Cold backed only in arena

[Pearlsasinger]

She seems to get tense and the saddle moves forward as she lifts her back, just had a second saddle fitted to her, doesn't move when I get on in the yard, or when hacking, even in trot, can leg yield and circle out hacking with no response. I could totally understand if it happens everywhere, been to clinics and got straight on from trailer, no issues.My gut says she doesn't want to be in my arena as she sees it as where she has to work harder. She has also done the same with my trainer aboard.

It could be a response to the going, rather than to the work

 

[Pinkvboots]

If she is that bum high that the saddle is moving forwards it will be uncomfortable and maybe pinching so I would not be riding until the saddle is no longer slipping forward.

Do some ground work and long reining instead because if you continue while she is uncomfortable you are in danger of her having a bad experience and getting on a cycle of remembering it as pain.

The saddle probably feels OK hacking because you are probably just walking more than you would when you school.

 

[ycbm]

How did you manage him? Did you solve the problem?

I had him operated on but he was PTS for other reasons, which were present before the operation, before the rehab was completed. However with what I know now I would never have another operated on for kissing spines. If a physio rehab didn't work I would retire or PTS.
.

 

[ycbm]

I think you are writing off pain too easily, especially in a horse which hasn't been looked at by a vet. This is what my horse did, but he was never anything but super to hack, this happened only when schooling. Initially it happened only in a dressage competition, and I regret ever listening to people who told me it was just behavioural because it was only at competitions. The judge in that box at this competition saw me in the cafe and said "He needs a man on him".

 

[Carlosmum]

Having just ben through a 'cold backed' scenario I would do a full work up with the vet. A physio and/or saddle fitter can't see what is going on under the surface. My poor boy was in pain which we could only understand once he had xrays

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

One of the things that got me to seek another saddle fitter was that Dex became really stuffy and humped his back in the school - no rearing or bucking, but very evidently not happy.

 

[Clodagh]

If the saddle moves on her then surely it doesn’t fit? Asking people more knowledgeable than me.

 

[sbloom]

She seems to get tense and the saddle moves forward as she lifts her back, just had a second saddle fitted to her, doesn't move when I get on in the yard, or when hacking, even in trot, can leg yield and circle out hacking with no response. I could totally understand if it happens everywhere, been to clinics and got straight on from trailer, no issues.My gut says she doesn't want to be in my arena as she sees it as where she has to work harder. She has also done the same with my trainer aboard.

Sorry not read far through the thread and posting and running....I'm a saddle fitter....

This is BS, horses get adrenaline doing the really fun stuff,.arena work is harder but they object because they are struggling either physically, or emotionally/behaviourally,.or don't understand.

Croup high is part of the issue, if it's growth then rest partially, just hack if the saddle allows her to lift and work correctly. However, it's very easy to get mild to moderate postural issues and they are better sorted with groundwork.whixh should include developing the thoracic sling and not simply load/strengthen bits while not changing the way they move.

Search posture/postural on here for all the reams I've posted about it

 

[Birker2020]

Tend to agree with you, she just gives me the feeling that she is sick of schooling in there, have put poles out to trot over and worked between fillers etc to try and lighten the mood, but today, she wouldn't even walk a step, ears flat back, back up, circled to prevent the buck, then straight up. Trying not to go down the behavior route, got off, readjusted saddle, led her out of arena to yard, got on and happily trotted round the village!

Do you think it's because she associates schooling with having to be in an outline and collected?

Lari was uncomfortable in an arena when asked to turn in circles or when any kind of collection was asked. He had K.S.

He did a super trot and canter on a longer rein around the outside of the school with nothing asked of him, but as soon as he was asked for anything more he'd plant and start rearing.

 

[starbucker]

Deffo agree with vet check up and second saddler opinion, but being only 5, when my young horse (4) arrived she found the arena very exciting/anxiety inducing (e.g rearing in hand, head up high) She had been bombed about loads with previous owner (twice a day sometimes due to lack of much turnout) so had got a little sour, she had a month off while we sorted saddle out and did in hand followed by hacking for 6 month and now do like 1 schooling session a week which is more in line with her mental age and she now loves it even walks me down to the gate keen to go in ... no rearing, bucking or other sort of behaviour. We keep it short and sweet once we've focused on what we want to look at we finish there. She gets weeks off at a time every month or so to just be a horse.

EDIT just to add saddle fitter picked up on some tension resulting from a saddle that had been too tight with previous owner so this contributed to her anxiety which we have now worked through and resolved

 

[8058nicci]

Going to vets next week for Xrays etc. Anyone have experience of what to expect if they find KS? Recovering after surgery if needed? Successful outcome for getting back to work etc.Thanks

 

[8058nicci]

Do you think it's because she associates schooling with having to be in an outline and collected?

Lari was uncomfortable in an arena when asked to turn in circles or when any kind of collection was asked. He had K.S.

He did a super trot and canter on a longer rein around the outside of the school with nothing asked of him, but as soon as he was asked for anything more he'd plant and start rearing.

Definitely sour in my school, have kept schooling to a minimum since she came- once a week for 20 mins, or 10 mins after a hack, but after this weekend, Im not comfortable even trying to get on her in the school. Have booked her in for Xrays next Tuesday

 

[8058nicci]

I had him operated on but he was PTS for other reasons, which were present before the operation, before the rehab was completed. However with what I know now I would never have another operated on for kissing spines. If a physio rehab didn't work I would retire or PTS.
.

