Channel 4 8.30 tonight

Holly Hocks said:
Well you clearly do, so why not tell us all about it?
People can only comment on what they see - and what a lot of us saw is a man who appears to have done not a lot wrong, a friend trying to help, and a so called "animal welfare charity" acting out of all proportion.
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It's not my place to be doing so.

Why don't you, or someone else, write to the RSPCA and ask? There's a radical thought.
 
What a nice old man I gladly give him a few quid but the rspca I would not give a bl##dy thing to. He needs help understanding the horses did not look at all bad, not ideal but for the money he had I think he has done a maverlous job.
His horse skill is brilliant if not by the book. The rspca should employ him to teach the stupid staff how the be horse aware and be around horses .
SHAME ON THE RSPCA .
 
Stateside said:
What a nice old man I gladly give him a few quid but the rspca I would not give a bl##dy thing to. He needs help understanding the horses did not look at all bad, not ideal but for the money he had I think he has done a maverlous job.
His horse skill is brilliant if not by the book. The rspca should employ him to teach the stupid staff how the be horse aware and be around horses .
SHAME ON THE RSPCA .
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Err, this is a man who was a prolific breeder, I am sure he knows what worming is. :rolleyes: He doesn't need 'educating'.

And if you think that his standard of care is acceptable, then that's worrying, because clearly a vet didn't, nor did a court of law.
 
KellyJoArnold said:
Full of worms, possible overgrown hooves, popping out a foal every year because there is no control over the breeding. and carrying god knows how many diseases.....

Yes, im sure you would much rather that....
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Yes, living in a herd, running wild ish. Hum....like, I don't know a horse.
 
The truth is its extremely difficult to deal with animal hoarders a Michelle is exactly what is needed ,you need to deal with worming, breeding ,foot care get the colts away and or cut get numbers down to manageable for the owner and you saw flashes in the old man when he was cleaning up the yard at Michelle of how difficult he can be.
And yes he needed his living conditions sorting out too so he was a little more comfortable it's a sad situation .
 
Auld Lang Syne said:
To me he came across as a kind auld man who has lost a love one and replaced the hole in his heart with one of the kindest sensitive creatures on this earth.
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Not one, there were 52 or so at one point weren't there? One horse to cuddle would be sweet (though a toy teddy would be better), horse collecting, unless you're a millionaire, is irresponsible and/or mental.

If the man wants to live in a field, fair play to him that's his choice, but animals need responsible owners and the horse world needs responsible breeders. That bloke is clearly neither.
 
I reacted on a emotional level watching the film, which is of course their intention. but now I've had time to think, Moomin has a point. It was a very biased short film which showed only a little of one side of the story.

As I said before, I wish they'd at least interviewed the RSPCA for their side and some background.
 
FionaM12 said:
I reacted on a emotional level watching the film, which is of course their intention. but now I've had time to think, Moomin has a point. It was a very biased short film which showed only a little of one side of the story.

As I said before, I wish they'd at least interviewed the RSPCA for their side and some background.
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The RSPCA clearly didn't want to be interviewed - their faces were pixelated out....
 
Managed to watch a bit of this, and called in my hubby as i recognised the high street.

Turns out my hubby knew Clwyd many years ago, before his daughter died.
He and his friends would help collect the hay over the summer.

From the stories i have just listened to, he isnt a 'knob'.

Eccentric yes, but a knob, no.

The death of his daughter , in my hubbies opinion , has clearly had a devasting impact on his life. As it would for any of us.
 
Flame_ perhaps he has a Extreamly large hole in his heart to fill..?

Have you ever lost a child..?? If not I guess you would not understand, only those who have been there can judge and grief makes people do strange things - yes even collecting 52 horses.

This man needs love , kindness support and help, not mocked and called a "dick"
 
FionaM12 said:
How do you know that's why they were pixelled out? :confused:
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Well they obviously didn't want to be identified, so they were hardly going to speak to the camera were they?

I agree a bit of background could have been provided, but like anything, we can only go on on what was shown as we can with any news program or documentary....
 
FionaM12 said:
How do you know that's why they were pixelled out? :confused:
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Holly Hocks knows absolutely diddly squat.

Quite often this is done for privacy and safety aspects for the individual officer concerned. It can be and is a dangerous job.

FWIW I don't agree that anybody should be called derogatory names on a forum.
 
Moomin1 said:
Holly Hocks knows absolutely diddly squat.

Quite often this is done for privacy and safety aspects for the individual officer concerned. It can be and is a dangerous job.

FWIW I don't agree that anybody should be called derogatory names on a forum.
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Moomin - you have no idea, but I have had in the past extensive dealings with this "charity" which calls itself the RSPCA - and I currently do a large proportion of court work - prosecuting. If you would like to know more of my background, please feel free to PM me and I will tell you of my dealings and experiences....

I have not said that you know "diddly squat" (nice educated phrase there!) I know you have your own biased opinions and will defend the RSPCA to the hilt - I wouldn't expect anything else from you, but you have to appreciate that we all have different opinions and can express that freely should we choose....
 
Holly Hocks said:
Moomin - you have no idea, but I have had in the past extensive dealings with this "charity" which calls itself the RSPCA - and I currently do a large proportion of court work - prosecuting. If you would like to know more of my background, please feel free to PM me and I will tell you of my dealings and experiences....

I have not said that you know "diddly squat" (nice educated phrase there!) I know you have your own biased opinions and will defend the RSPCA to the hilt - I wouldn't expect anything else from you, but you have to appreciate that we all have different opinions and can express that freely should we choose....
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Yes quite, I have never said anybody can't express their opinions have I?!

