Changing towcar to estate? Thoughts?

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Heathy82

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I have a Kia Sorento 4x4 and tow my 16.1hh TB in a newish Ifor 505. The Kia is amazing. Hardly feel the trailer on the back, and it's a pleasure to drive everyday to work and back. So easy. BUT I am sick of spending over £200 a month on fuel for the damn thing, and that's with me not actually towing anywhere. If I tow, the fuel needle drops rapidly increasing my fuel costs further! I feel like I am forever at the petrol station. So......as I only ever tow my horse occasionally, I am looking at the option of swapping to an Audi A4 avant 2.0 TDI. Fuel economy is so much better than the Kia, so that alone makes the idea so much more appealing. Legally the Audi can tow 1800kgs and I figure that my horse is 550kg max and my trailer 950kgs so I would be well within the law.

Does anyone use an estate to tow just one horse? Pros and cons. I cannot afford to run the 4x4 as an everyday car anymore, as much as I would love to, so something needs to give, and I dont want to lose transport altogether.

Advice, suggestions please?
 
I wanted to tow my old horse with a ifor 505 but My local car dealer told me it was a big no no, said the brakes would really struggle and I'd burn the clutch out. So I never bothered

Had to wait another 3 years till I eventually got 4x4
 
Looking on http://www.towinghorsetrailers.co.uk/towing_vehicles.htm

the Audi doesn't seem to have a towing capacity of 1800Kgs, the highest i can see is 1600.
There's the Volvo XC70 (think that's the 4x4 though) at 1800kgs
The BMW 5 Series 2000kgs
Lexus GS 2000kgs
Peugeot 407 XS 2000kgs
Renault Koleos (whatever that is!) 2000kgs
Subaru Forester 2000kgs
Mitsubishi Outlander 200kgs

Thos are all the ones coming up that are more estate than 4x4 (think the last two are 4x4 though so fuel consumption won't be good).
 
Thanks. I'll have a look on there. The figure of 1800kg is for the 2.0 TDi A4 avant and I got that from the manufacturer spec. They say the 1.9 TDi can tow 1700kgs. Aside from the legalities and safety issues will an estate be a no no for towing on grass/muddy fields?
 
WHICH AUDI AVANT IS IT ? as there seems to be more than one A4 avant 2.0 TDI

Trailer 950 plus horse 550 = 1500 actual weight and probably a bit more with other bits in trailer so lets say 1600

A vehicle with a 1600 towing capacity should be capable of pulling that weight but the big question is will it be capable of doing that in all the conditions you want it to?

I found Audi A4 ALLROAD AVANT 2.0 TDI QUATTRO 5D 170 BHP which does look like it could do the job

Footnote: -
This would need to be driven under B+E licence rules
 
Heathy82 said:
Thanks. I'll have a look on there. The figure of 1800kg is for the 2.0 TDi A4 avant and I got that from the manufacturer spec. They say the 1.9 TDi can tow 1700kgs. Aside from the legalities and safety issues will an estate be a no no for towing on grass/muddy fields?
Click to expand...
Are you looking at 4x4 avants or 2wd avants?
 
Thanks ROG. I was looking at the 2WD manual 2.0 TDI SE's and S Lines. The 4WD makes them just as juicy at the Kia so wouldn't be worth the swap. I passed my B+E test last year. :)
 
We've looked into this, also have a Sorento that my OH understandably hates filling up ;) The alternatives we would buy would be an audi but quattro, or the vw passat 4 motion. I would still want 4x4 for towing, even if using a more economical estate car, but of course the downside being that the fuel saving is lessened.
 
I tow my IW 505 and my TB with my company car which is a Mazda 6 Sport Estate. It has coped brilliantly. I mainly compete/have lessons where there are hardstanding lorry parks but when I have towed it on grass it has been fine. Don't think I'd want to tow on really muddy/wet grass though - but then, I probably wouldn't fancy it much with a 4x4 either :D
 
Heathy82 said:
will an estate be a no no for towing on grass/muddy fields? ........ I was looking at the 2WD
Click to expand...
I would say deffo a NO NO

If you are intending to tow a horse trailer on anything but nice tarmac type roads then you really need a 4X4 type vehicle or a really strong tow rope with others who have a 4X4 with you so they can pull you out of a situation like the above

If you have lots of steep hills on your usual journeys then you need a vehicle with good GRUNT

Hills/slippy surfaces and fuel effeciency ..... they will never go together

Other options -
Use two vehicles , one for towing and one for the rest - that might work out cheaper than the fuel costs but would need to be worked out carefully taking into account all the running costs

Again using two vehicles - 3.5 tonne horsebox as you only have one horse plus a fuel efficient car

Not sure how good 3.5 tonne horseboxes are on slippy stuff though !!
 
