Blue Hors Withdrawing From Dressage??

There are some cynics (realists?) out there suggesting that the reflection this is going to be a period of revolves around thinking up new ways to hide what's going on. But yes Lego do have a certain image to uphold and 'horse torturer' isn't a part of that.

ETA I'm not often grateful for tabloid newspapers but they do seem to be pretty hot on animal welfare stuff quite often. You've got to wonder how editors of broadsheets think *their* readers view animal welfare topics? Are the broadsheet readers too grown-up, serious and utilitarian for all that fluffy stuff?
 
I hadn’t realise that Blue Hors was backed by the Lego lot. Go them. Will be forwarding this on to Lego mad son. All the Lego people I’ve met have been kind hearted and good people, albeit somewhat bonkers.

More on this in H&H mag.

www.horseandhound.co.uk

Top stud to withdraw their horses from dressage competitions amid welfare reforms

Blue Hors has announced the temporary withdrawal of its horses from competition as Denmark develops new horse welfare guidelines.
www.horseandhound.co.uk www.horseandhound.co.uk
 
As long as there is so much ambiguity as to what the correct ethical use of horses is

Why on earth would anyone come out with this unless they were at best, sceptical about their own methods of training? I genuinely can not think of a single reason. These horses are money makers for these people, there's no way they would stop business unless there would be a serious backlash for them.
 
tristars said:
I think it's a wise thing to step back sometimes and look at where you are with training and evolution of what is acceptable as times change
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Deleting - think my comment could be misconstrued/potentially libellous, which is wasn't intended to be - it was merely intended for discussion :)
 
sbloom said:
Dropped back, poorly/incorrectly muscled neck and hindquarters, the signs are always there.
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Not to mention the constantly wringing tail (before they'd worked out how to stop that, clearly; I remember that was a real feature of her tests but barely remarked upon at the time bar a few bunny huggers), tented eye and extended upper lip.

I have a theory (and it's just that, I would have to go and look for evidence which I may do when I have a bit of time) that horses ridden mostly in hyperflexion point their ears forward to compensate for the lack of vision in that direction. It would be convenient, since so many dressage groupies are insistent that pricked ears = happy horse.
 
AShetlandBitMeOnce said:
In the interests of learning, what is incorrect muscling wise about her neck?
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annotated blue hors matine.jpg

1. Broken at C2-3, overdeveloped in upper neck, a compensation for working out of balance while compressed in the hand. That big diagonal shadow is incorrect, the neck should be more filled out at the base and no obvious bulge anywhere else. The crest of the neck should show an even curve and the poll the highest point
2. Squidged parotids, result of same
3. Dropped behind saddle, while in maxiumum collection where the push up from behind should lift all the way into the thoracic sling
4. Left hip looks very dropped instead of stable, irregular muscling, though as this is in movement it's harder to assess. HQs should have smooth muscling and topline.
5. Left hind joints not compressed instead swinging the leg forward, more evidence of the dropped hip
6. Dropping in the fetlocks, the horse unable to stabilise itself higher up so the fetlocks take the strain. Probably sign of hypermobility, again not stabilised through training.

I couldn't watch her and was quite upset at all the people lauding her performances, even before my saddle fit adjacent training I could see it was horribly incorrect, though I do understand that the flash appeals to people, and she had that floppy softness too...though of course that's in big part related to the musculo-skeletal instability.

ycbm said:
Do the rules still say that the poll should be the highest point in the neck? They never seem to be marked down when it isn't, and it very often (usually? ) isn't.
.
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They do, it's laughable.

