Bought unseen problems returning

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criso said:
If the only option the OP wants to pursue is sending the horse back, then they need to a solicitor not us and prepare for an expensive battle with no guarantee of money at the end.
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I don't think we could have made it clearer that it's going to be a painful situation and no one here would pursue it.

I also don't understand that energy and money could be spent on that course but not on training the pony. But I guess that's choice again.
 
LadyGascoyne said:
I don't think we could have made it clearer that it's going to be a painful situation and no one here would pursue it.

I also don't understand that energy and money could be spent on that course but not on training the pony. But I guess that's choice again.
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I don't think OP accepts that she can send the horse back very easily but won't see any money, even though the dealer has made that clear and not one poster on here has suggested that she might.
The simple answer to OP's question is 'you can't '.
The problem is that HHOers consider the horse to be the victim in this deal, while OP thinks that role is hers alone.
 
poiuytrewq said:
Wow, I read through this yesterday morning I think and it’s over doubled in pages!
What’s going on? Can someone summarise please?
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Woman buys cob unseen.

Doesn’t like cob which is obviously stressed as doesn’t know whether it’s coming or going.

Woman wants money back.

Dealer offers exchange. (Think I’ve got that right.)

Loads of excellent advice - largely rejected.

Even offers by Hho-ers to buy cob off her.

YO apparently won’t let anyone on yard to help her.

Told she is unlikely to get a penny back even if court finds in her favour, which doesn’t seem a forgone conclusion.

Insists she wants to take him to court (dealer not cob) “to save others”.

Woman flounces.

The End

I think that’s basically it but who knows? My attention did start to wander.
 
poiuytrewq said:
Wow, I read through this yesterday morning I think and it’s over doubled in pages!
What’s going on? Can someone summarise please?
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I have followed it right through but I also have no idea :D

however the bits that stick out for me are she seems to have relied on the YO to check him out via pics and video. YO thought he looked nice, apparently he wasn't nice and so she was let down by the YO. It seems there has to be someone either the YO or the horse to blame. If suitability was so important why not pay the YO to check him out in person with a visit.

She had had a horse before so she obviously had experience of both horse keeping and riding. The previous horse only got one mention so I wonder about that. Many people would have talked more about their earlier horse and what they had done with it.

Ozzie was apparently upset when he arrived. He had gone through a Welsh sale, moved to the dealers yard, been safely ridden by the dealer's girl and per the pics didn't seem that upset or uncontrollable. All in little over 24 hours but a move to Bradford and he was uncontrollable.

The YO's who apparently run a riding school don't seem to have explained a new horse can get very upset when moving home so he will need time.
Ozzine pinned his ears back and didn't welcome his new owner with open arms. The YO didn't seem to explain she needed to get a relationship with the horse, how to approach him, deal with him etc.

The YO got towed around at the vetting. Odd that a professional couldn't put a bridle on and control a new horse.
Friends of any sort are forbidden at the yard so no one who offered was able to help or even look at Ozzie or even help OP go safely into the stable.

OP rode Ozizie but forgot to mention it for a long time

OP doesn't seem willing to learn about horse behaviour and really wanted a bike from Amazon that would do precisely as it said on the tin. Amazon would take it back.

I would guess when Ozzie arrived OP took one look, didn't like him, wasn't willing to accept any poor behaviour, wanted rid and dealer wouldn't give her money back as he should have. A new horse should have done as it was told, been instantly rideable even with a scared rider and gone galloping off into the sunset.

There are now multiple offers for Ozzie, he is all over the internet and if I was the dealer I would take him back, refund, put a couple more thousand on the price and let people fight over him :D.

some people mentioned the school hols possibly because some remarks sound like a sulky teenager.

if OP has these personal problems possibly forgetting the horse and concentrating on riding lessons would be easier for her.
The YO's seem totally useless at helping her but do they have a hidden agenda

There are many offers for Ozzie on here but OP won't sell, doesn't want him and just wants to persecute the dealer. People don't agree with her, are trying to help but help is not accepted so she has left.

This is probably the most honest horse sale by the dealer.

The story changes daily.

That is my interpretation but others will see it differently.
Pearlsasinger said:
The problem is that HHOers consider the horse to be the victim in this deal, while OP thinks that role is hers alone.
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and this.
 
meggymoo said:
Woman buys cob unseen.

Doesn’t like cob which is obviously stressed as doesn’t know whether it’s coming or going.

Woman wants money back.

Dealer offers exchange. (Think I’ve got that right.)

