Britsh Horse - suggestion of £100 licence

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Orangehorse

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Good article inthe new edition ofBritish Horse. Among suggestions is a £100 licence per horse to pay for bridleway,s veterinary research and equine research, plus the passport/id system.

Well, that sounds like a good idea to me, although I expect lots of people will disagree.One thing in the article I noticed is that all these welfare cases is reflecting very badly on horse owners in general and an impaired reputation for the horse industry. I agree with this. Horse owners are regarded by the general public as either super-rich - racehorses, royal family, hunting toffs - or a local gypsy owner with loads of scrawny poor ponies.

I know this isn't true, but it makes it harder for the ordinary horse owner to be taken seriously by councils and other agencies.
 
Its like most things - the honest will pay and the rest will simply not bother and unless there is a system to make them pay it all gets very unfair
 
Hippona said:
Is that a one off or per year?
TBH I wouldn't be happy paying that every year for 3 horses if there were still horses tethered and fly grazed left right and centre.
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Erm....no I would not like to be paying a horse licence, I have six so £600 just to keep them? And what about the riding schools around? Would they have the money for 10+ horses each year?

It would mean a lot more abandonment/neglect cases because of certain people not being able to
 
Yes it was a good article. But i don't support the idea for the £100 licence. If it was true that all horse owners were super rich, then i would happily pay, but, many people, myself included, keep their horses very well on a restricted budget and to be honest i would resent paying a fee.
People who don't know me or my circumstances view me as financially rich because i have two horses, own my own land and drive a car (ironically in that order!) I juggle financial commitments and make sacrifices each week to keep my horses and i am happy to do this. if the licence fee was formally adopted, then i would have to juggle some more - but given the choice i would prefer not to.
 
That sounds entirely impractical and daft. The administration and enforcement of such a program would probably cost a fortune. Who would enforce it? What agency would receive the money? How would you locate every horse owner in Britain and demand they pony up (pun intended!) and who would be responsible for that? Could you wheel clamp or tow horses who's tax wasn't paid?

What on earth does that have to do with being taken seriously? And how does telling the idiot faction of the general public, who make fallacious generalisations and judgements about all kinds of things, that, "Well, we pay a £100 license fee to keep our horses!" make them any less idiotic or fallacious?

If welfare is a concern, donate £100 to RedWings or WHW.

As far as passports go, if a horse has a passport, someone -- the breeder, importer, whoever -- has paid to get that done. Passports aren't given out for free.
 
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Hmmm
I don't use bridleways
I would imagine my eye watering vet bill could contribute to vet research etc
The stud fees, registration fees, microchipping fees, vet description fees, grading fees (well, the list is endless) should cover printing of a passport, which is worthless anyway...
I own 6 horses, I wouldn't be desperately keen on adding another £100 per head to their cost.
 
I dont see why i should pay £200 per year for my horse and his little companion pony. Especially as the pony was given to me as the companion is finacially worthless as a 11.3 16yo gelding not broken. i think there will be more abandoned ponies each as ponies being shot now as its too expensive to get passports for them
 
OK, so I haven't yet read the article - I will go an do so a.s.a.p. But this idea just seems like yet another way to increase owner's costs for no gain - just like those blasted passports all responsible owners shelled out for, but which by and large are pretty d*mn useless now. Vet's fees are already high enough as it is and they should be able to make contributions towards research quite easily, even comparing experiences at seminars is a form of research and an opportunity for learning. I can also see that charging a licence fee of £100 per horse will be just too much for us owners on a budget to cope with and will increase the welfare problems as more people will be forced into giving up their animals (whether to welfare organisations or PTS) and there will then be a knock on effect to all horsey suppliers as well.

As to the funding of bridleways, that's a laugh, the BHS didn't want to know when one of my local bridleways came under threat recently; fortunately there were enough interested riders willing to get stuck in and fight that has reduced a possible to closure to one of re-surfacing to make it also suitable for farm vehicles. Not ideal of course, but at least we can still use it.
 
Just goes to show how out of touch they are - £100 per equine would be the final straw for a lot of people who are hanging on financially by their finger nails. WHW reckon there are currently 7,000 equines at risk in the UK - here's how to increase that figure at one fell swoop. Bonkers in this financial climate - and I so agree about the passports.
 
