BHS gold membership insurance question

Rudders74 said:
Having been exposed to the unfortunate situation of having to make a claim on BHS public liability insurance after previous horse spooked and bolted through a village I now know an awful lot about the process and its not good news im afraid. In order for the person/property your horse has damaged, to be recompensed, you must be found negligent. I wasnt as my horse was tethered properly and I was a few metres away, it was an unforseeable event so the insurance wouldnt pay the chap whose car got clipped. If I had left my horse untethered in the street whilst I got drunk I would have been found negligent and the insurance would have paid out. Its weird but I suppose if you think about he scenario of two cars having an accident, one party is always at fault (negligent) in some way, which determines whose insurance pays out. The large majority of events I can think of where horses may cause damage wont involve negligence in a lot of cases ie you fall off and it bolts causing an RTA or escape out of a seemingly secure paddock etc. I built up a large file of information and evidence of past case history etc with help from an industy expert, not because my claim was large, it was relatively minor really, I just couldnt take it in that what we all think is there to protect us really isnt. It all left me feeling rather exposed....
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But if you were not at fault, or negligent, no insurance company would have paid the car owner, because if he had taken you to court, the court would not have found in his favour. You were not exposed.
 
Pearlsasinger said:
But if you were not at fault, or negligent, no insurance company would have paid the car owner, because if he had taken you to court, the court would not have found in his favour. You were not exposed.
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I agree, but I felt bad as I like many people thought my insurance would put this right for him, as he was an innocent party in the wrong place at the wrong time. I think there's just a lot of misconception by many people (including me prevously!) about public liability insurance covering them in these unforunate situations.
 
They paid out when my young horse kicked a brand new merc with some one else him, no questions asked. Was very very pleased with the service.
 
I get so scared when.people say they stop the insurance for vets fees and just put money away each month.
If I did that for my five I still wouldn't be able to have afforded the tbs two claims in a year, one for his ulcers £4000 and one for his leg injury £4000 plus £2000 on a credit card.
 
Hi all - this is an interesting thread. Regarding the issue with public liability insurance, I would assume that the same factors would apply whether through BHS gold or through a packaged policy with an insurance provider, ie if you aren't found to have been at fault then there would be no payout to anyone involved anyway. Although I know what you mean, I suppose we assume that often with horse related accidents we as the owner / rider would usually be found negligent but it looks like that isn't necessarily the case.
I think I am going to go through my insurance first with NFU and see where I can rehash to get a better quote, including removing the public liability / personal accident (around £80 per policy), and taking out the BHS Gold to cover this for all three instead. I'm going to also get some quotes from different companies and see what the difference is and take it from there.
I still like the idea of putting money away rather than paying top whack for vets fees, but I must admit I am a bit worried about this as it will take quite a while to build up an equivalent amount to what you can claim off the insurance.
 
I put money away each month, i also own 3. 2 jump to a decent level and the other is only rising 4, but will hopefully be my main horse in the future. For the horror stories i read about insurance companies not paying out (which does seem more often than not, or maybe people just don't report the 'good') i personally have paid insurance for years and never used it. Purchasing my 3rd horse was the deal breaker for me for me to start putting money away. As cruel as it does sound, if their was a high chance the horse wouldn't come right even after surgery, i would choose to PTS anyway. As mean as it sounds, i couldn't afford something that wasn't doing it's 'job' for me, and they're more than enough not-right horses that get sold on and passed around it just wouldn't benefit me to attempt to bring them right.
 
ljohnsonsj said:
I put money away each month, i also own 3. 2 jump to a decent level and the other is only rising 4, but will hopefully be my main horse in the future. For the horror stories i read about insurance companies not paying out (which does seem more often than not, or maybe people just don't report the 'good') i personally have paid insurance for years and never used it. Purchasing my 3rd horse was the deal breaker for me for me to start putting money away. As cruel as it does sound, if their was a high chance the horse wouldn't come right even after surgery, i would choose to PTS anyway. As mean as it sounds, i couldn't afford something that wasn't doing it's 'job' for me, and they're more than enough not-right horses that get sold on and passed around it just wouldn't benefit me to attempt to bring them right.
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It depends on what sits right with you, in your gut doesn't it. My old mare is insured and I've had more back from insurance in the last 18 months than I've spent out. TBH I'd rather not have needed it ;) but I'd never have been able to save enough cash to have the peace of mind that she is covered.
But she's a pet as much as a riding horse, and she will stay with me forever.
My other horse came as a project and I have much the same feeling about her as you have described above. If something terrible happened to her I would have no option but pts.

