Children on yard by themselves

[julie07711]

Does anyone think its wrong to leave their two children who are 12 and 14 alone on the yard and in the school with their new horse?

The reason im asking is i have a friend who has two daughters and they have just purchased a new horse and the horse is on a small livery yard. However the yard owner has said to my friend she shouldnt be leaving her daughters down there by themselves as they do not know the horse that well.

The girls are very competant riders and have been around horses since they were very young.

I do actually agree with yard owner,but then im not a horsey person.

 

[paddi22]

I used to be dropped at my yard in the morning and picked up in the evening by my parents, when i was 8 with my 14.3hh first horse! Back then no one thought anything wrong with it. there were a few of us with ponies and lots of adults around.

The logical part of my brain says that if i had a kid, i would be more cautious, but then there's another part that says kids have been messing around unaccompanied with horses for centuries. Of course accidents happen, but we all escaped unharmed and we used to run wild. My horse was a nutter and we used to play jousting with each other and knock each other off with brooms! Some of my happiest memories are from that time, being free from parents watching.

 

[ruth83]

It is not a question of their capability. It is a question of their age. If the YO does not want to take responsibility for them then they are perfectly within their rights to ask that they are accompanied at the yard.

 

[criso]

I know a couple of places where it was a condition of the insurance that there were no unsupervised under 16s.

 

[nikicb]

When I first saw the title of this thread I thought you would be discussing 8/10 year olds. I think that experienced 12/14 year olds are more than capable. At 15 I was left in charge of a small yard for the day while the YOs went off to shows etc. My now 16 year old son 'does' our yard when he is not at school and has done for 3 years now. Although it is at home I am not always around.

 

[hnmisty]

I used to help out at my first riding stables when I was 10-11ish. Sometimes I'd be left on my own at the yard as the YO would go to her house, and all the pushy girls who helped out (or "helped out" would go with her. My mum was NOT impressed that I was being left on my own. Although she is a real panicker, bless her.

I always assumed she was worried I was going to be kidnapped! (My dad always assured me that if I ever was, I'd be promptly returned with an apology note and some money!)

 

[ruth83]

When I first saw the title of this thread I thought you would be discussing 8/10 year olds. I think that experienced 12/14 year olds are more than capable. At 15 I was left in charge of a small yard for the day while the YOs went off to shows etc. My now 16 year old son 'does' our yard when he is not at school and has done for 3 years now. Although it is at home I am not always around.

As was I, but I also know a lot of horsey 15/16 year olds who I wouldn't leave alone with a tamagotchi, never mind a horse.

 

[skint1]

When my daughter was 12 she'd ride her bike down to the farm after school and see/ride her pony. I'd come and collect her and the bike when I finished work a couple of hours afterward. She knew the pony and the farm very well. The farmer was usually around (though not horsey) I thought she was safer there with her pony than on the estate, but that was over 10 years ago now so I guess things change

 

[nikicb]

As was I, but I also know a lot of horsey 15/16 year olds who I wouldn't leave alone with a tamagotchi, never mind a horse.

Totally, I think it depends on the child. I was incredibly responsible at that age (I have a younger sister with learning disabilities and responsibility came early to me) and my son has had it drilled into him. I will forego the clean and tidy yard for the fact that he will notice if one has a slightly puffy eye, droppings are a bit loose etc.

 

[sidsmum]

It is not a question of their capability. It is a question of their age. If the YO does not want to take responsibility for them then they are perfectly within their rights to ask that they are accompanied at the yard.

This, if they are left on their own then responsibility will ineveitably fall upon whatever adult is around be it the YO or another livery.

 

[martlin]

I'm a YO and I don't allow unsupervised under 16s on my yard, capable or not is really not the issue, it's simply age - I am not prepared to take responsibility for somebody else's children. It's an insurance/litigation nightmare.

 

[SecretAgentBilly]

I'm 15 and I'm not allowed to stay at the yard by myself due to insurance, if I have a friend with me or anybody is there it's fine. If there wasn't this rule then I would stay by myself, but then I trust my pony a lot!