It's a ridicoulous idea the good owners would comply as we did to the idiotic passport law the people who cause the issues would not.
I pay tax, I pay vat ,I pay council tax , I pay to tax my cars ,Gordon brown raided our pension in another back door tax ,I will not willing comply with a horse tax .
 
The issue is that like car vehicle excise duty the money would not go back in to the equine industry but would probably go towards other government expenditure.
We are in fact taxed at 20% vat on almost every item we buy for our horses and livery yards have to pay commercial rates as well so the government is already doing very nicely especially as the equine industry is the second largest land based industry and is worth 3.8 Billion pounds per year.
 
Bloody hell that would cripple some of the riding schools my loan horses are from a huge centre with over 80 horses (all beautifully cared for by the way) but I don't think they would cope with a 8k pay out for using their OWN land to ride on, on top of all the fees they already pay! There would be a lot of issues I think with horses on loan also, who pays?

I'd pay of course but would I be paying £100 or £600? 4 of them are yearlings too.

Sounds like bloody TV licensing to me!
 
I have just read the article in the interests of fairness I must sayit was not written by a BHS Offical it was the opinion of Professor Knottenbelt who wrote the piece so not a BHS policy .
 
Prof Knottenbelt needs to get real in that case. If he really wants to see an increase in fly-grazing, abandoned and neglected horses and ponies an extra £100 tax is exactly the way to go about it. I know that I for one would have to heartbreakingly give up thanks to what that would do to an already dwindling equine budget. If such a licence came in it would be the final straw, for me and for certain of my friends who also battle to balance their budgets each month. If he wants more money for his own research well he will have to earn it, the same way that everyone else does, he can't expect to just tax responsible horse owners with a licence fee just to keep himself and his department going. I know that he is already a hard working leader in his chosen field, but times are hard and he needs to appreciate that, horse people are not all loaded with pots and pots of money from the end of a rainbow, but many may end up coming to terms with having equine friends passing over a certain rainbow bridge if he gets his way and this licence becomes compulsory.

I'm sorry if this is coming across as a rant, but I do feel really strongly about this issue and the effect it will have on so many people that do care and want to do their best for their horses and ponies whilst those who don't and won't ever get a licence if it comes into being will get away scot free as usual.
 
JillA said:
£100 per equine would be the final straw for a lot of people who are hanging on financially by their finger nails. WHW reckon there are currently 7,000 equines at risk in the UK - here's how to increase that figure at one fell swoop. Bonkers in this financial climate - and I so agree about the passports.
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This.
 
Well I wouldn't mind contributing to the upkeep and maintenance of bridleways if I actually had access to any!! And assuming, of course, that all the ramblers and dog walkers who parade across my fields, knocking down walls and leaving a trail of litter and dog mess behind them, each pay me £100 towards the upkeep of the public footpaths!!!

Call me a cynic but it just seems like a way to raise funds for veterinary research, nothing to do with improving the welfare of horses in this country.
 
Buddy'sMum said:
Well I wouldn't mind contributing to the upkeep and maintenance of bridleways if I actually had access to any!! And assuming, of course, that all the ramblers and dog walkers who parade across my fields, knocking down walls and leaving a trail of litter and dog mess behind them, each pay me £100 towards the upkeep of the public footpaths!!!

Call me a cynic but it just seems like a way to raise funds for veterinary research, nothing to do with improving the welfare of horses in this country.
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Grr I agree with that AND then they can't even close the gate after they have left rubbish, pestered my horses and fed them all sorts of crap!
 
well I think maybe he might be frustrated at the lack of funds for equine research in the UK-all of which afaik is charitably funded. Increasing funds for good equine research would be a good thing, although I haven;t read the article and not sure I agree in principle. Prof Knottenbelt is a pragmatic and energetic chap who's done alot of good in his field. Equine science needs researchers like him.
Before the recession, I was involved in equine research and frustrated at the seemingly endless supply of joules clothing that horsey types would buy-while bemoaning the fact that the 'cure' for equine grass sickness etc etc had not yet been found by scientists.

With the current recession I agree its a doubly bad idea (particularly a yearly fee). A one off payment for a licence on purchases after a certain date may put of those sorts that buy a horse for pennies-because well, its pennies...But couldn't possibly see how it would be implemented and/or cost effective.

as for bridleways, wouldn't work up here in Scotland and I agree we're all taxed to hell anyway.I'd be more up for contributing towards a cohesive, scientific research program/collaboration than towards bridleways thats for sure.
 
