.

Check out Rockley Farm.All sorts of feet there, and they are there because they are vet referrals.

 

[Leg_end]

Option 3 is great in theory but doesn't always work though Leg_end as some are limited by other factors than just feeding.

Totally aware of that Ester but OP is asking for advice and stated that they want to up the work from 2 days a week hacking to 5 days a week and they don't feed a supplement. Changing a couple of easy things could make their lives much easier, it doesn't have to be complicated.

Of course, if this doesn't work then there are other things to think about but better to start with the easiest options and work up from there IMO. But everyone is different

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Totally aware of that Ester but OP is asking for advice and stated that they want to up the work from 2 days a week hacking to 5 days a week and they don't feed a supplement. Changing a couple of easy things could make their lives much easier, it doesn't have to be complicated.

Of course, if this doesn't work then there are other things to think about but better to start with the easiest options and work up from there IMO. But everyone is different

But I think the problem is that they don't feed a supplement.
Before I supplemented all year round [ok half in summer], I thought his coat colour was bright bay in summer, but after supplementing he kept his natural dark colour. This was what convinced me, also the linseed stopped his itchy coat, and no mud fever.
The horses being footy and needing trimming due to imbalance could be due to lack of growth as OP suggests, it could be that the horses are self balancing and trimming is making them worse ......... I mean are they footsore after trimming. My boy had one slight twist and I could feel it for two / three days when the farrier made his feet "perfect"
I know I managed my horses' exercise regime for barefoot but never ever had him footsore on tarmac.
It is not essential to move straight from 2 hours to 5 hours in a week, but the immediate problem is that they are not coping with 2 hours.

 

[leflynn]

As far as I see it you have a few options. Some will take dedication and commitment from you and some will be easy.

Option one
Shoe it

Option Two
Boot it

Option three
Increase the work gradually so that the hoof grows in line with work (and stimulation). During this time I wouldn't trim either - let the horse do the hard work.

I'd also add a supplement to help speed things along. Pro Earth and Forage plus do some - I am currently moving to the equivita one.

Good luck.

Trying to avoid option 1 if poss!

Option 2 looks most likely

Option 3 can't not trim as his hoof balance seems to go uneven and he ends up looking a bit pidgeon toed, might consider a supplement anyway for longer term

Thanks for comments so far

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Trying to avoid option 1 if poss!

Option 2 looks most likely

Option 3 can't not trim as his hoof balance seems to go uneven and he ends up looking a bit pidgeon toed, might consider a supplement anyway for longer term

Thanks for comments so far

Yes fair enough, re the looks of the feet, it is disturbing to the owner, but is it more disturbing to the horse to have them trimmed?
as I say have a look on Rockley and follow some of the horse blogs, over three months.
http://rockleyfarm.blogspot.co.uk/search?q=+pigeon+toed
This would have me fitting on the spot, but if the horse is sound...........

 

[ester]

Ah I missed the supplement bit, I def would OP.
I currently use equimins advanced complete pellets (which he snaffles up without anything else) after trimmer did some analysis of a few options for me.
F needs trimming for a similar reason, he lands laterally a bit still and therefore wears the outside down much quicker - it does seem to eventually be a bit self limiting but it doesn't help his landing to leave it and it isn't supportive flare/growth.

 

[leflynn]

Horse not bothered about trims, normally goes to sleep! Appreciate what you are saying re the look of his feet and tbh they are in better condition than those shown, my concern with him going a little pidgeon toed when he wears them is his joints, he only gets trimmed once every 10 weeks or so as thats all he seems to need as he self trims while hacking

He isn't footsore on hacks of 60 mins+ I'm just looking to the future when this increases and based on his responses from the end of last years hacking

 

[leflynn]

Ah I missed the supplement bit, I def would OP.
I currently use equimins advanced complete pellets (which he snaffles up without anything else) after trimmer did some analysis of a few options for me.
F needs trimming for a similar reason, he lands laterally a bit still and therefore wears the outside down much quicker - it does seem to eventually be a bit self limiting but it doesn't help his landing to leave it and it isn't supportive flare/growth.

I did try benevit advanced when we first got him but it made no difference to be honest so stopped it, I buy other equimins products so might try that instead, the other obv choice is Pro Hoof, thanks good to know someone else have the same hoof look! He deosn't ever seem to get any flare, it's just worn down, thats when the trim happens when I think it's about to be restrictive! Other horse has shoes as refused to budge with hoof boots/barefoot despite having rock solid feet so still learning!

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Horse not bothered about trims, normally goes to sleep! Appreciate what you are saying re the look of his feet and tbh they are in better condition than those shown, my concern with him going a little pidgeon toed when he wears them is his joints, he only gets trimmed once every 10 weeks or so as thats all he seems to need as he self trims while hacking

He isn't footsore on hacks of 60 mins+ I'm just looking to the future when this increases and based on his responses from the end of last years hacking

If he is not footsore hacking out after the trimming is what I meant.
The problem is that in a mature horse there is not a lot one can do, the angle of the hoofs reflects the conformation above.
I think it would take an expert in these matters to advise, but there is nothing to stop you discussing it with your farrier and vet if experienced, and of good judgement.

 

[tallyho!]

Well shod horses frogs do come into contact with the ground. I've seen it with my very own eyes!! (Should have asked for farriers number!!) but majority don't. Hence why atrophy is so common.

 

[serenityjane]

Horse not bothered about trims, normally goes to sleep! Appreciate what you are saying re the look of his feet and tbh they are in better condition than those shown, my concern with him going a little pidgeon toed when he wears them is his joints, he only gets trimmed once every 10 weeks or so as thats all he seems to need as he self trims while hacking

He isn't footsore on hacks of 60 mins+ I'm just looking to the future when this increases and based on his responses from the end of last years hacking

I had similar problems with my four year old, she was sound on any surface but had worn her feet very short unevenly which was effecting her conformation and body use further up. To maintain her straight form and conformation as well as exercise her (we have mainly roads locally) as much as I wanted, I decided to shoe. She had been bare all her life and her feet could not be better and I have had barefoot horses for 8 years.
Her feet shod are exactly the same as they were bare, they just have a protective covering to prevent uneven wear. Her frogs are still large and in ground contact and her hoof wall is thick and in excellent form.
People will say the wear is a result of the conformation but I saw a distinct change in her conformation after she was brought into barefoot work ie wear.
You could of course alternatively use boots, if you can find some that fit, do not rub, and you could trust them on all surfaces at all gaits.

 

[MrsNorris]

Hooves can certainly wear faster than they grow, this happens regularly to my cob duing the winter months.
Hooves are softer because of the wet so they wear more than hard, dry hooves, and they grow slower in winter anyway. He occasionally gets a bit footy, it has been confirmed by a well-respected EP that its because he's a bit short. He has naturally fairly flat fronts (draught blood, we think), so does feel the stones when this happens.

He's on supplements all year round, low sugar diet etc, etc

I just boot when needed for hacking, within a week or 2, growth catches up and we're good to go again. It doesn't happen in the summer when growth is faster and wear slower.

 

[sarahann1]

Trying to avoid option 1 if poss!

Option 2 looks most likely

Option 3 can't not trim as his hoof balance seems to go uneven and he ends up looking a bit pidgeon toed, might consider a supplement anyway for longer term

Thanks for comments so far

From my own experience with my own horse only, I had a farrier who tried to shoe out my wee lads natural pigeoned toe stance, it ended in tears, he's now barefoot, a bit wonky looking but so much better re lameness etc. Its not always a bad thing for a horse to be allowed to revert to their natural conformation.