But the public liability is another topic. I have to have cover for that as my old mare is from HAPPA and it's specified in the loan agreement.

(FWIW, I am pleased the BHS bods pop up on these topics... I'm not a member so would not phone the office to ask these questions, so it is nice to have the answers served up on HHO instead ;))
 
Following with interest after NFU hiked my policy up to £85/month and are about to loose a customer who has been with them 11 years!
 
milliepops said:
It depends on what sits right with you, in your gut doesn't it. My old mare is insured and I've had more back from insurance in the last 18 months than I've spent out. TBH I'd rather not have needed it ;) but I'd never have been able to save enough cash to have the peace of mind that she is covered.
But she's a pet as much as a riding horse, and she will stay with me forever.
My other horse came as a project and I have much the same feeling about her as you have described above. If something terrible happened to her I would have no option but pts.

But the public liability is another topic. I have to have cover for that as my old mare is from HAPPA and it's specified in the loan agreement.

(FWIW, I am pleased the BHS bods pop up on these topics... I'm not a member so would not phone the office to ask these questions, so it is nice to have the answers served up on HHO instead ;))
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Oh yes definatley! The situation i explained is just what i would do- not what i expect everyone should do! Also i must add, the scenerio i explained is what i should do, thinking with my head. But i'm sure if something was to happen i would very much struggle to separate my head from my heart :) I do have Public liabilty, cover of death,theft and straying and BHS gold membership, although i never actually knew what it all covered until i've read this thread. :)
 
Alchemy said:
Following with interest after NFU hiked my policy up to £85/month and are about to loose a customer who has been with them 11 years!
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Blooming heck! I'm with Scottish equestrian and mine are £28 per month for full works, vets up to £4000, excess £150 (one off) and have always paid out even when the Tb had two claims right after another and the tank had twp going for to different problems.
I've just got a loss of horse settlement off them as well no problem.
 
Bonkers2 said:
Hypothetically could one not claim that anyone riding a horse and not being able to stay on board was negligent in taking it out on a public road where it might get spooked?
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No and I for one am thankful. That would mean horse owners essentially being persecuted for owning or riding a horse. We would all end up paying horrendous costs for insurance if it had to cover us for not being negligent, or if the act of being in charge of a horse was to be considered negligence. Nobody however good a rider or handler can ever claim to have total control over an animal which is stronger than them and with its own brain.

My horse who I have owned for years spooked, at an everyday item he had seen hundreds of times before with no fear. By spooked I mean he stopped suddenly, transferred most weight to his hind end and went to spin to face the other way. Part way round the spin his hind legs gave way because he slipped on a smooth patch of tarmac. He fell. As a good rider I stayed on, but when he rolled over and got back up I was left injured on the floor and he was loose. Had he damaged someone elses property as he ran home without me I would not have been happy to have been considered negligent for riding him.

People need to lose the attitude that they deserve to be compensated for accidental damage and instead insure their own goods, or themselves, against accidental damage if they want to.
 
BlueSocks said:
Hi all - this is an interesting thread. Regarding the issue with public liability insurance, I would assume that the same factors would apply whether through BHS gold or through a packaged policy with an insurance provider, ie if you aren't found to have been at fault then there would be no payout to anyone involved anyway. Although I know what you mean, I suppose we assume that often with horse related accidents we as the owner / rider would usually be found negligent but it looks like that isn't necessarily the case.
I think I am going to go through my insurance first with NFU and see where I can rehash to get a better quote, including removing the public liability / personal accident (around £80 per policy), and taking out the BHS Gold to cover this for all three instead. I'm going to also get some quotes from different companies and see what the difference is and take it from there.
I still like the idea of putting money away rather than paying top whack for vets fees, but I must admit I am a bit worried about this as it will take quite a while to build up an equivalent amount to what you can claim off the insurance.
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I've done this with my two ageing boys (well one's a share horse, but I paid insurance for him as his owner - my best friend - wasn't a fan but I would hate to have had an accident with him or have him injured as a result of me riding him and not to be able to help put things right and for that to come between us.) Once they hit 17 cover was for accicents only so now, instead of paying insurance I put the amount I paid in insurance into a savings avount every month. After 2 years we're already up to nearly £3k. (There was a bit in the account to start it off). If it comes to more than that it'll be something pretty serious so at their age, I doubt we'd put them through invasive treatment.
You could do both for a year so you have a bit of a fund before stopping the insurance, or there's always credit cards which offer 0% on purchases for as much as year now!
 