This would be my 5 th youngster retired through lameness/ physical issues in 40 + years, I have fields full of pretty lawnmowers till they are in too much discomfort.

 

[Birker2020]

Going to vets next week for Xrays etc. Anyone have experience of what to expect if they find KS? Recovering after surgery if needed? Successful outcome for getting back to work etc.Thanks

Lari had his back medicated with steroid twice in 4 months along with his SI but it made no difference. But he was a train wreck, had arthritis in his neck, hocks, coffin joints and possibly PSD as well as chronic and acute SI issues. He's now out at retirement and will never be sat on again, he remains comfortable due to that fact.

That's not to say don't try. But you have to expect a poorer outcome if there are issues in other areas too as its harder to treat.

 

[8058nicci]

I think you are writing off pain too easily, especially in a horse which hasn't been looked at by a vet. This is what my horse did, but he was never anything but super to hack, this happened only when schooling. Initially it happened only in a dressage competition, and I regret ever listening to people who told me it was just behavioural because it was only at competitions. The judge in that box at this competition saw me in the cafe and said "He needs a man on him".




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Have her booked in at Vets for Xrays next week, fingers crossed they don't find anything too sinister

 

[8058nicci]

Well, £1100 down to be told she needs further investigation via surgery on her stifle, then nerve block on front foot as lame in front when blocked behind!!! One vertebrae closer than the others but vet doesn't think an issue, even though she is showing classic KS signs.Totally non plussed as to where to go next. Told to get weight off, soaking and weighing hay, limited turnout, getting grump as hangry

 

[FieldOrnaments]

I'd get a second opinion on the spine.... If she's getting 'hangry' on reduced rations it might be worth finding some decent straw to offer as a (practically) calorie less gut filler and with a view to preventing ulcers as well.

 

[Bellaboo18]

Well, £1100 down to be told she needs further investigation via surgery on her stifle, then nerve block on front foot as lame in front when blocked behind!!! One vertebrae closer than the others but vet doesn't think an issue, even though she is showing classic KS signs.Totally non plussed as to where to go next. Told to get weight off, soaking and weighing hay, limited turnout, getting grump as hangry

Sounds like there may be a few things going on. Sorry it wasn't better news. If she's grumpy/hangry was she scoped for ulcers?

Saying this from a place of care-i'd be concerned at such a young age she's lame in front, needs surgery behind and isn't looking ideal in the middle. I'd personally be cautious how much I did (especially surgery) without knowing you've got the whole picture.

 

[Bellaboo18]

Also OP, if you'd like further help/opinions, I'd post something in the tack room part of the forum, Introductions doesn't get much footfall.

 

[8058nicci]

Sounds like there may be a few things going on. Sorry it wasn't better news. If she's grumpy/hangry was she scoped for ulcers?

Saying this from a place of care-i'd be concerned at such a young age she's lame in front, needs surgery behind and isn't looking ideal in the middle. I'd personally be cautious how much I did (especially surgery) without knowing you've got the whole picture.

Yes, not looking good, have dentist/ vet coming next week who is very good, am going to ask her for 2 nd opinion. Not going down surgery route as dont think it will help, they suggested medicating stifles, but steroids can cause laminitis,

 

[Goldie's mum]

Well, £1100 down to be told she needs further investigation via surgery on her stifle, then nerve block on front foot as lame in front when blocked behind!!! One vertebrae closer than the others but vet doesn't think an issue, even though she is showing classic KS signs.Totally non plussed as to where to go next. Told to get weight off, soaking and weighing hay, limited turnout, getting grump as hangry

Sorry you are having problems. I don't have any additional advice I'm afraid, I just wanted to say thank you for coming back with the update.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Yes, not looking good, have dentist/ vet coming next week who is very good, am going to ask her for 2 nd opinion. Not going down surgery route as dont think it will help, they suggested medicating stifles, but steroids can cause laminitis,

If laminitis is a concern arthramid injections do not have a lami risk.
Sorry it wasnt better news, i hope you can get to the bottom of it all. Thanks for updating us too!

 

[ycbm]

Well, £1100 down to be told she needs further investigation via surgery on her stifle, then nerve block on front foot as lame in front when blocked behind!!! One vertebrae closer than the others but vet doesn't think an issue, even though she is showing classic KS signs.Totally non plussed as to where to go next. Told to get weight off, soaking and weighing hay, limited turnout, getting grump as hangry

Well done for getting to the bottom of it.
.

 

[Bellaboo18]

Yes, not looking good, have dentist/ vet coming next week who is very good, am going to ask her for 2 nd opinion. Not going down surgery route as dont think it will help, they suggested medicating stifles, but steroids can cause laminitis,

Well they can (cause laminitis) but that's why she's on a diet to reduce the risk. Sounds like she's in alot of pain, hopefully you can get her more comfortable soon.

 

[Pinkvboots]

Steroids are a risk but only high risk if the horse has metabolic issues or cushings, you could do an ems test to rule that out or ask the vet about alternatives, the gel is very good and vets seem to be using it for so much now.

 

[8058nicci]

Sounds like there may be a few things going on. Sorry it wasn't better news. If she's grumpy/hangry was she scoped for ulcers?

Saying this from a place of care-i'd be concerned at such a young age she's lame in front, needs surgery behind and isn't looking ideal in the middle. I'd personally be cautious how much I did (especially surgery) without knowing you've got the whole picture.

Been here before with 4 other youngsters, no prepared to spend a fortune when chances are she will only be fit for hacking at best, don't think there are any totally sound horses any more.