Broken 6yo.. WWYD?

IrishMilo said:
Ah I feel for you, I've just been through this. Do you have the money to retire her or can you only have one horse? If the latter I absolutely would PTS.

One of mine has the same list of issues as your girl, minus the suspensory and SI stuff. I'm usually pretty pragmatic at calling it a day but something just didn't feel right about that with Koby, so we made the decision to turn him away with the view of reevaluating in a year's time to see if he could be a light hack. We took all 4 shoes off and literally just chucked him in the field and haven't touched him apart from to trim his feet. Not going to lie, I got a lot of stick and judgement IRL for it, because he was crippled and utterly miserable for a couple of weeks. I did come close to suggesting we PTS a few times when he couldn't stand on his own 4 feet and I was of the view that if he wouldn't stand up to retiring without meds and remedial shoeing I didn't think it was in his best interest.

Couple of months later and I'm so happy we stuck with it. He's the happiest I've ever seen him and is looking the best as well. He gets nothing but grass and is fat, fluffy and shiny. And sound!
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Don't worry I'm under no illusion of the pro's and con's and I'm in no way saying you must retire something just for the sake of it, I have nothing against pts when the horse has multiple issues.

It was just a comment about roughing off and not really needing to and to not add to the op's stress.

I'm sorry you went through that with your horse its never an easy decision I've been there I know x
 
I think PTS might be the kindest thing for both of you.

I’ve kept Skylla as a pasture puff, but she came sound on the livery I was at after 6 months pootling in the field and I could afford a second horse to do stuff with. She has less stuff going on, but I’ve called time on any expectation of her doing more than some hacking, as I think you end up in the never ending cycle of trying fix whichever wonky bit is the most wonky right now.

You’ve already given her lots of time and investigation and she’s still not right 😢. I think even turning away she will still be fragile, with multiple things wrong that could flare up.
 
AShetlandBitMeOnce said:
That's all very well provided you have the funds and the ability to do so. If you can't do it at current yard because you don't have 24/7 turnout, which is like hens teeth these days, you have to look for a retirement livery. Land around near me is at an absolute premium, and you're not getting retirement livery you'd want your horse to be on for less than £400pm. Then on top of that you'd want to see her very regularly, as with so many issues she could go downhill very quickly or it may be subtle in that someone who's not hawk watching her or who knows her well may notice, so you'd have to find a retirement happy with that and some of them don't want the herd disturbed, plus or minus painkillers in the short term while she adjusts so they'd have to somehow manage them being fed and/or syringed. You'd have to facilitate introducing a horse that may be cranky or not as agile as they usually would be into an established herd. Then you have to bring them back off of this retirement and have either paid for your space for a year +, or find another yard (again, in my area good livery yards with turnout and which are nicely managed are genuinely like gold dust) to then bring her back into work and potentially face the heartbreak of her breaking down again after you've invested even more time and hard work into basically re-backing her. If you can't re-back her you'd have to hope she's not gone feral, or pay for someone to do it who may not know what they're looking out for.

Plus all the risks while she's turned out - injuries, mud fever, rain scald, she doesn't winter well and drops weight or shivers and the yard may or may not want to rug their herd - another one being introduced that unsettles them all, that she may start pacing, fence chewing etc etc.

It's all very well and good pushing for the option that seems the kindest, but sometimes when you consider the real life nuances and considerations - albeit some I have mentioned are more likely than others, it's not that simple as finding retirement livery and chucking her out and hoping for the best.
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I did reply to you but clicked on the wrong post 🙈
 
Hormonal Filly said:
Realistically in the current climate I can only afford one, unless I found retirement livery for less than £150 but that isn’t going to happen.

Thanks for sharing about your gelding, pleased to hear he is doing well. I just have a doubt in my mind if being turned away will help/solve all her issues. The arthritis will only get worse. I have a feeling I’ll turn away and be in this situation in a years time. I’ve only read one positive story on a year out and PSD.

I am so attached to her. She is like a big dog. I put to sleep my heart horse 4 years ago at the age of 9.. it’s the worst. I do have to think of my mental health, I’m a strong person but this has been making me almost ill for a few weeks.

The vet is back next Tuesday to scan. I’m thinking if no change put to sleep, unless I can find a decent priced retirement livery even if it’s for a few months. Could have a serious conversation with the vet about his thoughts but I get a feeling he won’t be straight about the future.
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Absolutely understand. I think in your position I'd have to come to the pragmatic decision to put her down, with what she has PLUS the suspensory stuff in a young horse, it's a lot.
 
So sorry to see this.

If she was mine, and I could afford it, I would turn out for 12 months and see where you are.
I'd send her away- when you are really close and emotionally involved it makes it hard to see them daily for 12 months and not mither and worry over every short step.