Loads of excellent advice - largely rejected.

Even offers by Hho-ers to buy cob off her.

YO apparently won’t let anyone on yard to help her.

Told she is unlikely to get a penny back even if court finds in her favour, which doesn’t seem a forgone conclusion.

Insists she wants to take him to court (dealer not cob) “to save others”.

Woman flounces.

The End

I think that’s basically it but who knows? My attention did start to wander.
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very good MM. I forgot the "wants to save others" bit 🤣🤣
 
Threads here last a long time & other people in the same situation search for them, so regardless of OP leaving,( or even of school timings), some random thoughts...



Always do the research before buying. Make a punt then rely on getting your legal just deserts hardly ever goes well. Describing horses is a very grey area & even if you are definitely in the right you are very unlikely to see any money back and even less likely to change the world & teach them a lesson.

When people above talk about getting a vetting they mean before purchase, not after.

Be honest about your level of experience when asking for advice.

It's normal for a dealer to sell immediately, before really knowing anything at all about a horse. Often the videos you see of a child tacking up etc are from the previous home, or several homes ago.

Can't remember who mentioned this horse's age but it would be common for a cob to be broken to drive first of all, then broken to ride when older, so a green 8yo wouldn't be unusual. Edited, it was @Crazy_cat_lady , sorry CCL.

Settling horses into a new home has been mentioned a lot above so I wont labor the point but just to add the exact arrangements & routine would be important too. For example, in his previous home this horse has been in an open stall in a barn, with air above him & other horses visible in all directions so putting him in an individual stable is only giving him an extra settling-in hurdle.


If you are reading this and in a bad place mentally &/or financially the last thing to do is to buy a sentient being to prop you up by giving you love. They need to take love from you especially to begin with. You need to be feeling strong- you will be there to prop them up not vise versa.
Buying a new animal is stressful, and often doesn't go smoothly straight away.
If you are feeling a bit vulnerable please go to a riding school, Riding for Disabled, maybe set up a part share or arrange to spend time around other people's horses.
 
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paddy555 said:
very good MM. I forgot the "wants to save others" bit 🤣🤣
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With all the good will in the world, no one is going to save others from dodgy dealers, I have no personal experience of them but they seem to be a law unto themselves and above justice.
With the ops several mentions of her MH issues I would have thought it a good idea to just step back from that, take up one of the kind Hho-ers offers to buy the poor animal and try and accept what’s done is done and chalk it down to experience.
 
paddy555 said:
The YO's who apparently run a riding school don't seem to have explained a new horse can get very upset when moving home so he will need time.
Ozzine pinned his ears back and didn't welcome his new owner with open arms. The YO didn't seem to explain she needed to get a relationship with the horse, how to approach him, deal with him etc.

The YO got towed around at the vetting. Odd that a professional couldn't put a bridle on and control a new horse.
Friends of any sort are forbidden at the yard so no one who offered was able to help or even look at Ozzie or even help OP go safely into the stable.
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This is the bit that I find most baffling.
Surely any YO/manager, riding instructor etc is going to be very familiar with common issues relating to horses settling in?

When we kept our horse on a livery yard it was incredibly common for new horses to be stressed and unsettled...everyone knew this.
Most settled down pretty soon after having turnout with the others, familiarising themselves with the herd and getting into a routine.
A few took a bit longer but got there in the end.
My riding instructor, who also had a livery yard on the premises, was constantly giving support, advice and guidance to her liveries when a new horse moved on.
She would also have advised strongly against buying unseen and would have been very honest about the prospect of return and refund.
Having said that, her priority would have been to find a way forward. She would certainly have allowed friends/other professionals on the yard.

I find this side of it quite strange really.

ETA - even though the horse was so bargy and uncontrollable at the vetting, somebody thought it was OK to put a wheelbarrow across the door when mucking out...
 
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meggymoo said:
Me too, his welfare should be her first priority.
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She says he will be looked after so perhaps this means that he's staying on his current yard. Maybe not a bad thing, in spite of my post questioning the YO's apparent attitude.
The main thing is that he shouldn't go back to the dealer (and there is no reason he should).
 
Nancykitt said:
She says he will be looked after so perhaps this means that he's staying on his current yard. Maybe not a bad thing, in spite of my post questioning the YO's apparent attitude.
The main thing is that he shouldn't go back to the dealer (and there is no reason he should).
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I suspect the YO is doing a perfectly good job. Turout out, bring in. Feed. Repeat.
 