In an ideal world it's a lovely idea, but we don't live in an ideal world. Just think of the hassle implementing the additional one off cost of a passport, it cause huge issue with those who owned moorland ponies because it was such a huge chunk of their profit, are we really saying that for every dartmoor pony around the owners will have to pay £100 when they fetch close to nothing at the sales? All I can see is yet another process that would cause people to abandon and neglect ponies that just wouldn't be financially viable. Another thing, I have nothing against travellers but I've no doubt they wouldn't pay and me the sucker that I am would.

Now, a licence to own a horse.... Different kettle of fish there, but not a licence per horse
 
Don't like the idea of a licence at all, where I live I have no bridleway access and surely the drug companies and vets pay for veterinary research and we then pay for that through our vets bills and/or insurance premiums. Seems entirely impractical and I don't know how it would ever be policed.
 
In theory brilliant. in reality can i suggest they get passport fiasco sorted out first. again the good law abiding people will pay but how many wont. they cant police the passport scenario so pray how will they police a licence. And certainly wont help the thousands of animals kept out of sight already suffering.
 
I will stop being a good law abiding person if they try anything like this.
Especially if its an annual charge, just no.
I've gone along with microchipping, while others haven't bothered and rarely(if ever) have suffered legal repercussions for not doing so. I've gone along with passporting (and look how well that worked out) while others haven't bothered and rarely (if ever) have suffered legal repercussions for not doing so. And now the idea is being put forward for another hoop for us to pay to jump through? I'm all out of craps to give about hoop jumping.
 
I'd be quite happy to pay for a licence if it was ring-fenced for equine issues and I don't even care about the fact that other people wouldn't get a licence - the same could be said for any other tax e.g. Car, council etc. we all pay for those that don't have it. However just administration would probably take half of that and chasing free-riders the other half also any general taxes currently used for things like bridleways would probably just be spent on something else and so there would be no net gain.
 
hmm, I am not against the idea of a "horse licence" as I am not against the same for dogs BUT as with the whole passport thing, those law abiding people will do it and others won't.
Plus, I pay council tax, car tax, income tax, I am not sure why as a horse owner we should have to pay another 'tax' to use bridleways etc when I don 't imagine cyclists and walkers will have to do the same. Fine, if walkers, cyclists were banned from using them but obviously that would never happen but why should horse riders have to pay for the upkeep when horse riders are not the only ones to use them?

Passporting/microchipping hasn't worked - how many stolen horses have ended up going for slaughter as those who have stolen them see it as a quick buck? Do slaughter houses even check passports or microchips to see if said horse is registered stolen? Do vets always check for microchips when carrying out a vetting?

We could do without another half-arsed attempt to regulate something!
 
Buddy'sMum said:
Nope, veterinary research is not exclusively funded by charities, see
http://www.rcvs.org.uk/education/career-development/research/#funding

I'm sure he does get extremely frustrated at the lack of funding but show me a researcher who doesn't!
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well quite. some of those on the list are actually charities though and even more have no interest in equine research (DEFRA, BBSRC, Moredun-although they've done a little) as they are concerned with food produce animals etc. Given how little money is available, its very competitive. But it is across the board now, unless you work in a trendy area.
 
I'm afraid this is an idea that will push dozens of struggling breeders PAST the final limit - and a lot of mares and youngstock will end up at sale yards.

Example: I had 16 foals this year: one died/one PTS after running up hefty vet's bills. The remainder will cost me more than £200 each to register, DNS test, micro-chip etc. And as very few people are buying weanlings/yearlings right now, I'll probably have them all until they're backed at 3-4 - by which time they will have cost me at LEAST £4,000 to rear - and if the market hasn't miraculously improved, I'll be struggling to find buyers to pay that! Let alone an extra £300 to cover their licence cost to date.

And that's WITHOUT considering the £8,000+ per year I'd be paying to licence brood mares, retirees, and the yearlings, 2 year olds and 3 year olds that are being run on (and never SEE a bridle path!)
 
I don't think it would work, it would be unfair to charge that for everyone, eg, we have very few bridleways compared with other parts of the country so would have no value for money. The passport system is a total farce and the only owners who would stump up are the good, responsible ones, the ones producing mass numbers of low value, scrawny ponies will never pay up....
 
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