What I was saying is that you have no idea why the officer's faces where pixelled out. You automatically insinuate it's because they have a hidden agenda and don't want identifying! :rolleyes:

They are individual people, with families, and children, and loved ones. They are fully entitled not to be exposed on tv if they don't want.
 
guido16 said:
First point, don't judge me, you don't know me.

Second point, who says that is the worst suffering I have ever seen?

This is a forum. We agree to disagree. Don't feckin patronise me. Bad move.
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Aggressive over reaction.

We can only judge what we saw. An old man struggling with life. He doesn't feed or care for himself or make rational judgements.

Another case of the RSPCA pursuing a conviction for convictions sake, they have lost all perspective.

If one woman can make such a difference to that man, the RSPCA should at the very least be able to equal that.
 
Only two points really

Sad that as a society a man like Clwyd becomes so isolated and depressed (he said he didn't like the way his life had turned out) his only friends are his horses. A completely devastating event in his life has just left him spiraling downwards with inevitable a lonely end whist living in frankly squalid conditions. Where is his big society - ah that'll just be the lady who has done her best to help him with little or no support from others.

He is quite clearly a horseman who has a lot of knowledge, but he is breeding indiscriminately poor quality stock with not much of a future. They do need to be reduced and he should be prevented from breeding more. Why isn't his knowledge harnessed to good effect instead of him prosecuted because unfortunately society doesn't value people like Clywd and offer him those sort of opportunities.

Sad all round for me another lost life and potential and a whole heap of poorly bred ponies with little future.
 
It's very hard to form a fully informed opinion, when large chunks of information was missing. Such as why did the foal die, how many others have in his care, why wasn't worming done sooner, what previous involvement has rspca had, what were the details of the charges & many more.
While I can't imagine the pain of losing a child, & don't want to try, I don't think its acceptable to say it excuses neglecting animals 24yrs later. Living in filth, not washing etc all are entirely his decision, & not one I'd criticize. But when you also allow animals to suffer, then I'm afraid people will judge you. Unfortunately many people do lose children, & if society then allowed them to break the law because of that for the rest of their lives then I think we'd be in a mess.
 
Nic said:
Aggressive over reaction.

We can only judge what we saw. An old man struggling with life. He doesn't feed or care for himself or make rational judgements.

Another case of the RSPCA pursuing a conviction for convictions sake, they have lost all perspective.

If one woman can make such a difference to that man, the RSPCA should at the very least be able to equal that.
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Make a difference?!! She made very little difference other than being stuck continuously selling his horses which he continued to breed, into a market which is already brimming with unwanted horses and rescue centres at breaking point. She didn't manage to stop him doing so, he still continued to get more and more and allowed the horses to breed. It doesn't show how she helped his living conditions, and it doesn't show whether she is helping him to maintain the welfare of his horses.

The film is uninformative and biased.
 
Nic said:
Aggressive over reaction.

We can only judge what we saw. An old man struggling with life. He doesn't feed or care for himself or make rational judgements.

Another case of the RSPCA pursuing a conviction for convictions sake, they have lost all perspective.

If one woman can make such a difference to that man, the RSPCA should at the very least be able to equal that.
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I agree.
 
Littlelegs said:
It's very hard to form a fully informed opinion, when large chunks of information was missing. Such as why did the foal die, how many others have in his care, why wasn't worming done sooner, what previous involvement has rspca had, what were the details of the charges & many more.
While I can't imagine the pain of losing a child, & don't want to try, I don't think its acceptable to say it excuses neglecting animals 24yrs later. Living in filth, not washing etc all are entirely his decision, & not one I'd criticize. But when you also allow animals to suffer, then I'm afraid people will judge you. Unfortunately many people do lose children, & if society then allowed them to break the law because of that for the rest of their lives then I think we'd be in a mess.
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Thank god another person with sense!
 
Moomin1 said:
Make a difference?!! She made very little difference other than being stuck continuously selling his horses which he continued to breed, into a market which is already brimming with unwanted horses and rescue centres at breaking point. She didn't manage to stop him doing so, he still continued to get more and more and allowed the horses to breed. It doesn't show how she helped his living conditions, and it doesn't show whether she is helping him to maintain the welfare of his horses.

The film is uninformative and biased.
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Whereas your views are entirely neutral?

And yes I'd say that she made an enormous difference to that man.

She had more success at controlling the number & care of the horses than the RSPCA did.
 
I don't often agree with moomin, and I never agree with the RSPCA but why did michelle sell the colts on? Why did she not ask for help with gelding the colts? I know that several charities WILL help, and there's a programme for the gelding of wild colts in wales.

So why sell rubbish colts on to breed more rubbish colts?

Felt very sorry for the man, he;s clearly a nagsman through and through, just someone who's lost their way in life.
 
Moomin1 said:
Make a difference?!! She made very little difference other than being stuck continuously selling his horses which he continued to breed, into a market which is already brimming with unwanted horses and rescue centres at breaking point. She didn't manage to stop him doing so, he still continued to get more and more and allowed the horses to breed. It doesn't show how she helped his living conditions, and it doesn't show whether she is helping him to maintain the welfare of his horses.

The film is uninformative and biased.
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Didn't he start with about 50? Then got got to 22, then unbeknown to the lady he took ten for a friend then those went back, so down to 22 again. They seemed to be concentrating on removing the colts, therefore showing attempts to control the breeding.
 
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