Completely traumatised, someone help

BBP said:
I’m so sorry OP. Both for your loss and for what you had to experience. I can’t even imagine what you are going through.

My vet told me that if their cardiovascular system is compromised such as through heart disease it can take them longer to respond to the medication. The drug given after the sedative is a major overdose of anaesthetic. It causes a loss of consciousness first by shutting down the cerebral cortex and then as the overdose effect hits rather than just an anaesthetic effect it will shut down the respiratory system and then cause cardiac arrest and death (if I am wrong I hope someone will correct me). In some cases a second dose is required e.g if the circulation is sluggish or sedation has caused a drop in blood pressure as the drug has to travel through the vein back to the heart and on to the brain. So like at a hospital you can have anaesthetic but your heart is still beating, you don’t feel anything, your consciousness has gone. I would hazard a guess that your lovely pony’s circulation was poor so she didn’t get the full ‘hit’ of anaesthetic immediately but slowly and so the vet had to push more through to get the right effect. But because her neurological system was starting to shut down it was sending all sorts of weird signals to her body, without her conscious mind giving it permission. We had similar with an elderly cat needed a second dose and took probably 10mins, but the vet assured me that it was all unconscious rather than conscious movement. In human lethal injections it can take 10 minutes for the subject to finally pass away, but loss of consciousness should be immediate.

Your vet leaving whilst there was still a blink reflex and heartbeat was horrendous of them.

I don’t know whether I should write the next bit as I’m not sure if it will be helpful or not, but for me it helps me to sometimes remind themselves of what death is like in the wild. It isn’t peaceful or dignified, it is often brutal and prolonged, with no anaesthetic or sedative. Even what happened to your pony whilst appearing horrific for you would have been merciful compared to what a wild horse would have to endure. I am sure she wouldn’t have felt any pain or had awareness. You did what was right for her, especially if her cardiovascular system was poor.

Please look after yourself and make sure you have people with you at your uni that you can really turn to. The BHS Friends at the End can also support you.
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The thought about wild horses really helped thank you for that. I have amazing friends (horsey included) who have been fantastic. My grandparents and dad aren’t in the country at the moment and mum is disabled so can’t get to me but my uni friends have been great. But when no one is with me (like now) and it’s quiet- the feeling is quite horrendous
 
My equine life said:
Forgot to say - it was about 30 mins for her to go. And like I said in one of my reply’s - standing and pricking her ears to other horses calling. Surely she was in agony or do you guys still think not? It’s so unbelievably traumatising to think she was in so much agony and fear x
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I don’t think she would have felt any pain because the drigs used are sedatives and extremely strong anaesthetics. I don’t really know if she would have had some perception of things not being right, and may have been confused (like a horse having a neuro episode where it doesn’t know what its back end is doing) but I’m sure she wouldn’t have felt any pain, so please don’t torture yourself over that.

I wish I could give you a huge hug. I lost my horse last week and that alone is enough, without what you had to experience.
 
BBP said:
I don’t think she would have felt any pain because the drigs used are sedatives and extremely strong anaesthetics. I don’t really know if she would have had some perception of things not being right, and may have been confused (like a horse having a neuro episode where it doesn’t know what its back end is doing) but I’m sure she wouldn’t have felt any pain, so please don’t torture yourself over that.

I wish I could give you a huge hug. I lost my horse last week and that alone is enough, without what you had to experience.
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Thank you and I’m so so sorry for your loss- it is just heart wrenching. It makes me never want to buy another. Going down to the yard to see me other two has been so hard and I’m lucky that the girls have taken charge and so I went up last night and tonight to give a quick cuddle and it all I’ve been able to manage.

I hope both of ours have found each other in pony heaven- I’m sure the grass is much better up there than it is in England x
 
My equine life said:
Thank you and I’m so so sorry for your loss- it is just heart wrenching. It makes me never want to buy another. Going down to the yard to see me other two has been so hard and I’m lucky that the girls have taken charge and so I went up last night and tonight to give a quick cuddle and it all I’ve been able to manage.

I hope both of ours have found each other in pony heaven- I’m sure the grass is much better up there than it is in England x
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I said on my post about him that I think the northern lights were caused by him galloping around the heavens like a lunatic, stirring up trouble. Your pony is probably trying to keep well out of his way as he flies by! But I think they probably both are enjoying a place with all the grass they can eat and no aches or pains to slow them down.
 