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

One of my youn ones is left alone. Our contract says children should be supervised , but that applies to visitors not liveries

we also have a clause to say we are not responsible for accidents

 

[MerrySherryRider]

From the age of 6 I lived at the stables during the holidays, we rode and led the ponies in headcollars from the field up the lane to the yard.

By 12, I was taking groups of tourists out trekking with another 12 year old.

Seems like another age now, no one ever seemed to give a second thought. Can't imagine many kids getting that freedom or responsibility now.

 

[Booboos]

How would people feel if the YO went off for the half day to do whatever and the children were entirely alone?

For me if the answer is that an adult should have been supervising them, then it's the job of the parents to do so or arrange childcare, not the YO's responsibility.

 

[julie07711]

I shouldve added,sometimes the yard owner isnt around and the girls are left by themselves,but in my friends defense what is she meant to do,spend the whole day at the yard just so she can supervise her Daughters,surely that defeats the whole object of the girls having fun with their horse as i know my friend cant just stand around all day doing not a lot.

 

[SO1]

Personally I don't think parents should leave their teenagers on the yard expecting them to be looked after or kept an eye on by other adults without asking those adults if it is ok, some YO are fine with that as they don't mind keeping an eye on the kids, others are not.

It is a big responsibilty to look after other people's children and I think the other issue is that sometimes it is difficult if the teenagers get a bit lively or excited and then an adult that is not their parent or guardian has to ask to them to act in a calmer way, some parents don't like other adults telling their children off.

Also what happens if the child has an accident? I think some people feel uncomfortable with unsupervised children as they then feel responsible if the child has an accident even if they have not been asked to keep an eye on the children or the parents get angry if the child has an accident and blame adult liveries for not keeping an eye on the children.

I think school holidays are a difficult time as if kids are left on the yard then they are more likely to unsupervised as adults liveries may be at work.

 

[MerrySherryRider]

But does a 14 year old need adult supervision ?

Is the mother assuming someone else should babysit the youngster, or, does she believe the girl quite capable of being responsible for herself and her sister ?

If either has an accident, surely, who ever was around would do exactly the same as they would for another adult- give first aid and call a relative.

There are some 14 year olds I wouldn't leave for 5 minutes to go to the bathroom, but, if this mother has made the judgement that these particular children are mature enough be around their pony without a parent, could she just be right ?

Last yard I was on was virtually run by the 15 yr old daughter of the owners. She was incredibly mature, very competent and did a great job.

 

[Elsiecat]

It never fails to amuse me that people say that 12/14 year olds need supervision etc and then in the next tread you read about how children these days are spoiled as their parents spent all day helping at the yard with them. Seems to me parents and kids can't win.

A 14 year old shouldn't need supervision unless something is very wrong.

 

[Rouletterose]

From the yard owners point of view I think most of them would not want the responsibility of other peoples children left at the yard, also from insurance point of view then over 16 is the usual cut off point for insurance companies. The yard I am at will not allow children under 16 unsupervised and the said child has to be supervised by the parent, not other liveries.

Accidents happen no matter how responsible the child and under 16 is still a child in the eyes of the law, I would not want to leave my child under the casual supervision of anyone else, if parents cant be bothered to supervise their own children then there is something wrong and they should send their child to an approved riding school rather than buy them a pony and then leave them to their own devices at the yard all day while they disappear doing their own thing.

From the point of view of the other liveries it's not really fair on them either if there were to be an accident, I dont want the responsibility of someone elses child and sometimes you cant relax and enjoy your own horses because you can see there is an accident waiting to happen, far better to be able to say 'oh its ok his/her parent is with them' and you can forget about them and enjoy yourself with your own horse/s which is how it's meant to be.

 

[SCMSL]

From 12 to 16 years old, I spent my Summers at the Yard. Mom would drop me off around 8 a.m. before going to work and would pick me up around 7 p.m. I had my group of friends and we all had so much fun - those were probably the best summers of my life! We never had any issues with anyone and would be more than happy to help people out - we would muck out, clean the horses, turn them out... and when some very nice owner invited us for a hack, it would be an awesome day!