Otherwise, I would PTS, again if she was mine.
Some horses just seem to not be sound enough to stand up to any sort of work at all and you just can't see why.

I've had one mare, very similar, who by 7yro had a huge list of breakdowns and issues. She was a horse I'd had since a 3yro, the kindest and easiest horse and really tried for me and we had a great relationship. I ended up PTS and it was horrible but I just knew the next issue was always around the corner and I had to get off the emotional rollercoaster for my own sanity and, being frank, my wallet.
 
millitiger said:
So sorry to see this.

If she was mine, and I could afford it, I would turn out for 12 months and see where you are.
I'd send her away- when you are really close and emotionally involved it makes it hard to see them daily for 12 months and not mither and worry over every short step.

Otherwise, I would PTS, again if she was mine.
Some horses just seem to not be sound enough to stand up to any sort of work at all and you just can't see why.

I've had one mare, very similar, who by 7yro had a huge list of breakdowns and issues. She was a horse I'd had since a 3yro, the kindest and easiest horse and really tried for me and we had a great relationship. I ended up PTS and it was horrible but I just knew the next issue was always around the corner and I had to get off the emotional rollercoaster for my own sanity and, being frank, my wallet.
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Thank you for taking the time to comment millitiger.. sorry to hear about your mare. :( Its much more difficult when you have a great relationship with them.

I've made some enquiries and a friend, very trustworthy and local offers a retirement type livery, 24/7 turnout with natural shelter and field shelters in small herds for £215 a month which isn't bad. I mean, it is still £2,500 a year with a small chance of her recovering, but I am tempted. I'm not sure I could say goodbye to her right now. Its been the anniversary of loosing my heart horse and a close friend to suicide this month.

Not sure If I could afford another horse alongside though.. but I've cancelled her insurance today (£1,750 renewal, with £400 excess and several exclusions) so that is money to go towards it.
 
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Highmileagecob said:
Go down the middle - could you give her six months off, and then assess where she is at?
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Ideally yes, but it would be difficult to assess I think. No obvious lameness, I’d need to get her fit to a certain level to notice if she had improved, I think.

I’d have to give up the stable at my current yard, they can be like gold dust. I couldn’t bring her back into work at the retirement yard. Really difficult.

The more I think about it with my head the more I think PTS makes more sense. I really don’t know what to do. I feel so torn.
 
Can you loan her as a companion to someone to turn her away for a year? I know those homes are like gold dust, but if she’s a nice person she might be able to fulfil that role?
 
Zoeypxo said:
Sorry i havent kept up completely but have you seen someone like Tom Beech or Rob jackson?
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Thanks for the recommendation, no she hasn't. I just don't see how either can fix her host of issues. I'd love to and them to say 'do this and that she'll be ok' but the scans, MRI and x-rays don't lie.
Melody Grey said:
Can you loan her as a companion to someone to turn her away for a year? I know those homes are like gold dust, but if she’s a nice person she might be able to fulfil that role?
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A friend said this, I posted on a couple of the local social media pages and haven't had a single response. Definitely like gold dust.
 
Melody Grey said:
Can you loan her as a companion to someone to turn her away for a year? I know those homes are like gold dust, but if she’s a nice person she might be able to fulfil that role?
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Like gold dust, and some unfortunate horses that go like this end up going 'missing' on loan as someone takes advantage of the situation, or being badly neglected.
 
I am so sorry you’re facing this, it really is a horrible place to be in. You know my story with Nova, so I can only speak from my own experience. Personally, I’d pts. I faced a similar dilemma of turning away to see if it fixed her issues but in my mind, I was worried that I was simply postponing the inevitable and like you, I only had the one and couldn’t really afford to turn away/retire and get another. It’s hard because we don’t have a crystal ball to see if a year in a field would help, and the horse in front of us looks okay. You have my complete and utter sympathy and you know my PMs are always open.
 
I have a 14 year old who has been mostly useless riding wise since she was 6. I took her on as a project for meat money and unfortunately the wheels fell off after a few months of success.
If I had any sense I’d put her down, but I have the space and the money and she’s happy and comfortable so she remains. I have said I won’t save her if any injury occurs or she comes down with lami again (EMS).
I have put a few to sleep who have had multiple issues in the past that made them coping with normal life too difficult.
 
Coming back to this thread, reading the additional info around your circumstances re. budget and stable etc. I would say I'm more in the put to sleep camp now. The chance she's going to come right and stay right is very small and you'd be sacrificing a lot to get her there with no guarantee.

If in 12 months time you've done the turn away, rehab, and start riding again and still she's not right, you'll have to find a new yard, you'll be money down and you'll be even more attached.
 