Goldenstar said:
I have seen three very difficult PTS by injection the first was totally traumatic by childhood horse it was terrible .
The second was up and over backwards and as was the third .
H went by injection it was very gentle , sedation a little more sedation then the nasty stuff and he just sank to the ground I left at that point .
It’s a risk with injections I have seen loads of Pts , both ways I would chose shooting every time .
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BBP said:
I’m so sorry OP. Both for your loss and for what you had to experience. I can’t even imagine what you are going through.

My vet told me that if their cardiovascular system is compromised such as through heart disease it can take them longer to respond to the medication. The drug given after the sedative is a major overdose of anaesthetic. It causes a loss of consciousness first by shutting down the cerebral cortex and then as the overdose effect hits rather than just an anaesthetic effect it will shut down the respiratory system and then cause cardiac arrest and death (if I am wrong I hope someone will correct me). In some cases a second dose is required e.g if the circulation is sluggish or sedation has caused a drop in blood pressure as the drug has to travel through the vein back to the heart and on to the brain. So like at a hospital you can have anaesthetic but your heart is still beating, you don’t feel anything, your consciousness has gone. I would hazard a guess that your lovely pony’s circulation was poor so she didn’t get the full ‘hit’ of anaesthetic immediately but slowly and so the vet had to push more through to get the right effect. But because her neurological system was starting to shut down it was sending all sorts of weird signals to her body, without her conscious mind giving it permission. We had similar with an elderly cat needed a second dose and took probably 10mins, but the vet assured me that it was all unconscious rather than conscious movement. In human lethal injections it can take 10 minutes for the subject to finally pass away, but loss of consciousness should be immediate.

Your vet leaving whilst there was still a blink reflex and heartbeat was horrendous of them.

I don’t know whether I should write the next bit as I’m not sure if it will be helpful or not, but for me it helps me to sometimes remind themselves of what death is like in the wild. It isn’t peaceful or dignified, it is often brutal and prolonged, with no anaesthetic or sedative. Even what happened to your pony whilst appearing horrific for you would have been merciful compared to what a wild horse would have to endure. I am sure she wouldn’t have felt any pain or had awareness. You did what was right for her, especially if her cardiovascular system was poor.

Please look after yourself and make sure you have people with you at your uni that you can really turn to. The BHS Friends at the End can also support you.
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So sorry, I hit buttons with arthritic fingers.
 
I’m truly horrified on your behalf that the vet didn’t make sure there was no heartbeat before he left. That’s pretty basic stuff. If it were me I’d be sending a strongly worded letter to the practice manager. Of course sometimes things do happen, but by not checking that vet just made things a whole lot worse and was negligent imo (as well as leaving the drugs behind).
 
meleeka said:
I’m truly horrified on your behalf that the vet didn’t make sure there was no heartbeat before he left. That’s pretty basic stuff. If it were me I’d be sending a strongly worded letter to the practice manager. Of course sometimes things do happen, but by not checking that vet just made things a whole lot worse and was negligent imo (as well as leaving the drugs behind).
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Very strongly worded email written by grandad sent last night. And we won’t be paying a penny (excuse the pun - that’s her name!!) for the service as I also agree it was complete negligence. X
 
Clodagh said:
I’m not sure that this is the thread for alternatives.
No I’m not forum God , just being thoughtful.
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I agree. The OP must have found it very difficult writing the post in the first place. The last thing that's needed is people giving their opinion on forms of euthanasia. OP - you had a really tough call there. I've had a couple of horses put to sleep and other animals and it is the worst thing that you have to do for them but also the best. I'm sure your pony wasn't aware what was happening and had 'moved on' long before her heart stopped. In the old days we had actual photo albums of our animals and maybe making one of those with lots of very positive pictures of your pony would help you to forget her last moments.
 
So sorry OP. She wouldn't have known what was happening and I know I'm saying the impossible but you have to try and remember her prior to this. I had one difficult pts, not like yours but not great and i found even that hard to deal with. I wouldn't look at photos of him for ages after because i felt so guilty.
Really though, you gave her a lovely life and made the decision so she didn't suffer, so you have nothing at all to feel bad about.
 
So sorry. I had something like this happen many years ago now to a very much loved horse. Its awful and it will stay with you. I wish I had made more of a fuss to vets over it to be honest because it was botched. All you can do now is try to remember the good times not the bad end. Do something positive like plant a tree in her memory or something. Make a memory box or make a donation to a horse charity in her name. Something positive to mark her life. I doubt she knew what was happening but its not a nice last memory I know.
 
I am so sorry you had such an awful experience OP, hopefully the memory will start to fade soon and leave you with all the good memories you have instead.