Burnttoast said:
To me it looks like hypertrophy of the brachiocephalicus (sp?) as compensation for little hind limb activity while also being required to lift the forearm above the horizontal.
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Yep, though I like expressing it as the compensation for a horse falling forward, especially when asked to be round ie ridden in some degree of compression. The horse cannot control its pelvis and flex its hind joints to decelerate so continues to fall forward in movement and has to use anything it can to try and stop those forces. Underneck, lats, triceps all commonly used.
 
sbloom said:
View attachment 156374

1. Broken at C2-3, overdeveloped in upper neck, a compensation for working out of balance while compressed in the hand. That big diagonal shadow is incorrect, the neck should be more filled out at the base and no obvious bulge anywhere else. The crest of the neck should show an even curve and the poll the highest point
2. Squidged parotids, result of same
3. Dropped behind saddle, while in maxiumum collection where the push up from behind should lift all the way into the thoracic sling
4. Left hip looks very dropped instead of stable, irregular muscling, though as this is in movement it's harder to assess. HQs should have smooth muscling and topline.
5. Left hind joints not compressed instead swinging the leg forward, more evidence of the dropped hip
6. Dropping in the fetlocks, the horse unable to stabilise itself higher up so the fetlocks take the strain. Probably sign of hypermobility, again not stabilised through training.

I couldn't watch her and was quite upset at all the people lauding her performances, even before my saddle fit adjacent training I could see it was horribly incorrect, though I do understand that the flash appeals to people, and she had that floppy softness too...though of course that's in big part related to the musculo-skeletal instability.



They do, it's laughable.



Yep, though I like expressing it as the compensation for a horse falling forward, especially when asked to be round ie ridden in some degree of compression. The horse cannot control its pelvis and flex its hind joints to decelerate so continues to fall forward in movement and has to use anything it can to try and stop those forces. Underneck, lats, triceps all commonly used.
Click to expand...
Thank you, it's good to have it explained in more detail
 
sbloom said:
Well, my interpretation of it, I'm sure some would disagree but I'd argue they've drunk the koolaid.
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Well .... it all sounds plausible to me looking at all those things and thinking none of them look correct! The overall impression of these horses is (in the collected movements most obviously) that they are lumbering. It all looks *enormously* effortful. Because it is. No balance, so brute force is needed.
 
Burnttoast said:
Well .... it all sounds plausible to me looking at all those things and thinking none of them look correct! The overall impression of these horses is (in the collected movements most obviously) that they are lumbering. It all looks *enormously* effortful. Because it is. No balance, so brute force is needed.
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Yes it either looks like a huge effort, or we see clockwork legs, with no ground force recoil, no flow through the body, and no soft back. It makes me laugh that these horses, by definition, must be seen as being "over the back" as they wouldn't win otherwise. Just shows.
 
More reporting in Danish press - MSJ Freestyle's tongue again - apparently since elite human athletes get blue lips because of all the oxygen in their blood it's all fine.

ekstrabladet.dk

Bekymret over OL-stjernens hest

Læs mere her
ekstrabladet.dk ekstrabladet.dk
Translate button second from right in address bar if required.

I used to be a runner and I've had the blue lips thing - it's a sign of over-exertion and peripheral vascular shutdown (and certainly not limited to elite athletes, I wish!). It's not a sign of more oxygenation, as claimed in the article. And obviously not the cause here, since the other oral tissues are normally perfused.
 
sbloom said:
View attachment 156374

1. Broken at C2-3, overdeveloped in upper neck, a compensation for working out of balance while compressed in the hand. That big diagonal shadow is incorrect, the neck should be more filled out at the base and no obvious bulge anywhere else. The crest of the neck should show an even curve and the poll the highest point
2. Squidged parotids, result of same
3. Dropped behind saddle, while in maxiumum collection where the push up from behind should lift all the way into the thoracic sling
4. Left hip looks very dropped instead of stable, irregular muscling, though as this is in movement it's harder to assess. HQs should have smooth muscling and topline.
5. Left hind joints not compressed instead swinging the leg forward, more evidence of the dropped hip
6. Dropping in the fetlocks, the horse unable to stabilise itself higher up so the fetlocks take the strain. Probably sign of hypermobility, again not stabilised through training.

I couldn't watch her and was quite upset at all the people lauding her performances, even before my saddle fit adjacent training I could see it was horribly incorrect, though I do understand that the flash appeals to people, and she had that floppy softness too...though of course that's in big part related to the musculo-skeletal instability.
Click to expand...

Wow, thank you for going into so much detail, really useful! It's interesting to look at the points you have made in comparison to someone like Becky Moody below

1741870540770.png
 
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