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People need to lose the attitude that they deserve to be compensated for accidental damage and instead insure their own goods, or themselves, against accidental damage if they want to.[/QUOTE]

This is the interesting bit and quite correct. The chap whose car my horse clipped refused to claim on his own car insurance and in light of the non negligence on my part and refusal of my insurer to therefore pay, I was advised that his own insurance is exactly the route which should have been followed and the route the courts would have supported had it gone that way.
 
You are covered under the BHS Gold Member insurance, but for your horses and any damage they do to a "third party." But anyone riding them is not covered for personal accident, as someone found out recently. I won't go into details, but the rider was injured enough to be off work. So a sharer will need their own insurance.

However, the negilgent thing applies to everyone. I knew of an incident where a girl was driving along a lane and a cow jumped out over the hedge and landed on her car and wrote off the car and injured the driver, but the farmer was not liable as it wasn't his fault. Whether that still applies under the "strict liability" rules I wouldn't know.
 
Bonkers2 said:
Is Mr Ben the old guy with a shop, and Bagpuss in the window, nowadays that would probably not be P.C.
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Bagpuss had his own TV show. He was an old fat furry catpuss He had some mice and a woodpecker for company, amongst others.

Mr Benn lived at 52 Festive Road and liked to visit the fancy dress shop. It was the shop keeper who would appear, as if by magic, at the end of Mr Benn's adventures. My favourite was the cave man episode with the dinosaur rush hour :)
 
I'm a BHS Gold member and my horses are insured with Pet Plan. Pet Plan removed all of the things from my policy which were covered (to a decent level) by my BHS one. Brought the cost down considerably.

The only issue I have had is that my son is only 4 1/2 and the only way to get him personal accident cover (more in case I have to take time off work to look after him) was to join the Pony Club (which we will do if he gets keen, but it was a bit expensive for pottering around on our temporary loan pony for the winter) or take out a stand alone policy. None of the equestrian insurers are prepared to cover under 6's either riding or handling ponies. I went for the stand alone policy as it covers him for any accident e.g. falling off his bike, or breaking his arm in PE at school, it wasn't expensive, but was a pain to take out yet another policy.
 
Slightyly confused, my boy used to be insured - then he had some claims (2 biggies and one around 1000 pund mark but of course he gained exclusions and the price hiked up and he became a veteran.
You also have a excess that you have to pay wether you like it or not.
I cancelled my insurance and put the money into a savings account. Only £50 per month - as he wasn't insured for permenant loss of use and only for £1000. judging by what others are saying it should be considerably more than £50 per month.
He has has some vet visits, but I just paid for them - nothing hideously expensive £200 maximum, he has a nice lump in his account now - and has even lent me some on occassion - I do pay him back, but he has saved me from paying interest on car insurance etc. If he had something terrible happen I would not try any heroics, but he does not go short on any vet treatments and it leave me in full control of his veterinary care. If desperate I would use my credit card and then transfer to a 0% deal when it came up.
I do also have BHS gold insurance, probably also have some cover with the riding club I am a member of.
 
I used to insure my horses but, having not had any claims for about 8 years decided to 'save' the money instead and did so for a couple of years. I can't remember why but about three years ago I decided I'd rather insure them, I think a friend had a large vet bill and that made me think. In 2013 one of my horses incurred vets fees of c. £9,000, for two different incidents. He has, I think, had his money's worth out of his insurance policy. He's still insured (with exclusions) and having faced those bills (believing I'd have to pay the colic one when making a life or death decision) I'd never not insure again.

I'm a BHS Gold Member for the third party insurance to save a bit on the individual policies and fortunately I've never paid much for a horse and never upgrade their value as I'm not bothered about loss of use or replacement costs so that helps to keep the costs down and they're all insured for the least I possibly can. Having said that, the one I bought for £1 had to have a minimum value of a few hundred I think, which was a bit weird.
 
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