Whilst things like this can happen with any method of PTS they are in the minority. They are awful when they do happen, but it is more likely that the process will go relatively smoothly.

Once the horse has had the sedation it will have very little or no sense of what is happening to it or what it is doing. I had sedation for an invasive hospital procedure and apparently spent most of the time violently trying to fight the staff off and escape (which is not how I would behave when not drugged!), but I came round with absolutely no memory of what happened whilst sedated. It is similar to people sleepwalking, they can physically do all sort of things but have no awareness of what they are doing, so no memory of it afterwards.

It might help if you think of the body being like a machine, and turning the mind off doesn't shut the machine down. It will have been far more traumatic for you than the horse, the horse's body was just confused by the effects of the drug and reacting in different ways, but the horse's mind was sedated and therefore unaware.

You have been brave and done the right thing for the horse by not prolonging life when it wasn't in the best interests of the horse. It is very unfortunate that you had to witness your horse reacting like that to the sedation, but you have done nothing wrong and have been a good owner. I hope that you feel better as time passes.
 
OP, first off massive hugs. In time those memories will fade a little, try to focus on the many happy memories whilst she was alive. As others have said, she had that much sedation in her she wouldn't been in pain. Time is a great healer, and now whilst your heart is breaking as everything is so raw, take comfort in that you did the right thing in making the decision to let her go at the right time.
 
ycbm said:
I'm so sorry, I have had one similar experience when a horse got up after dropping. I have to be honest here and say this will never leave you.

But you MUST understand that this is not your fault, that you did nothing wrong, that you made the right decision, that it was probably the fact that she was so ill that made the drugs inefficient and console yourself with believing that she will have known little of what was going on, and nothing after she was down and not getting up.

Please be gentle with yourself.
.
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Agree with what ycbm said. I can imagine how painful this was / is for you, but please don't blame yourself. Just you being there would have been a comfort for her. Be kind tp yourself.
 
My equine life said:
My very elderly 11hh pony was pts yesturday with the injection as she’d gone very wobbly in the back end- neurological we think and the situation has traumatised me.

She was given sedation first (I didn’t think she was that sleepy)

Then a clear syringe which took her ages to go down after which she got back up. He followed back up with 3 more yellow syringes

We had flipping over, trying to get back up and all sorts and I am severely traumatised.

He then left when he thought she’d gone but we felt a heart beat and blinking.

I sat with her till the vet got back and told her to let go and she did just as he was arriving but he put some more straught into her heart to be sure.

I think my main questions are what solutions was she administered and was this a really stressful painful situation or was she fairly unaware of what was going on. I feel like she lost all trust in me in those final moments and must hate me- I’m severely traumatised.

Someone please help
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I just wanted to say how sorry I am. I suspect you may relive aspects of this overtime ( my last one was horrible and did gymnastics in the air- first timecwuth an injection) but if you talk to someone you will be able to use techniques to ensure that whilst you still replay it, you won't be traumatised.
You have nothing to blame yourself for. Be kind to yourself and please take care and take time to grieve.
 
I'm so sorry you are going through this. Having a horse pts is traumatic. I lost my old mare at new year. She was my best friend and I don't think I'll ever get over her final moments. I feel like I let her down completely. She was put to sleep at the vet hospital but they took her to another box to do it. I could tell the minute I took her out stable she thought she was coming home and I'll never forgive myself for not doing that. She put all her trust in me and I let her down in her final moments. It traumatises me. I should have brought her home. My mare didn't get back up or anything like yours but the whole experience is horrific and sadly I have 3 others so will have to go through it again at some point.
 
Sending hugs, it sounds really hard to witness, I'm sorry.

I don't know if this helps, but I have a uni friend who is a zoo keeper and once had to be present at PTS for a zebra. Obviously there is a bit less information on zebra than horses, and it was also an emergency situation due to colic, the zebra unfortunately tried to rise multiple times and then did involuntary movements etc on the floor, I believe it lasted quite a long time, and was not at all nice to witness. My friend was told that although it was distressing to watch, the amount of drugs involved meant the zebra was pain free and acting purely on instinct, it wouldn't have been feeling distress or conscious thoughts. All the things you describe could be reflexes, and I don't think your pony would have felt any pain.

If it is any comfort, at least their suffering is over now.

Be kind to yourself if you can- do some nice self care things, buy some nice food, have a glass of nice wine if that's your thing, maybe have a bath with some nice bath stuff and candles (again if that's your thing), you've been through something really traumatic and you do need to look after yourself.

A lot of unis have really good mental health support these days, so do also consider talking to someone about it and accessing this service.
 
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