Cannot believe what I just saw on BBC1

Not quite sure what you mean Mike. Have you seen police horses "crushing skulls" I'm interested if this opinion is formed though logical opinion through imagined scenarios, or personal experience as an officer or demonstrator?
 
I think my position is quite clear and not the least hypocritical. I support the officer in question ,but I dont think the horses should have been there.
 
doonrocket said:
Not quite sure what you mean Mike. Have you seen police horses "crushing skulls" I'm interested if this opinion is formed though logical opinion through imagined scenarios, or personal experience as an officer or demonstrator?
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Think about it, ultimately what can an officer on a horse actualy do!Basicly it is to intimidate a crowd, ..but if the crowd wont or cant back away.??
 
Mike007 said:
More of a sad disillusion of their effectiveness.
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Well thats your opinion, but i think the horses do a wonderful job and have helped officers defuse situations that could otherwise get out of control, with them having a higher vantage point the offivers can spot a potential threat then direct the foot officers to the situation or away from potential danger very usefull imo
 
Cards on the table Mike.

I was a serial sgt in the police line directly behind the horses in the BBC clip we discussed. I have 15 years experience of disorder and working with police horses. Trust me, they are invaluable at holding cordons and getting to places vehicles can't and officers would take to long to. Yes they have their limitations, but without them yesterday there would have been mayhem. If you felt like I did when I crashed on the sofa last night after a hard day you would understand.

I take it from your previous answer that your opinion does not come from a position of experience.
 
Again LOL ,Have served the crown for 20 years, not in the police, I do know about crowd control,and I still think horses are a liability.
 
aaah, a few tours of Northern Ireland? Well I would agree with you there, but pipe bombs on the Falls road is a very different kettle of fish from a wednesday afternoon in Bristol.
 
Not my patch,the falls road ,but the principle is all the same. Best crowd ontrol I have ever seen was a single officer on wesminster bridge during the countryside alliance protest. Kept hundreds of people in order,to their own benefit,simply by his own natural authority. Wish I had got his number. The man was a star! Bloody horses! Dont get me wrong I am not anti police by any means,I just question the methods sometimes.
 
quirky said:
Nope, don't see a problem there.

If he wanted the horse to go forward and it wouldn't, a couple of cracks on its backside is the right thing to do.
I don't think you actually get the full sequence of events from that clip.

As for complaining about the officer, I am gob smacked :eek:.
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Ditto
 
doonrocket said:
Wow what an explosive thread!

Firstly I was there. (10 meters away!)

Brunel - a brave and decent horse was not hurt or hit with any force.
(He has been examined)

Secondly the students were no problem. There were maybe three idiots in the crowd. Most were 6th form kids and 99.99% of people there were no problem - in fact polite and considerate.

Mike - your wrong, without the horses we would have needed about 200 further officers. They are an excellent effective tool.

If the officer had not controled the horse, I would be typing this from my hospital bed!
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:) LOL where were you 30 pages ago?
 
Mike007 said:
Not my patch,the falls road ,but the principle is all the same. Best crowd ontrol I have ever seen was a single officer on wesminster bridge during the countryside alliance protest. Kept hundreds of people in order,to their own benefit,simply by his own natural authority. Wish I had got his number. The man was a star! Bloody horses! Dont get me wrong I am not anti police by any means,I just question the methods sometimes.
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I hate to say it, but the Countryside Alliance march had a little more decorum than a bunch of students out looking for trouble, and yes, it has been STATED that many were there purely for this fact...

Shall we ditch the horses then, lose the crowd control and when the looters start looting your house, thats ok then? Or will your single officer control the 400+ protestors?

Good luck with that.
 
Unbeliever said:
:confused:

Quoting myself (how sad is that?)

I searched out the relevant legislation. With luck it might make some think.

Animal Health & Welfare (Scotland) Act 2006

" It is an offence to cause an animal unnecessary suffering; therefore, any discipline should be appropriate, timely, reasonable and proportionate. A whip or a stick should only be used as an additional aid, not as a means of punishment. Similarly any restraint method used to assist normal management or treatment of the animal should be the most mild and effective method available and should be applied by a competent person only for the minimum period necessary. Sedatives must only be used under veterinary advice. Roundpens and small electrified fenced areas should not be used to discipline animals and are not suitable for keeping them in for long periods of time."
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Ok didn't see this sorry. So where does it say it's illegal to whip a horse? Do you have a link that proves this? What you have quoted above says nothing of the sort. "A whip or a stick should be used as an additional aid.." which is exactly what it was being used for in the clip. Doesn't say anything about it being illegal to use a whip in Scotland..
 