Amymay Again said:
I suspect the YO is doing a perfectly good job. Turout out, bring in. Feed. Repeat.
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Absolutely! And perhaps, at this moment in time, it's all that he needs.

Although I do find some descriptions of the YO's attitude puzzling, I have to concede that this is second hand information and not enough to make a firm judgement!
 
Amymay Again said:
I suspect the YO is doing a perfectly good job. Turout out, bring in. Feed. Repeat.
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This exactly. Yard owners seem to be a much maligned breed and I know there are good and bad as in all walks of life. But it’s probably a fine line she’s treading to be supportive but not interfering. Judging from earlier posts, she could have refused to handle him if she felt he was that dangerous, or given the op notice. YO presumably has her staffs’ safety to consider. We only have one side of the story.
 
meggymoo said:
YO presumably has her staffs’ safety to consider. We only have one side of the story.
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I agree - although I do still find the wheelbarrow story a bit worrying. But I also agree that we can never have the full story. This is not to say that the OP is being dishonest, simply that we don't have the full picture.
 
Nancykitt said:
I agree - although I do still find the wheelbarrow story a bit worrying. But I also agree that we can never have the full story. This is not to say that the OP is being dishonest, simply that we don't have the full picture.
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Yes it is a bit worrying, but also quite common I think. The groom used to do it on our old yard. All the horses were long term residents and she knew them like the back of her hand but they were still living breathing unpredictable creatures and we all know that a daffodil which was in bud and quite safe yesterday but is in full bloom today is a potential killer and can produce meltdown.
No I’m not claiming she is in any way dishonest either. I can forget to mention something when I’m quite calm, so although it may seem odd not to mention something like she had ridden him, I guess in the state of turmoil she appeared to be in, it would be easy enough.
I really hope she is ok this morning and perhaps coming to terms with things so she will be able to make a calm decision.
 
Thank you! I may in future save my eyes and ask for a summary on page 20+ of all long threads :D

I didnt know the horse had been ridden, since being at the new yard presumably as it was purchased unseen- how did that go, or is that a silly question?

I have to say, horse comes first, of course it does but I do feel for the buyer. I just imagine its a really awful situation to find yourself in, especially if you don't have the confidence to deal with things yourself and are dependant on other people.
 
poiuytrewq said:
Thank you! I may in future save my eyes and ask for a summary on page 20+ of all long threads :D

I didnt know the horse had been ridden, since being at the new yard presumably as it was purchased unseen- how did that go, or is that a silly question?

I have to say, horse comes first, of course it does but I do feel for the buyer. I just imagine its a really awful situation to find yourself in, especially if you don't have the confidence to deal with things yourself and are dependant on other people.
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It apparently went alright! But that was before horse objected to the vet and being shut in a stable for days on end (quarantine). OP said vet had checked heart lungs and eyes. So I guess that shutting the top door for the eye-check was the last straw for the horse, although apparently wasn't keen on the stethoscope either but as you can't check heart and lungs without one, the reaction can't have been too bad.
OP lost her nerve after that.
 
skinnydipper said:
I don't know who would get an animal and expect perfection the minute it walked through the door
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Generally speaking, sometimes a person with no empathy with animals. Someone who just regards them as 'alive' the same way a plant is. I meet them all the time unfortunately.

Or maybe a person sunk deep into self pity, who reads 'suitable for RDA' and hears 'will look after you and give you the care you deserve'.

Or then again, perhaps someone whose MH problems include impulse control issues and compulsive shopping. Someone who has already got buyers' remorse before the package arrives, so can't bear to look at it, just gets it left with someone else & goes to unpack it in the morning to start the returns process.
 
Nancykitt said:
I agree - although I do still find the wheelbarrow story a bit worrying. But I also agree that we can never have the full story. This is not to say that the OP is being dishonest, simply that we don't have the full picture.
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It's not uncommon, corners get cut on many yards

Yard soon learns which horses you can get away with this. It's like putting in a haynet and not bolting the door. Lots of horses, it's fine. 2 on our yard will be out the door so everyone knows you bolt the door behind you with them
 
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Pearlsasinger said:
It apparently went alright! But that was before horse objected to the vet and being shut in a stable for days on end (quarantine). OP said vet had checked heart lungs and eyes. So I guess that shutting the top door for the eye-check was the last straw for the horse, although apparently wasn't keen on the stethoscope either but as you can't check heart and lungs without one, the reaction can't have been too bad.
OP lost her nerve after that.
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Kind of confirming the issue then.
 
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