British Breeding

amymay

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Watched the Foxhunter class on telly last night (HOYS).

Great class, but how disappointing that maybe three horses out of the fourteen or so competing where British/Irish bred.

Every horse that came in to the arena seemed to have been bred in Germany or Belgium.
 

amymay

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I couldn't agree with you more SK.

The thing is we do breed some wonderful horses in this coutry - people just seem to prefer to buy abroad.

It's so sad.
 

Tempi

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i know what you mean - i was reading the dressage reports in H&H this morning over brekkie and practically every single horse mentioned had 'imported from germany' or 'imported from holland' written buy it...........made me quite sad actually that people dont support british breeding enough. I know i can talk because i wanted an imported horse but ive already changed my mind on this as i DO want to support british breeding. The horse im looking at tomorrow was bred over here.
 
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I totally agree amymay,my jumping mare has excellent ID bloodlines (King of Diamonds etc) and she is going into foal next spring. I want an Irish foal I really do, I have decided to put her to rebelara as I wanted a jumper, but you have no idea how limited my choice was to have an out and out jumper that is British / irish blood through and through!!

Hopefully with this match I should end up with the best of the old Irish jumping bloodlines and the best of the new Irish jumping bloodlines.

We really need a system in place, look at all of these WB's from abroad, they find something that works then stick to it - I think there were 4 horses in the Fox final with Landgraf (sp?) in their lines,that shows organisation!!
 
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Haaa - I love my Irish TB.......personally think that they have as much potential as alot of warmbloods - have a bit more bone but my god have they got speed!
 

S_N

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I agree - IMO a lot of the problem is down to 'fashion'. And for some reason people think that they are getting more for their money when they go abroad and spend big money
 

amymay

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Well I was totally gobsmacked the other day. A couple I know are going over to Germany to buy an advanced dressage schoolmaster. It's not neccesarily going to be used in competitions - but will be used to teach adanced movements etc.

Why???? - because it's soooo much more impressive to say that it was imported from abroad.

So I think that you're right - for a lot of people it's about fashion.
 

SPARK

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The foal I bought in May is British bred, has very good european lines, but bred here. I got him form a stud local to me that breed VERY nice stock. I would not go abroard to find a horse as you get very good British bred stock here!
 
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When i had my horse imported it was due to financial reasons more than anything else.

I looked at about 10 british bred horses and none of them where what i wanted as they were waayy overpriced IMO.

I managed to buy abroad for a horse that i wanted that was in my price bracket.

However i have since then found a british bred horse that i now own in the price bracket that i could afford but that was simply through sheer luck and owner needing a quick sale due to divorce.

I'm all for British breeding dont get me wrong but for me it was the financial implications that drove me abroad.
 

burtie

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[ QUOTE ]
The foal I bought in May is British bred, has very good european lines, but bred here. I got him form a stud local to me that breed VERY nice stock. I would not go abroard to find a horse as you get very good British bred stock here!


[/ QUOTE ]

And he is an absolute cracker, in fact I'm still planning to steal him from you at some point!!
 

Rambo

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It's also about choice. There are so many more horses available on the continent. Don't be fooled though, the British Breeding scene is developing...but it won't happen overnight. Compared to 20 years ago, there are many more people breeding SJ'ers in this country than there were imo.
 

S_N

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Also, breeders on the continent are, in general, encouraged to breed good horses, through incentive schemes, Govt. backing and also the Tax/VAT concessions that they get.....
 

Toby_Zaphod

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I don't think it's just the fashion 'imported from Germany' etc, at the moment there is far more choice & the prices are more affordable than here.
As usual in England, as with almost everything, we sit back on our backsides & expect buyers to accept what we offer them & charge what we like.
We did this with the motorcycle industry? The car industry? Machine Tool Industry? & now we've done it with horses. It will take us years to get back on track & with a massive cash injection, if we ever do.
 

ladylisa

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[ QUOTE ]
But most of them have some Cleveland in them if you go way back


[/ QUOTE ]
my sister has a cleveland x gelding, he is so pretty and ssssoooooo laid back, i keep joking that the x bit is seaside donkey!!!! she goes mad lol
 
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It's sad that the fashion for going abroad to buy horses means our British breeders suffer. I'm doing my bit by keeping one breeder in Yorkshire in business - I've just lined up my next purchase but I've got to wait two years until he's 3 - and am also doing my bit for Cleveland Bays as both mine have a bit, as will any others I buy from this breeder.
 