Hi,

I actually have an 55 plate A4 Avant, which I’ve used to tow my Sinclair Trailer with one horse one board for the last two years.

Mine actually comes with a 2tn (?!) towing capacity according to Audi, but I wouldn’t go anywhere near that limit as the car only weights just over 1.5tns itself. I think the caravan club’s 85% rule is a much safer guide - the car manufactures will work out capacity as whatever the car can pull from a standing start on a 12% gradient I believe. Towing horses, you need to be much more concerned with what the car can safely stop! My previous tow car was an older A6 Quatto Avant – terrifyingly I had a fault and lost a wheel off my trailer at 45mph, the trailer started to snake and the car pulled it straight – it's weight ratio to the trailer (with my precious, precious boy on board!!) saved us from a nasty accident.

Anyhow, this is how I work out my current outfit – My A4 weighs in at 1510kg, more like 1550+ with diesel, etc on board. My trailer is a lightweight double and with matting, etc, comes in at 840kg. My Cob weights 500 and my Trotter 550. My local weighbridge think I’m loopy. So, using the bigger boy as an example I’m towing a combined weight of 1390kg, which is about 91% of my car’s un-laden kerb weight. Being a bit more realistic about the car’s weight (petrol, saddles, water tanks....) and I’m high 87-89%. Which I find acceptable from a safety perspective, regarding my own horses.

It is a compromise (except on safety if you do your sums), obviously I can’t take both horses anywhere at the same time and I’d be cautious about towing anything heavier than mine. But, like you I can’t afford to run a 4X4, I have to drive for work and my fuel bill would be hideous, never mind tax and insurance. This way I can safely tow one at a time without breaking the bank.

In terms of wear to the car, mine has been fine – because the Avant is designed for towing and rated for these weights (in simple stop-start terms) the brakes are designed for these sorts of capacities, I haven’t found mine to have worn any faster or been damaged. I tow once or twice a month. BUT, I am careful with the clutch – the forward gears are designed to tow the weight but they do not have the heavier duty low (1st) and reverse gears of a 4X4, so can be burned out. First is fine in practise, but I was told to be careful with reverse. My A6 certainly couldn’t reverse the weight it could pull without a burning smell! So I try and avoid routes with really steep hills in case I meet traffic and think ahead when I park – if I need to reverse out I do this without the horse on board and load on my way out. Likewise, if a venue has a very steep climb (rare!) out I might drive to the top, load and leave. As someone already pointed out, it's not a 4X4 so it won’t climb wet grass or mud – but I’ve found people understand why I can’t attempt to drive to the top of a wet field to park... but you’d have the same problem with a lorry :)

From memory, I don’t believe there’s many estates that actually have the weight and grunt to tow these weights though – I think it's only really Audi, Merc, BMW and perhaps Jaguar (only the expensive ones... oh joy..).

I did run a small car (Yaris) alongside my old 4x4 Audi, but the costs of running two cars really adds up. I really thought it would break even with the 4X4 Pajero I had before, but it didn’t. The inconvenience of juggling two cars was also surprisingly annoying :o

Hope that helps, feel free to PM if you like x
 
Hi I tow with an 2wd audi avant 2.0. It has a capacity of 1600kgs so tows my 505 with one horse absolutely fine... on the roads. There is no way it will go off tarmac and still tow.

That is the downside.

Why dont you get a 2nd hand Audi all-road A6 Avant? MUCH better imo... I can't really do this as long story but you could.
 
I used a mercedes c180 (not estate) and it could tow 1800kg, it was perfect for 1 horse and an ifor 403 and i parked on several dodgy looking fields and drove it off with no problems at all. Not certain I would tow 2 horses with it but was perfect for 1.
 