Thank you all, really appreciate it xx

The yard I could turn her away at has a lot of grass - I've always questioned EMS and the vet did mention PSSM2 (neg P1) as well. She has always been kept on a sparse grazing, fed soaked hay to control weight, so I know lots of grass and those conditions aren't a ideal mix. Alongside her issues.

:(
 
Honestly I really feel for you and her in this HF.

If this was Faran as much as it would break my heart I wouldn’t keep going as I’d all this is happening at 6yrs of age what pain in the horse going to be in 5yrs from now with all these degenerative issues.

So sorry this is happening with such a young horse
 
Hormonal Filly said:
Thank you all, really appreciate it xx

The yard I could turn her away at has a lot of grass - I've always questioned EMS and the vet did mention PSSM2 (neg P1) as well. She has always been kept on a sparse grazing, fed soaked hay to control weight, so I know lots of grass and those conditions aren't a ideal mix. Alongside her issues.

:(
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Sadly throwing EMS into the situation would push me into letting her go. It's tough enough to manage a healthy EMS horse let alone one with other issues.

I'm sorry xx
 
Hormonal Filly said:
Thank you all, really appreciate it xx

The yard I could turn her away at has a lot of grass - I've always questioned EMS and the vet did mention PSSM2 (neg P1) as well. She has always been kept on a sparse grazing, fed soaked hay to control weight, so I know lots of grass and those conditions aren't a ideal mix. Alongside her issues.

:(
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What has made you think she has EMS? And did the vet think she has PSSM or just mentioned it could be a possibility?
 
IrishMilo said:
What has made you think she has EMS? And did the vet think she has PSSM or just mentioned it could be a possibility?
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I've thought EMS because its so difficult to get her to loose weight, she has fat pads (even when she was in work, on a low sugar diet) and can be lethargic. I've had a Welsh before I say was a good doer, but she is a extreme case of 'good doer'...

My previous vet mentioned PSSM2 last year, her muscle enzymes were always higher than they should be and he questioned doing a muscle biopsy but we never got around to it. One day she'd be really keen, next she is lazy, always so up and down. I know a bit about it because a previous horse had PSSM. The 'new second opinion' lameness vet spoke about PSSM as well, because she is so backwards. He took her bloods to run muscle enzymes but never sent them off as we found other pathology.

Maybe its all pain and not muscle related, or I'm over thinking. I'm not sure.
 
Oh this is so tough I really feel for you. I was in a similar position with my gelding when he was 6. He had very bad hind PSD. I know how emotionally draining it can be when they are on box rest and you are chasing issues so really do look after yourself too.

I decided to turn mine away. I needed to draw a line in the sand. He wasn’t getting noticeably better under treatment and his behaviour was deteriorating and I was so skint. I found a cheap DIY livery that offered 24/7 turnout and he lived out. He did eventually come field sound and 7 years later he is still here and an excellent companion to my other horse. I had to have four years of not having my own to ride before I could afford a second which was pretty tough.

Although he doesn’t stand up to any work he is such a lovely boy to be around. I made the decision that he can stay until there is another serious medical issue. He has EMS and it’s not always been the easiest keeping him on grass but can be managed.

In your circumstance I would really prepare yourself to not have a ridden horse at the end of the rehab. For some it doesn’t seem to matter how much time effort and money you throw at them. They just aren’t fixable and it’s so heartbreaking. No one would blame you for PTS. But I really would having a hard think about what the line is your not prepared to cross and stick with it.
 
Hormonal Filly said:
Thank you for taking the time to comment millitiger.. sorry to hear about your mare. :( Its much more difficult when you have a great relationship with them.

I've made some enquiries and a friend, very trustworthy and local offers a retirement type livery, 24/7 turnout with natural shelter and field shelters in small herds for £215 a month which isn't bad. I mean, it is still £2,500 a year with a small chance of her recovering, but I am tempted. I'm not sure I could say goodbye to her right now. Its been the anniversary of loosing my heart horse and a close friend to suicide this month.

Not sure If I could afford another horse alongside though.. but I've cancelled her insurance today (£1,750 renewal, with £400 excess and several exclusions) so that is money to go towards it.
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Mine is £215 a month but last winter it was costing an additional £150 for foot rasping, feed, hay contribution and treatment costs of repeated abscess poultice by y.o. so just factor in that.
 
Seems a difficult situation. If you have a horse in order to ride and can only have one then PTS wouldn’t be a bad choice. Your mare won’t know. I have a retired 4yo at livery, but I’ve known he wasn’t coming into work since he was a yearling. However my horses aren’t primarily for riding. I do ride one of them but it’s not why I have them, which takes the pressure off.
 
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