SSM

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my sister has a cleveland x gelding, he is so pretty and ssssoooooo laid back, i keep joking that the x bit is seaside donkey!!!! she goes mad lol

Well I do call mine the Stonky Donkey - if she goes any slower she'll go backwards!!!!!!!!
 
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I am in agreement on buying British, afterall I am a breeder myself.

We breed warmblood youngsters from proven mare and sire lines. Every year we have sold our foals and most have gone to the UK/Ireland, with the exception on one we sold to Canada.

I agree on both points in that:
1. People think it is more fashionable to purchase on the continent.
2. The prices that some people ask for their stock in the UK compared to the same in Europe is considerably higher. There are many times I look in the H&H and say to myself "they are asking THAT!!".

I also think that sale auctions like Brightwells that keep on importing horses from Europe to sell in the UK does not help British Breeders, it is almost a stigma by saying that our horses are not good enough quality to sell. These guys should be sourcing good quality horses in the UK, and with the amount of breeders there are, this is surely not that hard! The breeders and owners of horses in the continent must be well pleased.......not only do they have many auctions in their own country, but they can send their horses to the UK as well.

This was why I asked in another thread what prices the "Elite Mare Auction" held recently attained.........why did they not go round the British studs instead, as you do see people sell top quality broodmares?

I dont think the Breeders in the UK get enough recognition for the work they are trying to do, and yes it is an uphill battle, as you are competing against Europe for the trade.

I also feel saddened when you hear people saying that there is not enough horse power in Britain. Well I think there is, but most smaller studs dont have the big bucks to breed and then produce their own horses. It is ok for the Hales of this world or other people with the money to go and pay thousands for one foal or a young horse, but for the majority of breeders we just cannot do this. We also dont have a huge bank account to pay hundreds of pounds a week to have our young horses produced for top level competition.

Again, the BD and BSJA etc should have funding so that good quality young horses that are bred by studs can then be matched to riders for the future.

I have many a good horse at home that I would love to be produced either in jumping or dressage but some of the riders charge a lot of money a week to produce the horses (and yes they have to make a living also) and I just cannot afford to pay for that plus try and keep my breeding lines as good as those on the continent. HOWEVER, if there was funding available to have my youngsters produced for the future, whether this means that there is a contract written up that the horse cannot be sold etc for how ever many years, then I think I would be quite happy with doing that.
 
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Was speaking to an Irish guy round these parts a couple of months back. He breeds proper jumpers, and has usully used good quality ID or IDx mares of jumping lines with lighter dutch stallions' imported semen. However, in the last two seasons he said he has always bred a pure ID in the hopes of getting a filly that he can sell back to Ireland, as he says the purebreds are getting so depleted that he can make good money - he says a nice, but not exceptional, 3yo mare fetches between 8 and 15k, and can fetch much more if an excellent type.... so swings and roundabouts. Anastasia posted recently about the young KWPN stallion reports, and commented on their efforts to introduce more pure TB stock - the one in that particular report featured top class British racing breeding....
 

S_N

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I whole heartedly agree with what you say there - esp. with regards to the sourcing of horses for these elite competition horse sales!!
 
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Hi SN, I have to say I have a real bee in my bonnet about UK Auction Houses promoting European bred horses.

I realise that they have to get their revenue from somewhere, but everytime Brightwells do that they are kicking the teeth of British Breeders.

Our European counterparts must be laughing in their cornflakes as there horses are not only getting publicity in their own country, but being well promoted in the UK as well......they have the best of both worlds. While us British Breeders dont even get a look in.

I dont see any adverts from Brightwells in any of the press, or on their own website asking for British Breeders to come forward with their stock for selling, they are only interested in those dealers that they have the partnerships with in Europe. I also do not hear of them having selection days in various areas throughout the UK to select very good British horses for these events.

Until people in the UK horse industry support British Breeders what chance do we really have, it just gives us an even bigger hill to climb.
 
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Thing is with british breeders asking so much money for their horses, the dealers wont make enough profit through selling on and thats why they dont buy British.

If they import horses they can make a nice profit and the buyer gets a good deal so everyone is happy. They just wouldn't make the same profit buying British. And like you say these imported horses are the latest demand so business is booming.

I am not saying that this is right or wrong just putting another view across.
 

S_N

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I totally understand what you are saying Kelly, but British breeders have to pay so much more in order to produce the goods, compared with their European counterparts! I am told that this is one of the reasons why the Aga Khan took his breeding/racing intererests outside of the UK for so many years - It was also a stand against the low prize money on offer at British races courses. Yes I know that is an example from the TB intdustry, which is worlds apart from the competition/sports horse industry, but TB breeders are still clobbered in the same way as C/SH breeders are.
 
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