I think this sort of stuff is exactly whats missing in today's kids - the freedom to be somewhere without their parents, to learn how to handle stuff themselves, to actually be out in the real world learning and working for a goal.

I learned a lot about horses, but mostly about people. I learned how to handle the politics at a yard, how to talk to older people, how to be humble... my kids will definitely be dropped off at the yard if they wish so.

 

[madmav]

I am so glad I was young when I was and not in these days.

 

[MerrySherryRider]

Out of interest, would any of you allow a 14 year old to meet a school friend to go shopping, swimming or go to the cinema or do you escort them on all activities ?
Would you leave her at home alone while you went shopping ?

I'm not critical but genuinely surprised that so many of you feel a 14 year old needs supervision by a parent and wonder where your cut off point is.

 

[Elsiecat]

^what horserider said.

As a side note, at 14 they are 2 years off college and a hell of a lot of freedom. You have to let them grow up at some point!

 

[criso]

I'm another one who spent all day at the yard from the age of 10 but that was a different time, my parents were unhorsy so wouldn't have been any help, if fact they couldn't be left to hold a 14 2 pony unsupervised.

The point isn't whether the child is competent or not, it's that the yard insurance may stipulate that there are no under 16s unsupervised.

If it's your own land or yard that's different and you can leave alone or supervise depending on how capable they are but on a commercial yard you have to go by the rules.

 

[SCMSL]

Yep, my mom is non-horsey and she can't even brush a horse's mane, so she would be no help at all. In my personal case, it wasn't so long ago - I'm in my mid 20's.

As for the yard's insurance, that must be discussed with the child's parents and has nothing to do with what's being discussed here - the ethics involved in leaving a child unattended around horses. If the insurance doesn't allow it, then there isn't even a discussion - it just cannot happen.

 

[tinap]

I've no problem with ages of the children, however of its a new horse then I think they should be supervised. It's in new surroundings & however calm & well behaved it may be I would still expect some naughtiness to happen in the beginning.

I'm going through the same thing, although my daughter is older. We have a new horse (came 5 weeks ago) & she has been exceptionally behaved. However we are still getting to know her & her ways so I still go down to the yard with the daughter. I have just started littering about doing other things while she's riding but I'm there just incase.

At the end of the day, if the yard owner wants them supervised then they should be. It's her yard, her rules after all xx

 

[criso]

As for the yard's insurance, that must be discussed with the child's parents and has nothing to do with what's being discussed here - the ethics involved in leaving a child unattended around horses. .

I think I interpreted the OP's query differently, the YO had requested that the kids not be left unsupervised.

Ethics and opinion may not come into the yard owner's request.

 

[Pippity]

I know when I was twelve, I went out of my way to NOT do anything my older sister told me, so I certainly wouldn't be relying on the fourteen-year-old to supervise.

I'd let a twelve-year-old go into town on their own, but I wouldn't let them ride without somebody there to have issues escalated to - and the fourteen-year-old doesn't count.

If the YO doesn't want to be that person, I can totally understand. My YO is willing to supervise under-sixteens occasionally but certainly not as a regular thing. She has too many other things to be doing, a lot of which involve her being away from site.

 

[ReggieP]

From the age of 6 I lived at the stables during the holidays, we rode and led the ponies in headcollars from the field up the lane to the yard.

By 12, I was taking groups of tourists out trekking with another 12 year old.

Seems like another age now, no one ever seemed to give a second thought. Can't imagine many kids getting that freedom or responsibility now.

Fully agree ! The UK has become a country of namby pambies, that trys to regulate to remove every risk from all walks of live. If its not the 'elf and safety excuse, its the insurance excuse or the media scaring us with their stories of crime.

The problem is that this creates over-protected unadventurous childen, and paranoid parents and above all slows innovation and invention.

How on earth would we have invented the car or the aeroplane in today's climate of grey suited regulation.