Mike007 said:
Not my patch,the falls road ,but the principle is all the same. Best crowd ontrol I have ever seen was a single officer on wesminster bridge during the countryside alliance protest. Kept hundreds of people in order,to their own benefit,simply by his own natural authority. Wish I had got his number. The man was a star! Bloody horses! Dont get me wrong I am not anti police by any means,I just question the methods sometimes.
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Aah yes, but the Countryside March protesters have a lot more respect for authority than those yobs; indeed, that copper probably wasn't needed at all! Plus there have still been no cleaner march or rally than those; we took our litter home or binned it. Bet they'd prefer our marches to some they have to police!
 
my-princess-pony said:
I'm not suprised in the slightest that this officer abused her horse ( and will no doubt get away with it) they do it to humans often enough......
Dont forget that police are above the law and don't have to abide by rules like the rest of us.
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I'm afraid I'm going to be a bit personal here. With a name like yours I assume you are 8 yrs old and wear Barbie pink. I can assure you're views will change as you mature and see a lot more of life and perhaps need the assistance of the police at some time. If not I hope to God you never get attacked, assaulted or anyone that you know for that matter. If you are older then I can only wonder what has happened to evoke such a ridiculous outburst I can only assume you have had close contact with the arm of the law probably doing something you shouldn't.

Thank you doonrocket for such an informative report.
 
Double_choc_lab said:
I'm afraid I'm going to be a bit personal here. With a name like yours I assume you are 8 yrs old and wear Barbie pink. I can assure you're views will change as you mature and see a lot more of life and perhaps need the assistance of the police at some time. If not I hope to God you never get attacked, assaulted or anyone that you know for that matter. If you are older then I can only wonder what has happened to evoke such a ridiculous outburst I can only assume you have had close contact with the arm of the law probably doing something you shouldn't.

Thank you doonrocket for such an informative report.
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Amen!
 
To me, it looks like he does hit the horse with his baton which IMO is out of order. I've read some of the posts on here (no, I'm not about to read the full 30 whatever pages) and am (as usual) shocked by some of your responses saying you would quite happily smack your horse in this sort of situation. The horse is scared, smacking it does NOT help. So many people seem to beat their horses into submission forgetting that they aren't machines. To get called a "bunny-hugger" just because some of us don't agree with smacking horses is utterly ridiculous. But then again... I guess we are on a pro-hunting magazines forum so its only inevitable...
 
MagicMelon said:
To me, it looks like he does hit the horse with his baton which IMO is out of order. I've read some of the posts on here (no, I'm not about to read the full 30 whatever pages) and am (as usual) shocked by some of your responses saying you would quite happily smack your horse in this sort of situation. The horse is scared, smacking it does NOT help. So many people seem to beat their horses into submission forgetting that they aren't machines. To get called a "bunny-hugger" just because some of us don't agree with smacking horses is utterly ridiculous. But then again... I guess we are on a pro-hunting magazines forum so its only inevitable...
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..then I do think you need to go read the whole lot. There are actually posts from ex-mounted officers who explain WHY they do what they do. THEN come back with a better judgement of what you think. It is NOT a case of beating the horse into submission, the situation was volatile and highly dangerous, it wasn't your average hack in the park on a nice sunny day, oops, watch out for that ball that child just threw....
 
mymare said:
Ok didn't see this sorry. So where does it say it's illegal to whip a horse? Do you have a link that proves this? What you have quoted above says nothing of the sort. "A whip or a stick should be used as an additional aid.." which is exactly what it was being used for in the clip. Doesn't say anything about it being illegal to use a whip in Scotland..
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Doh! :rolleyes:
Here's a straw, clutch it.
 
You lot still at it?? Police horse was disobedient..got a well deserved reminder to do its bloody job..end off.

Bunny huggers stick to your "pretty ponies " ..no doubt wearing tinsel browbands at the moment,pink numnahs and matching bandages..urrgghhh!:mad:
 
EAST KENT said:
You lot still at it?? Police horse was disobedient..got a well deserved reminder to do its bloody job..end off.

Bunny huggers stick to your "pretty ponies " ..no doubt wearing tinsel browbands at the moment,pink numnahs and matching bandages..urrgghhh!:mad:
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lol

It's always nice to end with our humour in tact! :D
 
MagicMelon said:
To me, it looks like he does hit the horse with his baton which IMO is out of order. I've read some of the posts on here (no, I'm not about to read the full 30 whatever pages) and am (as usual) shocked by some of your responses saying you would quite happily smack your horse in this sort of situation. The horse is scared, smacking it does NOT help. So many people seem to beat their horses into submission forgetting that they aren't machines. To get called a "bunny-hugger" just because some of us don't agree with smacking horses is utterly ridiculous. But then again... I guess we are on a pro-hunting magazines forum so its only inevitable...
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DragonSlayer said:
..then I do think you need to go read the whole lot. There are actually posts from ex-mounted officers who explain WHY they do what they do. THEN come back with a better judgement of what you think. It is NOT a case of beating the horse into submission, the situation was volatile and highly dangerous, it wasn't your average hack in the park on a nice sunny day, oops, watch out for that ball that child just threw....
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Erm, at the risk of making myself the target of the condescenders and 'name-callers' I'd just like to add that I HAVE read all of the comments on this thread and I concur with ALL that MagicMelon says in his/her post.
 
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