Have a look at the A6 estate you can generally pick a better model up a bit cheaper. The A4s we looked at had a harder life, lower spec and were more expensive. The engine is the same but the car is a bit heavier and being wider we feel it tows a lot better. The fuel economy is not vastly different and can be worth it given how much you save on first purchase. Also do not go on Audi fuel economy stats they are seriously optimistic I do not know anyone who gets near the figure for the diesel A3, A4 & A6s driving normally.
 
I used to tow my lad with a Subaru estate, like you I only went out occasionally so felt a 4x4 wasn't necessary. I could feel the box on the back (mine was a Bahill so not as heavy as an Ifor) but the legacy was a real workhorse and I had no ill effects on the car from towing.
 
Suncat said:
Hi,

I actually have an 55 plate A4 Avant, which I’ve used to tow my Sinclair Trailer with one horse one board for the last two years.

Mine actually comes with a 2tn (?!) towing capacity according to Audi, but I wouldn’t go anywhere near that limit as the car only weights just over 1.5tns itself. I think the caravan club’s 85% rule is a much safer guide - the car manufactures will work out capacity as whatever the car can pull from a standing start on a 12% gradient I believe. Towing horses, you need to be much more concerned with what the car can safely stop! My previous tow car was an older A6 Quatto Avant – terrifyingly I had a fault and lost a wheel off my trailer at 45mph, the trailer started to snake and the car pulled it straight – it's weight ratio to the trailer (with my precious, precious boy on board!!) saved us from a nasty accident.

Anyhow, this is how I work out my current outfit – My A4 weighs in at 1510kg, more like 1550+ with diesel, etc on board. My trailer is a lightweight double and with matting, etc, comes in at 840kg. My Cob weights 500 and my Trotter 550. My local weighbridge think I’m loopy. So, using the bigger boy as an example I’m towing a combined weight of 1390kg, which is about 91% of my car’s un-laden kerb weight. Being a bit more realistic about the car’s weight (petrol, saddles, water tanks....) and I’m high 87-89%. Which I find acceptable from a safety perspective, regarding my own horses.

It is a compromise (except on safety if you do your sums), obviously I can’t take both horses anywhere at the same time and I’d be cautious about towing anything heavier than mine. But, like you I can’t afford to run a 4X4, I have to drive for work and my fuel bill would be hideous, never mind tax and insurance. This way I can safely tow one at a time without breaking the bank.

In terms of wear to the car, mine has been fine – because the Avant is designed for towing and rated for these weights (in simple stop-start terms) the brakes are designed for these sorts of capacities, I haven’t found mine to have worn any faster or been damaged. I tow once or twice a month. BUT, I am careful with the clutch – the forward gears are designed to tow the weight but they do not have the heavier duty low (1st) and reverse gears of a 4X4, so can be burned out. First is fine in practise, but I was told to be careful with reverse. My A6 certainly couldn’t reverse the weight it could pull without a burning smell! So I try and avoid routes with really steep hills in case I meet traffic and think ahead when I park – if I need to reverse out I do this without the horse on board and load on my way out. Likewise, if a venue has a very steep climb (rare!) out I might drive to the top, load and leave. As someone already pointed out, it's not a 4X4 so it won’t climb wet grass or mud – but I’ve found people understand why I can’t attempt to drive to the top of a wet field to park... but you’d have the same problem with a lorry :)

From memory, I don’t believe there’s many estates that actually have the weight and grunt to tow these weights though – I think it's only really Audi, Merc, BMW and perhaps Jaguar (only the expensive ones... oh joy..).

I did run a small car (Yaris) alongside my old 4x4 Audi, but the costs of running two cars really adds up. I really thought it would break even with the 4X4 Pajero I had before, but it didn’t. The inconvenience of juggling two cars was also surprisingly annoying :o

Hope that helps, feel free to PM if you like x
Click to expand...
WELCOME and what a good first post :)

The 85% CC guidance which is designed for newbie caravanners obviously works for you when towing horse trailers and keeps you confident and happy so thats great :D

From your post I can tell that you have thought long and hard about what is right for you in all the issues and I am guessing you also have a B+E licence
 
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